How does Berning ZH270 compare to Cary Cad211 AE ?

I can safely say the Berning is more than up to par with any of the Cary products I've listened to. While I haven't heard this particular amp there is a general sound to Cary that is enamouring, full, rich, voluptous, large stage. I always found their amps a bit lacking in extension at the frequency extremes. Certainly a taste issue.

The Berning is a much different animal. It doesn't have that palpable midrange to the extent that SET amps do but to my ears seems more natural, a taste issue more than anything else. Where it excels is in top to bottom performance. Lovely extended highs and deep controlled bass with an effortlessness in complex musical passages that never unravels.

If your question is pertaining to noise and nothing else, please disregard the above, I wouldn't want to give an opinion that is unsolicited! :) Seriously think of it from this perspective, the Berning has no power transformer, it uses an advanced switching power supply and it also has no output transformer. The sum total is about the quietest tube amp I've encountered. The only noise is the rush of the power tubes when you put your ear next to the speaker. Hope this helps but I expect anything I say will not measure up to the suprise in store for you on first listen.

Enjoy!

One more thing, I would be a bit suspect in your choice of cabling with the Merlins, this would be more of an issue than either of the amps. I have tried this cable with my VSM-M and the high frequencies were too overemphasised bordering on etchy. This combo threw the sound out of balance. It could be easy to blame the amp for this. The Berning might highlight this more than the Cary would.

Nr9

The 2 cables you list are 2 I would highly recommend. I have owned the Au24 speaker cables and have a pair of GR ic's on hand. I am currently using all Stereovox, 600 sei ic's and Stereovox Studio speaker cables. The Studio's are all copper the 600 sei's use silver but have none of the characteristic artifacts that I have heard with other silver cables and the VSM. The highs are exquisite and highlight what the Merlin's are capable of doing.

The Joule is a gem of an amp but the Berning is as well. Having spent a good deal of time with both my assessment is I would love to have both! They do different things. The thing to remember about the Berning is that the term "lean" can be misleading. There are several things that can be done as Musicpre notes including swapping different tubes, wire and cap upgrades. I would never call the Berning lean but when compared to the Joule which is really luscious it might appear that way. Also Joule is quite a step above the Cary products since you get that palpable midrange along with great high frequency extension and air, really notable on massed voices. It is one seductive amp. The downside is that it runs very warm as do all OTL's.

"Maybe ZH270 together with MX will change my cable opinion. Any comments?"

My guess from my 6 years experience with the VSM is that the Berning will not offer more forgiveness which is what you are looking for Nr9. To the contrary I think it will reveal the imbalance of the silver cables with the VSM to a greater degree than the Cary. It is an extremely transparent amplifier. As stated in an above post, I have experimented with numerous silver cables and the problem is the upper frequencies become overemphasized and render a leaness to the presentation. The Merlins are, as well, so resolving that this can become a real issue, especially if you are very sensitive to it. The only silver cable in my experience, and its not pure silver, is the Stereovox which doesnt' do this. It offers body, transparency and control with high frequency extension and air without any undo emphasis. I really love the organic wholeness and balance that this cable presents. I have listened to other silver cables which subjectively offer greater bass impact.

I agree, copper cables certainly don't offer the transparency of silver but many do work with Merlins better, at least to my ears. Silver cables I have tried include the following

Blue Marble - ics and speaker
Harmonic Tech Silway -ics
Nordost Vahalla - ics
Stealth Beta - ic's(these were definitely the most transparent of the bunch and conversely the most amusical with the VSM. They were unlistenable after 5 minutes. I had 3 pair on hand. Each added pair made the sound worse)
a few others over the years but the results were the same.

Before you do anything, you might want to listen first with the different feedback settings per Musicpre's suggestion but I am fairly certain you will come to the conclusion that Vahallas and Merlins most likely won't like each other and neither of the amps will have much say about it. I don't know anyone using this combo.

It the problem continues and you want to maintain the transparency of the Vahallas, I would STRONGLY suggest trying Stereovox, especially the 600 sei mk2's and you might want to try their reference speaker cable which I
haven't tried in my system, I'm afraid I'll like it too much and be compelled to buy. I am using the Studio which is a copper cable. The price has come down from the strastophere on these cables to more realistic levels. I wonder what my wife would say about that comment? ;^)

Good Luck and keep us posted on your results

I hear ya Tom. So where is that car for everyman? You gotta have at least 2.

Nr9 -you got my choice. As Allan Bhagan told me before listening the first time, it's like crack, it you don't plan on getting hooked don't try it. It worked out that way for me. So far as bass weight, that is more of an issue with speaker cables than ic's and I'm still with copper for now. I heard the Stereovox reference speaker cables once at Montreal last year and there was absolutely no issue with the bass in that system.

I think the issue isn't the highly resolving nature of the products in question as much as the Esotar tweeter in the implementation Bobby has it. I'm sure the Vahallas may work quite well with other higly resolving speakers just not Merlins.

What might lend greater insight to this discussion is musical preferences. For midrangy acoustical, female vocal music which seems to be the darling of audiophiles and most of the show demos I've been to, SET's and low powered tube amps would be a great choice. But what if one is attempting to recreate large scale vocal, orchestral and piano music with its fast dynamic swings? Isn't this a main criteria of "musicality"?

I've heard what the Berning is capable of at Montreal last year driving Verity Parsifals and I must say as far as musical realism and natural dynamics is concerned, it was quite remarkable. Nothing at the show touched it to my ears. The Verity folks had 2 other rooms with their Ovation and Sarastro models and were stunned as well. I think it had a LOT to do with everything in that system, least being Allan Bhagan's remarkable protype Berning amp and pre-amp. To my ears I haven't heard better and only a few as memorable. The rest of the system consisted of Stillpoint stands, cones and all Stereovox cabling and the Audio Aero Capitol Mk2

The range of music was full orchestral to organ recordings to vocals which displayed the type of dynamic shadings one might hear in a live performance. Tonality and timbre reproduction were 2nd to none. There was no gravy, all music sounded as you would expect a performance would without anything additive. But these are my preferences to give guidance to where I'm coming from. SET's and low powered tube amps are great for certain types of music, or do we eventually end up listening to the type of music that accomodates the addictive sound we hear with these amps?

The Berning is indeed like a microscope but it seems a bit over the top to say it isn't musical if musical is to mean the same as musical realism. My guess is that there are probably other issues with the system, at least that is my experience. I have owned the amp for 4 years and have compared it head to head with many amps out with the Joule being the only real temptation with Merlin speakers. There are more than a few that could own any amp they want and own the Berning out of choice not pricepoint.

This hobby is for sure a matter of taste.