kosst_amogan
@geoffkait
They got the memo about that snake oil silliness. It’s pinned to the break room bulletin board for everyone to laugh at next to the a print out of your website.
Nobody who designs any electronic device for any use or purpose considers the snake oil you mentioned because it makes no difference.
>>>>I certainly have no explanation for such back-sliding retro behavior on your parts. Oh, well, live and let die.
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Better add burn-in to the list of things amp designers didn’t get the memo about. Along with fuses, fuse and wire direction, vibration isolation, power cords, power cord directionality. Yes, I know what you’re thinking, their designs are so good they’re immune to things like that. 😀
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Me, too, ramtubes, hope you feel better. Get well soon! 🤗
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If they don’t believe in fuses, power cords or wire directionality who needs em? End of story. Call it Old School or stick in the mud, whatever. You’re a lot better at name dropping than I am, so you get A+ for that. 🤗
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ramtubes
I make tube amps. I cycle and burn them in for 24 hours but only to catch the infant mortalities, which I do. If burnin of electronics was real why wasnt it "discovered" in the 1950’s?
>>>>Oh, there’s the problem! Amp manufacturer. Problem solved! 🤗
If black holes were real why weren’t they discovered in the 1950’s?
If gravity waves were real why weren’t they discovered in the 1950’s?
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We’ve already covered that. Snooze, you lose. The break in of speakers, cables, capacitors, etc. is a physical, a mechanical phenomenon. It manifests itself electrically, as fate would have it. Try to keep up with the discussion. |
How many watts through headphone cables? One watt or less? How many watts through interconnects? My guess 1/2 watt. Preamp internal wiring? My guess .01 watt. How about tonearm wires? 0.01 watt? Who knows? |
Huh? That doesn’t make sense even as a joke.
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How many watts through speaker cables normally? How many watts through interconnects? |
Break in explained! Not for the squeamish. From Alan Kafton’s web site for his Cable Cooker, Cable break-in occurs as current flows through the conductors of wiring components. Dielectric stress from voltage differences between conductors also contributes. It takes many hours of in-system use for wiring components to break in, primarily because audio/video signals from normal program material are so low-level. Consider an interconnect from pre-amplifier to power amplifier. The maximum signal level for full power output of the average power amplifier is 2 volts peak, and the average signal is much less. Typical input impedance of a power amplifier is 10 kohms at the low end for consumer gear; 47 to 100 kohms is typical for a solid-state amplifier, while several hundred kohms impedance is not unusual for a tube power amplifier. Taking the best-case values from the above, the maximum current seen is 2 Volts/10k ohms, or 200 micro-amperes. This would not be continuous current, because the voltage value is peak, not rms. One can calculate a "use value" from the above equation multiplied by the total time this current flows. Let's call that the Current Time Value (CTV). Playing an interconnect cable in an audio system for one week (168 hours) of continuous use would expose it to the following CTV: 168 hours x 0.0002 amperes = CTV of 0.0336. The CABLE COOKER produces signal levels far higher than those seen in normal audio/video system use. The Cooker's sweeping square wave oscillator drives a high-efficiency "H" bridge MOSFET switching circuit. The output signal is a square wave from below 100Hz to above 16 kHz, plus harmonics. Output voltage is 12 volts rms. The measured current flowing through the interconnect is 120 milli-amperes. Installing an interconnect on the Cooker for one week results in a CTV of 168 hours x 0.12 Amperes = CTV of 20.16. This is a value 600 times greater than under the most ideal audio system conditions. The "stress" on the dielectric is also much higher due to the higher output voltage. Results with the Cooker are typically audible after less than a day. The same signal also feeds the speaker cable binding posts. The load at the speaker cable inputs draws a continuous 1.88 amperes of current through the wire. With a potential of 12 volts, this is equivalent to a continuous signal level in excess of 22 watts rms. This continuous signal level played through loudspeakers in a home environment would be unbearably loud. Put simply, there is no way for conventional in-system playback burn-in to approach the intensity and efficiency of the Cooker. |
This just in! From the Cable Cooker review somewhere in cyberspace (Enjoy the Music) “But now that may change. The first rays of a new cable-evaluating dawn are piercing my personal darkness. The audiodharma CABLE COOKER, developed and marketed by the enterprising Alan Kafton at Audio Excellence Az, is designed to maximize the sound quality of power, loudspeaker and interconnect (including A/V and phono) cabling by going far beyond the "normal" break-in that comes from using the cables in a system. Kafton asserts, for example, that giving an interconnect a single day's burn-in on the CABLE COOKER equals a week or more of continuous system operation. He says that any kind of cable breaks in more thoroughly on a Cooker because of exposure to extreme signal levels and a special waveform that does not occur in normal system operation. The cooker's burn-in circuit supplies >1 watt for interconnects and 22 watts for speaker and power cabling, while generating a dynamic extended-frequency sweep.” |
Measure away, guys. Oh, I get it, you’re waiting for someone else to measure it. Lol
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Cryogenic treatment is a mechanical i.e., physical change. Breaking in the dielectric of a cable is a mechanical i.e., physical change. Silver vs copper result in electrical differences but the material differences are - you guessed it! - physical. Atoms and electrons are physical things - even the signal consists of physical things - photons.
pick ‘em off at the pass. 🤠 |
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Hey, Doc, is this the guy you’re backing? You sure about that, Doc? Well, I hate to judge before all the facts are in but I wouldn’t get behind him 100%, if ya know what I mean.
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Isn’t it pretty to think so? Look, even IF one manufacturer comes to the show with a completely broken-in component, a speaker or amp or whatever, which they actually don’t because they want to show their latest model, and one that’s not all banged up, they cannot necessarily control who else they exhibit with, you know, the guy who provides cables, the guy who brings the Turntable, the guy who brings the CD player, power cord, etc. They aren’t that coordinated, trust me. The best laid plans of mice and men oft go awry. 🐀 |
Uh, nobody said it’s not mechanical. Hel-loo! Wake up and smell the Java! ☕️
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Did you perform surgery on your own brain, Doc? |
It looks like I have to be the one to say it. Nothing sounds good out of the box. That’s why when you go to the audio shows the first day everything sounds dreadful. Really bad. That’s because everything is brand new out of the box. Hel-loo! If I can be so bold most every system I done hear’d sounds pretty bad and generic to me, some worse than others. Could it be they never broke in completely? Who knows? |
Attention! The Fasten Seat Belts sign just came on. 🔛 |
They’re not fat! They’re chunky.
Volume is required to obtain sufficiently high voltage and current. Otherwise cables never break in. Duh! |
The XLO Test CD with burn in track suggests playing the system loud and continuously for a week or two. Use blankets or jeans over speakers to mute the sound. Otherwise, you know....🤪
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