First Foray into XLR


I know this is a topic like ‘oil’ or ‘tires’ on a car forum, but I have to ask...

Marantz AV8802a to Odyssey Stratos amp to Aerial 7T’s. Looking for advice on 1M XLR’s from pre/pro to power amp.

I’m skeptical of cables and snake oil claims, but I’m trying to be open minded. I’ve not used XLR before, so I’m not replacing anything, and not looking to spend a fortune, but would like input from others who’ve been where I am.

thanks
english210

Showing 5 responses by ieales

@english210 
‘what cables of either configuration would people here recommend to someone who’s sceptical but willing to try something more than freebie cables’?
Specific recommendations are next worthless as it is highly improbable that any other listener has your system in your room, listens to the same music at the same levels and has your ears and predilections. Each of the aforementioned will change how one perceives cable sonics.

Any particular cable may make some or no difference depending on the aforementioned parameters and the system in which it is installed.

I am a Grammy nominated recording engineer, built electronics for the industry, installed studios and been an audiophile for more than 60 years.

I put this together to help educate about the fallacy of a magic bullet in cables.  http://ielogical.com/Audio/CableSnakeOil.php

It's really unfortunate that there is so much that is just plain wrong. For example, almost all electronics are unbalanced internally. To use balanced cables, invented by the telephone company to send signal over very long distances and cancel common mode noise at the receiving end, one must add an additional stage on the output to balance and another stage on the input to unbalance. NOTHING is inaudible. Two additional stages will add coloration and masking. Kind of pointless for a 1m run.

Some balanced stages are 'capable' of driving unbalanced loads but can suffer audibly when asked to do so. Often one does as well driving an unbalanced load with just the +phase. Others tie -ve and 0v at the source, leaving the shield unterminated at the destination. Each piece can be unique and can be difficult to integrate. Studios like balanced because it minimizes the aforementioned problems when connection many tens of pieces of outboard gear to many tens of music channels for tens of thousands of possible combination. Home systems are trivial by comparison as they are largely static. 

Sadly, Hi End Audio has largely devolved into "If it don't go, chrome it." See Come Admire My Hi-Fi Jewelry Roger Skoff writes about what things cost, and why. 
http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/viewpoint/0618/HiFi_Jewelry.htm

As far as lifting the shield on balanced cables, either end is fine. Some prefer source and some prefer destination. In decades of exposure to both, no preference was discovered.

ANY and ALL cable auditions should be over a period of a week and 100% refundable. ALWAYS replug existing cables before auditioning new ones. New cables often have manufacturing 'goo' that takes several insertions to remove. Adding contact enhancers is not recommended. 
See http://ielogical.com/Audio/#CableQuest

Your ears and your system change continuously with environmental conditions. Make haste slowly. 99.99% of online audio is fan boy noise!

@almarg ++  one of the saner heads with solid recommendations

Why replug all cables in a system before auditioning new ones?  
To establish a baseline fresh connection. Unless a connection is gas tight, contaminants in the air can degrade the sound. 

Replugging should abrade these contaminants and restore fresh connections.

New connectors can have manufacturing 'goo' / lubricants, so it's always a good idea to polish well with a clean cloth before plugging into your gear.

DITTO fuse holders! and any other unsoldered internal connection e.g. crimped jumpers so popular today. Once the warranty is up, I solder them!
Switching the VAC to XLR was mind blowing. We switched back and forth...

Unless the output signal is verified within 0.1db across the whole spectrum, back and forth switching is rather pointless.

If the cables are not identical, then cable deltas could swamp the electronic.

Different connectors of the same type with identical cables can be audible.

Uncontrolled variables have been skewing results since time immemorial.
I don’t doubt differences were heard.

when compensating for volume
Since you adjusted volume, then you concur that matching volume has merit. Exactly how did you compensate?

With your logic, nothing is, or sounds, any different than anything else - it’s just a matter of volume
Not so. I did not say that. Never have, never will.

I’m not trying to be obtuse, but I’ve endured far too many "night and day" / "blows the doors off" claims only to find that levels were not matched and when they were, deltas diminished drastically.

No mention is made of the driving device.

The effects ascribed to the XLR input could be impedance mis-matching. The VAC Phi200 does not list bal/unbal impedances.

The Phi200 manual states there are switches for bal/unbal. What was the power setup and is there a possibility of a ground loop with the unbalanced that is mitigated in the balanced mode?

When properly implemented, there should be extremely little difference between balanced and unbalanced at home HiFi distances. I spent a couple of decades designing electronics [not power amps] and made sure there were none.
Another transgression is to have vastly different impedances on the UnBal vs Bal inputs.

Unless one can, or bothers to obtain and, read a schematic, making evaluations between the two may be specious.