Entreq and Innuos?

I also own a Entreq Silver Tellus grounding box along with a few others that I DIY versions. And I also have a Russ Andrews unit for chassis grounding.

There is something to getting rid of the grounding noise that resides in the AC, chassis and signal sources. The music is purer.

ozzy

This is a timely topic for me.  I have my three Innuos boxes (network switch, streamer/server, USB reclocker) plugged into my Torus RM20 which is plugged into a dedicated 20A circuit.  My Diablo 300 is plugged directly into a second dedicated 20A circuit.  However I found that when I instead connect the U

Innuos USB reclocker to a third shared household circuit, I get better bass and better dynamics, and a deeper soundstage.  My other Innuos boxes sound best plugged into the Torus.

I contacted Innuos and Nuno Vitorino responded.  His theory is that I have a grounding issue.  He said the USB reclocker does something the other Innuos boxes don’t do - it connects to both dedicated circuits via USB - the Innuos player and the Diablo DAC module.  He suggested trying a ground box.

I’ve never heard of the Entreq boxes.  Apologies for my ignorance but how do you connect them to the Innuos boxes when the Innuos boxes have not ground terminals?  My Torus and my Diablo both have ground terminals however.  

Ah, just realized these boxes are not what I thought they were. What I need is some sort of device to link my grounds of my two dedicated circuits.  But these Entrq boxes are also intriguing!

@nyev I have my Zenith and PhoenixUSB fed from my Isotek Sirius. The Sirius improves the sound for sure, but perhaps now a little too bright. Am I right in understanding that your system is better with the PhoenixUSB fed direct from the mains, while the others are best from the conditioner?

I’m tempted to try an earthing solution, but not sure how Entreq would work with the Phoenix as it doesn’t have any spare sockets. The Zenith is a better option.

To answer your question: Entreq with each earthing box supply a single connecting cable and a single plug, which you can select from a choice:  RCA, XLR, USB, RJ45 etc.  They claim that any one of these plugged into your unit will satisfactorily ground it.  So, we should be able to ground the Zenith by (eg) the Streamer RJ45 socket. 

I do wonder if taking an Entreq plug of some form, plugging it into a spare socket of my Zenith, then connecting it to a metal spike sunk into the ground would work. This is what, as far as I understand, the Entreq boxes simulate but without the risk. It should, I think, offer a preferable and benign route to ground for stray micro currents in the boxes, rather than the house’s protective ground.

@lollipopguild , yes you are right, my PhoenixUSB sounds best plugged directly into the wall on a circuit that is not used by any other gear. And the rest of my Innuos gear absolutely sounds best when connected to the Torus.

When the PhoenixUSB is plugged into the Torus, “bright” is one way to describe the effect but it wouldn’t fully describe what happens to the sound. Weight and bass goes away, the sound is smaller in scale, and there is less air around instruments and vocals. The midrange also is closer to you.

Interestingly my Zenith produces a more full and rich sound when connected to the Torus. Sound becomes thinner when connecting it to the wall.

Nuno at Innuos said ideally all my Innuos gear would be on one circuit. He could only speculate that the reason why the PhoenixUSB is behaving differently from the other devices is that it’s the only device that has connections to two different circuits with the two USB cables.

I told him I was concerned that while I currently have a workaround that sounds good, I was worried that this workaround wouldn’t be available for when I try the Pulsar network streamer which has a reclocker inside it.  I could only plug it in the Torus or the wall, and I wouldn’t have the ability to connect the player to the Torus and the reclocker to the wall like I currently do.  
 

Will try the demo Pulsar that Innuos is coordinating sending to my local HiFi shop and see…  

@nyev Is there any chance you could resurrect the chat with Nuno and ask him how the Phoenix could be grounded? 

Well, we had already talked about using grounding devices like the Nordost QCore.  He said he these have definitely made positive differences in people’s systems.  My issue with that approach is that I think it only makes sense if you don’t use a conditioner of any kind.  Otherwise you end up with distributors plugged into distributors (as the QCore is a distributor).

Also I don’t want to bug the guy too much, he’s got a company to run!  
 

As an aside I did just now try connecting a 14AWG wire between my Torus and my Gryphon amp, meaning all grounds should be bonded and common.  The negative effects of the PhoenixUSB plugged into the Torus still persisted.  That aside, I am not quite sure if I detected the slightest improvement with grit and firmness of the sound.  Could be my imagination, but I will leave the ground connection in place!

So I think my only hope is that the Pulsar demo that is incoming for some reason doesn’t have the same behaviour when connected to the Torus.  Otherwise I’ll be sticking with my current setup with the PhoenixUSB connected to the wall, which frankly I can happily live with.

I have all my gear going into the wall. With LessLoss Fire Wire 640X on each component. Except for my X200.  

@nyev Now that the Xmas break is over, I'm looking at this again.  

Russ Andrews offers a very affordable grounding solution.  Details are here.

I'll give it a go, starting off with the casework of my three Innuos and Hegel boxes.  As far as I can tell the casework screws on the Phoenix are already grounded, so assume the entire case is.  However, running a continuity test across the USB sockets' earth pins and the IEC earth pin produces a fail. The Zenith is grounded via the USB/Ethernet socket casings, plus the screw top centre at the case's rear.

Compare that to my Hegel H390, the continuity test passes when testing across the IEC earth pin and the outer casings of the BNC and RCA sockets, as well as the earth pin of the XLRs.

It's interesting that Russ Andrews advocates wiring his grounding box to a copper spike stuck in the ground. This is legal here in the UK. Obviously, it's not an alternative to the safety earthing of the system, which will remain in place.

@ozzy I've just noticed your mention of the Russ Andrews unit.  I have the RF Router mk2 on order, plus cabling.

Can I ask if you're using the basic cabling, or the Technical Ground Weave?  Also, have you connected the output cable to the mains earth, or an external ground rod?

Thanks very much.

I am using the Rus Andrews plug in router which uses the AC ground. I am using my own cabling.

ozzy