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Gave up my SET----looking for moderate to higher power replacement options

I recently sold my JAS Array 2.1, which is a SET using 805 and 300B producing 45w.  With NOS RCA 805 and Sophia Princess 300B's, this amp produced the best sound I've ever had.  I used it to drive the satellite section of a pair of DIY/Legacy Focus clones using Eton drivers.  I've ran several different solid state amps on the bass drivers.  The inner detail and palpability of images were fantastic.  Images were life-sized and, frequently, sounded as if the musicians were in the room with me (not much of an exaggeration--honestly!)  And despite the modest power rating, this amp had startling dynamics.  It was an exciting and very engaging listen but.....well, aside from the amp breaking down on a few occasions, the cost of tubes and the extreme heat the amp put out,  the amp did run out of power when I pushed it too hard.  

I've tried several other amps during my time with the JAS, typically as warm weather substitutes, and a few more since I sold it but I really am mostly disappointed.  Presently I have an Audiozone Amp1 running the satellite section and a Jaton AV5140 on the woofers.  I was biamping with the Jaton but wanted a bit more detail and transparency.  The Audiozone is better than the Jaton in this regard but still falls rather short of the standard set by the JAS  and also runs out of power occasionally and sounds just awful when it clips.  I have an Audio Alchemy DPA 1 and had the Wyred4Sound ST-500 when it first came out and neither are what I'm looking for in my main system.  The AA amp is better but still a far cry from the sonics of the SET JAS.  Do any of the Class D amps truly approach SET sonics?    I'm considering the Gamut D200 mk iii as well though these are hard to find.   Are there any Class D amps I should look in to?  I really need to keep it at $3000 or less and probably around $2000.  Please make recommendations based on actual experience, that is only on amps you've actually heard.  Thanks!
lcherepkai

Showing 16 responses by charles1dad

charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
@luisma31, 
Thank you, I appreciate your very kind comments. 
Your Atma-Sphere  MA-1 mono blocks will serve you excellently. 
Charles 
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
Cal,
Excellent perspective.  The primary issue with those who consider themselves "Objective " is their stubbornness and dismissive attitude toward those who simple trust what they hear. Condescendingly retorts  "It's all in your head" . I firmly believe that humans hear things that at this point in time science is unable to measure.

The belief that if you cannot verify with some "objective" measure then it doesn't exist is very narrow minded. Ironic as science is all about being open minded and exploring uncharted territory. It's about solving the mysterious and incompletely understood phenomena. 
Charles 
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
@luisma31,
I'm an advocate for high quality SET amplifiers and can relate to @icherepkal and his wonderful listening experiences with his former SET amplifier.  However I have always been clear that proper speaker matching is mandatory to ensure a satisfying outcome. I was able to meet that requirement and as a result experience sonic joy for over 11 years with my 300b SET.

The Atma-Sphere MA-1 is an amplifier that I'm quite familiar with and can thoroughly understand your happiness with it. No question given its 140 watts there's far more flexibility in matching speakers and is simply more universal in application.  I see no reason why you won't enjoy the MA-1 for many years. 
Charles 
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
@icherepkal , you’re a victim of your own good taste 😊. The JAS audio SET established a very high sonic reference point. Tough for many amps to measure up to.
Charles
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
Hi cal,
Yes, as we all recall Al was excellent with his (Always) clearly written, detailed yet easy to comprehend technical explanations. Bridging amplifiers is but one of many examples where Al offered  clarification and when necessarily caution. I learned much from him.
Charles
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
I thought Halcro Audio is no longer an active manufacturer and I may be wrong in that regard.
Charles
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
As the late (And great) Al use to point out , when you bridge an amplifier the speaker impedance load (As seen by the amplifier) is halved. So a 4 ohm load becomes 2 ohms and so on.
Charles
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
I wouldn’t deny for a nanosecond that there are listeners who would love the Benchmark sonic presentation. Every audio component has a "sound" or individual signature. In the past I recall similar declarations about the defunct Halcro amplifiers. Dead on accuracy and sonic neutrality with breathtaking bench measurements.
Charles
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
@icherepkal,
I will 2nd your request of Ralph to identify these special SET sounding high NFB  class D amplifiers . I’m "genuinely" interested in who are the manufacturers capable of what I’d consider a very admirable feat. They deserve exposure and recognition. I can’t deny some may exist but I’ve yet to come across any thus far. Obviously I haven't heard every class D amplifier in existence. 
Charles
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
Ralph,
I understand that we humans hear the same in regard to neuro-acoustical physiology pathway or msechanism (Using higher order harmonics to gauge sound pressure and detecting harshness and brightness). I should have been more clear as I’m referring to individual taste/preferences IOW the subjective aspect.

You used the term "dry" and that describes how the 3 amplifiers I cited sound to me (Definitely a subjective judgement). Someone else may describe them as accurate and very neutral. This is the hearing/perceptive differences I was referring to.
Charles
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
@icherekpal,
If you have an opportunity to hear amplifiers the subscribe to the high negative feedback (NFB) application as explained by Ralph, would you please share your listening impressions of them?

I’ve heard the Benchmark, Mola Mola and Soulution amplifiers (Examples of High NFB circuits) no SET sonic characteristics in my opinion. I don’t deny that many listeners loves these particular amplifiers and in fact I could be in the minority.

Given your very happy listening experience with the JAS Audio SET I wonder what your take would be. I in no manner dispute Ralph’s technical explanation, rather just relating my listening experiences. There's absolutely no doubt that we all hear things differently. 
Charles
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
@icherekpal, 
Thank you for the kind comments. 
Charles 
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
A used Lyngdorf 2170 is available for less than 3K USD? That could quite possibly be the way to go. Definitely worth serious consideration at the price point. Excellent recommendation from Bill (brownsfan).
Charles
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
@icherekpal,
Okay I clearly understand your dilemma and why you’ve decided to move away from tube amplifiers. Less recurring cost and a gain in convenience and simplicity. I think you’ve spoiled your ears with the 805 SET😊.
If you find a class D amplifier that sonically comes close to the JAS Audio SET amplifier, please post and let us all know.of your successful acquisition. I wish you the best in your ongoing search. 
Charles
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
The AGD seems to be a very nice alternative amplifier choice but is well outside the stated budget of 3000.00 USD.
Charles 
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
@icherekpal,
You had a beautiful sounding amplifier, 300b driving 805 DHT output tubes. I don’t believe you’ll find a class D, SS or push pull tube amplifier that will match the "magic" (I appreciate your use of the term in this context) tactile realism and tone you miss from the JAS Array SET.

I do believe that you’ll find a very good sounding replacement amplifier that is overall a better match with you speakers. I get your point about replacement cost of the 300b and 805 tubes (Worth it in my opinion for the sound quality you received). If I were in your situation I'd keep the JAS and find more compatible speakers.
Best of luck,
Charles
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