How do Newforms sound?

What a stupid post:

"I'm not much given to relying on opinions from owners' groups--they have a vested interest in liking what they bought."

I own 645's and my experience is just the opposite of Travis'.

They are one of the best speakers I have ever heard at any price, and I can assure you, I can afford whatever I want. I wouldn't possibly keep these speakers if they weren't great and your attitude toward the Yahoo group is condescending. There are many audiophiles there who own a lot of high-end equipment. Maybe you should hang out there a while and make your mind up based on experience rather than pre-conceived notions.

My first response, "this post is stupid", was not directed at Will's first post. It was directed at Will's second post.

"I'm not much given to relying on opinions from owners' groups--they have a vested interest in liking what they bought."

Yes, owners do have a vested interest, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they will have a "favorable" bias toward what they own. If that statement were true, there would be very few used speakers on the market. Many of the speakers that are sold "used" are sold because the owner is unhappy with some aspect of the speaker.

There is probably no better group of people to ask about any product, audio or otherwise, than owners. I had rather have feedback from someone who has lived with equipment over time rather than from someone who has only demo-ed speakers in an audio shop or simply heard them at a friends house. One should also be smart enough to temper both the raves and rants with a healthy dose of skepticism, regardless of the source.

And Will, you completely misinterpreted my remark about being able to afford any speaker I want. It was not to make a point about my affluence, but it was rather to say that I felt so strongly about this "bargain" speaker, that I didn't care how much it cost. IMHO, it is one of the best sounding speakers out there at any price. My endorsement of the 645's wouldn't be as significant, if for example, I could only afford speakers that cost $2,500 or less. The fact that I can afford speakers that cost significantly more, and I still chose Newforms, is theoretically a more significant endorsement.

And your remark:

"And the opinions offered on sites like audioreview often lack weight and expertise."

simply smacks of arrogance.

Certainly there is a percentage of neophytes at AudioReview, but you will find them here too. The way to evaluate reviews at AudioReview, in my opinion, is to look at the reviewers associated equipment, as well as what equipment they have previously owned. Weigh these factors with a good dose of skepticism and you might just learn something from these "lightweights". I can assure you that many to the posters at AudioReview have equipment and expertise that would make you envious.

Both Audiogon and AudioReview have their place. I, too, often find Audiogon more useful than AudioReview, but to foster such snobbery about AudioReview or any other board is simply ridiculous.

Take AudioReview for what it is, just another source of information, nothing more - nothing less.

My experience with the 645's is the exact opposite of Travis'. Not having heard his Newforms in his room with his associated equipment, I can't disagree with what he heard.

However, in my room, with my equipment, the 645's are simply phenomenal. The soundstage is as much as 30 ft. deep and wall-to-wall if the recording has the information on it. Imaging is rock solid and very precise. Probably the best imaging I have ever heard. The sweetspot is huge. I can sit directly in front of either speaker 10 ft. away and cannot hear the speaker. The imaging just becomes slightly off center.

The detail is fabulous. You can hear every stick hit cymbals, as well as the skin of drums when they are being struck. The only area that I would nitpick is that pianos don't always sound tonally accurate. But I think this could be atributed as much to my upstream components and to the recording itself as much as to the speakers. Plus, the piano is arguably the most difficult instrument for any speaker to reproduce. I have just ordered a Supratek pre-amp and I am very curious how this may affect tonal accuracy.

I did experience some "phasey-ness" early in the break-in period and also when I experimented with positioning the speakers. In my experience, room interactions were the culprit for the phasey-ness after the break-in period.

As far as tilting the speaker forward, I sit in a standardized chair and I certainly don't feel the need to tilt the speakers forward. When I stand up there is a frequency change, but I do not find it offensive. I usually stay fairly-well planted when I am listening anyway.

The thing that has bothered me more about every other speaker that I have heard is that if you move out of the narrow sweetspot, frequency changes occur and imaging just goes out the window. So I will trade the minor inconvenience of a frequency change when I stand up for the ability to sit virtually anywhere in the horizontal plane and still get an incredible soundstage.

The 645's are not perfect (what speakers are), but I truly believe that they are an incredible bargain.

(BTW, John Meyer is one of the greatest guys that I have had the pleasure of doing business with, audio or otherwise. I have never met him personally, but his customer service has been exceptional.)