Your room is a little on the small side for huge fullrange dipoles, or I would suggest that route. Still, could be a couple that will "mostly work"...(they lack only the deepest bass). These go against the side walls, with the slots facing each other. (you can add a single large sub, or a couple of small subs). http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?spkrplan&1233281376&/Beveridge-Model-3PS....I don't know the seller Dave |
Well, if you are going to build a larger, and dedicated sound room, that changes things greatly.
I would build a room at least 16'-20' wide. IMO, anything less is a compromise.
I would also go with double wall construction...lots of bass trapping behind the outer walls.
I would also give the ceiling lots of thought, depending on what type you have to go with?
In a well constructed larger room, you have lots of component/speaker choices at your price level.
Large "fullrange" dipoles would be (my) first choice...(a fresh pair of Apogee fullrage maybe?)
A well designed horn system would be very, very nice (take a look at some of the "Classic Reproductions" systems.)
And of course the "active" ATC's mentioned by Shadorne would be a top choice.
The Beveridge speakers I mentioned above would work fine in the room you are in now (they will play plenty loud in that room)...but they would not be my pick, for large room reproduction.
Dave |
Good points Newbee.
I was at a friends home a while back...checking out his basement refinish job. I had my grand daughter with me, and she spotted his drum set at one end of the room.
She asked him to play them...so he did (he is very good!) That said...the first 15 seconds or so, were more than enough for me.
Dave |
Simply moving the speakers another 2ft or so forward, and adding a couple of small subwoofers, behind, or just forward of the main speakers would probably get the poster, a large step within his goal in that room.
Plenty of small subs will do 30hz with ease, and thats all you really need for piano to sound very nice.
Dave |
Detlof
I have 4 subwoofers, 2 fullrange speaker systems, and 40 years experience.
I hope that doesn't sound like bragging?...but I wasn't using theory in my post.
Dave |
Plaser
My suggestions relate to the room you are in now, and the components you are using now...and not the room you are going to build (which I know nothing about).
I also don't know when you plan on moving to your new home. The intent is to get you some passable results in the nearer term (I am also assuming you like your speakers for the most part, I think you said you did?).
What you probably don't like (regarding piano recordings) is the missing heft, of the lower notes, that the piano is producing, but your speakers are not reproducing (because they can't).
Like many audiophiles I have several speaker systems, two fullrange systems, and three less than fullrange speaker systems.
I like them all, and I also play a lot of piano music (we probably all do). That said, the piano sounds more real, and much better overall, on the two fullrange systems. The answer for that is simple...the fullrange systems paint a better picture, or at least...a better copy of the original picture, than the smaller speakers are able. No rocket science involved.
I suggested 30hz, and small subwoofers based on your room...and what looks to be, limited placement options in that room.
I would not buy any components for your new home, until well after the move in. because you will need lots of time to think things out, unless you like doing everything twice (-:
When I retired around 8 years ago, I built a fairly large dedicated room (my son helped me), and it took us around 6 months... (4 months of thought, and two months of work).
I can tell you that it was well worth it.
Good luck,
Dave |
Detlof
No, you didn't step on my toes at all, no problem (we are all trying to help, and usually with somewhat limited info)...I guess I just don't find subwoofers, that complicated an animal to tame.
Dave |
Plaser
Subwoofers were around long before home theater made them popular to the masses.
Rel, Martin Logan, Audio Concepts Inc, Sunfire....lots of others make, or have made smaller subwoofers. I have to be honest...my subwoofers are huge. (but my room is larger)
The ACI subwoofers are very nice, the Rel subs are well liked here at this forum...and the little Martin Logan Dynamo is well reviewed. (I like the ACI subs, but I haven't heard the others?)
Of course, if you want a wood finish to match your mains...you will need to do some research.
I would buy some room correction hardware, it will help make integration with the mains a breeze.
Dave |
Newbee
Thats pretty much what I was thinking, I would be inclined to think that a pair of small subs placed on the side walls, just in front of the mains, could work well in that room?
30hz is plenty deep for piano...and that could be filtered a few db's if need be? I'm sure listening levels aren't over 75-85db's.
A pair of Martin Logan Dynamo are around $700 used, easy to sell when Plasers moves to his new home.
Of course I can't tell how deep the room is from the pic's...I was guessing 14-16ft?....and not a cube.
Dave |
Shadorne
I agree with you:
"You guys are on to something - how to make a grand piano sound real in a room that is not big enough for a grand piano. It seems we all missed the obvious...it just ain't possible. The room is a good 50% of what you hear..."
And my opinion:
A large slice of something good, is still very good...even if it leaves you wanting the whole pie.
30hz or so, while not the whole pie, would still be quite filling.
I know that in my room, listening to piano with one speaker system or the other (-3db@17hz) or (-3db@27hz)...there is not enough bass difference to even bother with.
The only difference between the two speaker systems is sound quality, one system being a large multi-cone type, and the other, a large planer. (I prefer dipole bass for music).
Dave |
