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Have speakers really improved within the last 20 years??

Question:

  • If there is one measurement that would prove that speakers have indeed got better over the last 20 years, what would it be? 

I dont just want one example of a speaker from today that has a better measurement than another speaker from 20 years ago because that could just be a coincidence. I want to see IRREFUTABLE PROOF that most speakers today have a measured performance in at least one area that is better than most speakers 20 years ago.

When I look at a typical bookshelf speaker from 20 years ago versus one from today i see little difference. All i see is a wooden box, typically mdf with a pair of drivers in 'em. There would be a small crossover circuit inside and a bit of foam inside the box and that would be the end of the story. I would like to believe that speakers have gotten better but I see no reason to believe it. All I see is that speakers may have gotten brighter and brighter with time to dupe us into thinking we are hearing more detail. 

This challenge is open to any audiophile or speaker designer reading this.
kenjit

Showing 11 responses by kenjit

kenjit OP
1,771 posts
 
@djones51 In what way are they better?
kenjit OP
1,771 posts
 
One measurement can only measure one aspect. But there are near infinite aspects. No one of them can do what he asks.  
So in other words, the answer to my riddle is NO?


kenjit OP
1,771 posts
 
@djones51  I asked what you mean when you say FR has gotten better? what is your definition of better FR?
You're not looking at the right speakers.
Which ones have you looked at? Name them
your quest for the holy grail of speakers is for you to solve.
No its not. The holy grail of every audiophile is BETTER SOUND QUALITY. 
Every audiophile should be equally concerned about this.  If there is no proof that speakers are getting better then its nothing more than make believe and we are not making progress. What would be the point of that?
kenjit OP
1,771 posts
 
You asked for one measurement to prove if speakers have gotten better, in speakers that one would be the FR. You’ll have to do the testing to prove it,
yes and i asked you to explain how FR has gotten better?  I do not recall seeing any graphs of FR from speakers over the years showing that it has become more flat. What do you mean by better?
If you reread my original post, I said I wanted to see IRREFUTABLE PROOF of this. What proof has led you to this conclusion?
kenjit OP
1,771 posts
 
Why don't you prove to everyone else that they are not versus demanding that everyone else provide you proof.
Because I am not the one who wants audiophiles to be persuaded that progress is being made in speaker design and that speakers are getting better. Its the speaker industry and audiophile community that is responsible for that narrative. And as audiophiles it is our duty to challenge not only what the speaker industry wants us to believe but also to challenge our own beliefs and actions.

Speaker designs do not get better with time, by default unless progress is made. So there is no proof required of that. It is self evident UNLESS proven otherwise.
kenjit OP
1,771 posts
 
They are better because I say so, and since I am the only measurement and judgement that matters, this case is closed.
That is the wrong answer to my question. The challenge is to provide a measurement that proves that speakers have gotten better with time. Your opinion is NOT a measurement. I dont want opinions I want measurements. 
kenjit OP
1,771 posts
 
it’s on you to provide irrefutable proof that new speakers have not improved.
Why does it matter who the onus is on? We are all audiophiles that seek better sound so you should be just as concerned as I am to know if speakers have really improved. It doesnt matter whether you prove that they have improved or they havent, either way we will know whether speakers are a hoax. 

How do you propose it can be proven that speakers have not improved over the last twenty years? How do you even do that?
kenjit OP
1,771 posts
 

Thankfully, I never squandered my money on Green Mountain speakers to end up like you.

Whats wrong with them? They are highly regarded here on Audiogon


kenjit OP
1,771 posts
 

Better is in the eyes/ears of the beholder.

That is not true. A speaker has a job to do. Its job is to reproduce the signal going into it as perfectly as possible. If you put a 50hz sine wave into a speaker and it produces a 60hz and 70hz sine wave then the speaker is BAD and this has nothing to do with what your opinion of it might be.

kenjit OP
1,771 posts
 
 Since you’re the one in disbelief, show us that it’s not true.
I have the right to believe that speakers have not improved unless proven otherwise. Speakers do not improve by themselves without human intervention. There is no proof required to understand that. Its obviously true.

Speaker designers aspire to improve the sound quality over time. Most audiophiles like you believe this is happening. Proof that this is really happening is required. That is the difference you dont seem to understand.

I have set you a challenge. You cannot turn the tables on me. You either give up or you give me proof. This is non negotiable.

There are two parts to the challenge. You would need to show that

1.there is a measurement that has improved over the years

2. that this measurement proves that sound quality has improved.
kenjit OP
1,771 posts
 
@ptss  This is my challenge to you. You dont get to change the rules of the challenge. It is non negotiable. So you either admit defeat or you post evidence. What you are doing is trying to turn the tables on me because you are unable to solve my challenge. Your evasiveness does not impress me you are hereby dismissed from this discussion. 
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