412 versus 420 on a ET 2.0 HP with a triple leaf spring.
Initial impressions.
The numbers from the printed manual.
412 /// 420
20 – 35khz /// 20 -45khz - Freq response
30 db at 1 khz /// 33db at 1khz Channel Separation
27db at 10khz /// 29db at 10khz
3.5 mv at 1 khz /// 3.2mV at 1khz Output voltage
STR /// Perfect STR Stylus
24 x 10(-6) /// 42 x 10(-6) Compliance
1.3 – 2.1g /// 1.0 – 2.0 Tracking Force
Compared to the Grey 420 the stoplight 412 looks like a model plane fighter engine/machine gun that is actually firing. Guaranteed to attract a little toddler if nearby for those with little kids around.
Again sounds pretty ridiculous for the price. How much do you guys think these things actually cost to make anyway? I am curious.
IMO - Its lacking that natural gusto aggressiveness and extension that its bigger brother the 420 has, that is also present on master tape dubs. Much more polite sounding especially in the very low bass – much like the Empire 4000 DIII.
Hardly any hours but it has too much happening (emphasis) in the midrange and upper bass for me to get comfortable with it on my modded Quad 57’s. Too much of good thing ? Very early but I am pulling up anchor and will try it somewhere else later.
A question for the cartridge experts. I would appreciate your expertise here.
What is the difference between STR and Perfect STR.
Specifically - How much bearing does this STR vs Perfect STR have on precise alignment and geometry of a tonearm ? I am curious.
My understanding is that the 420 has a very small footprint. Does that mean it requires more precision in alignment. I say this from my personal experience in trying to get it right on a couple of pivot arms previous to the ET2. |
Hello Chris, not an expert, but 33audio has an Acutex 3xx chart showing the actual size of each cartridge of the 3xx chart. This chart probably means nothing compared to the 4xx, but its all we have, and from there we only have speculation. The Acutex 415 seems on the literature to only have compliance difference's, but sounds nothing like the Acutex 420 according to Professor Timeltel, and he has never steered me wrong.
Your take on the Acutex 412 is like mine except the bass is strong like the 420. It has trouble with cymbals on my system. Mostly white noise. I never heard cymbal problems in music before, but someone mentioned it a while back and it has ruined a lot of good music for me, so maybe it is ok for others on there systems. |
Hi Danny Pictures of the Acutex 4 series can be seen here. Go down about 2/3 of the way down. http://www.lencoheaven.net/forum/index.php?topic=6675.45412 and 415 look like kissing cousins. 420 is very different. I wasn’t clear in my last post. The 412 has lots of strong bass. The issue was it was over emphasized bass above 40 hz unlike the 420 which is more linear (sic) in my room on the ET2. This is based on running the 15 IPS tape and LP together, the lp about 5 seconds behind, and switching between the two on the fly. Note that I was clear that this was a triple, not double leaf spring setup on an high pressure ET2 not a ET 2.5. ET 2.0 spindle resonates at a slighter higher HZ than the larger 2.5 which in my case now currently has the double leaf spring on it and my MC once more. The single leaf spring is just lying around these days. I should make up some more as they cost only $15 each. You can see the leaf spring hear. For a double, glue two together. Triple etc…. http://cgim.audiogon.com/i/vs/i/f/1335035482.jpgWe have Frogman to thank for this one. We are able to match the cartridge compliance at one end (cartridge) to the other end (counterweight) and use whichever leaf spring works best in our own systems. Think of it as two of almost same weight persons (cartridge end heavier) on an elongated teeter totter with springs on their bums. As an update - yesterday afternoon one 420str was air lifted, scheduled to arrive this week at its destination. Tallahassee, Florida. |
Addendum:
I have no doubt that if the ET2 manual ever got updated by Bruce, there would be a separate chapter on matching the tonearm with the compliance of the cartridge. Newly bought tonearms really should come with a single, double and triple leaf spring I beam.
Maybe they do ?
Both my ET2 tonearms were bought used. |
Great link Chris, I had forgotten about it. Definitive comparison of the Acutex 3xx and 4xx. |
Hey Guys, I've been quietly thinking of the next step in regards to my set-up with the Acutex. I've had several thoughts on it after re-reading your posts and thinking of how to better dress a wire loom. I still like my over the spindle option but have new thoughts on the support mechanism and wire/clips.
I want to implement the new support along with different cartridge clips first, so I can get proper cart set-up with my old wire loom, before building a completely new wire loom.
I also want to completely do away with the braid/shield I currently use. I'm thinking of a combo of silk/cotton tubing and/or teflon tubing as part of the support structure and vibration control scheme.
Any thoughts from you guys would be helpful. |
Slaw – fwiw - here are my thoughts on the ET2 loom so far for me. When this thread started I had many questions about the wire loom. The options seems daunting. I had mounted the arm multiple times on different TT setups and found the full plinths to always be the biggest PITA for this tonearm. On the old stock HW19MKIV and TNT the wire used to go down through a hole in the plinth ! What I have found personally since is that on an arm pod / pillar or tower, its good to get the “SMILE” half circle loop where the wire exits the arm. There seems to be minimal wire movement this way with this tonearm when leveled properly. I find with this half loop I can add enough blue tac to the counterweight to make the arm free float – then I can touch the wire in the loop around with my finger and the armtube does not move, regardless of its position over the record. So for a full plinth this setup is more difficult to do. Frogman has his set up this way. I hope he doesn’t mind me posting his pic again. With a smile :^) http://cgim.audiogon.com/i/vs/i/f/1337980360.jpgIf I ever put my ET2 arm on a full plinth again I would do something similar so the wires comes out of structure like a bridge pillar to form that half circle - smile. Now with an arm tower/pillar or armpod it can just hang off the end of the armtube to create that loop the other end connecting directly to the phono stage. It makes it really easy. Is there a better way ? Thoughts ? My looms are naked and I have no noise with MM and MC. I attribute that to the place I got them from and the fact the preamps are right next to the tonearms. BTW - If you want to know if your wire loom/TT/Preamp is up to par mount that 420str on a direct drive or idler where the motor is inches away from that cartridge. It will tell you right away if your setup is ok or has issues. Wires, TT motor related, other. Its a great test cartridge in this respect. Slaw - had a look at your virtual page setup – your loom seems to mimic the Kuzma Airline arm ? Up and over as you say. How is it working ? In the pic it looks more rigid this way ? I also saw the motor mount for your VPI table. Did you make that ? It looks gorgeous. The thread drive is working out well ? Cheers |
BTW - If you want to know if your wire loom/TT/Preamp is up to par mount that 420str on a direct drive or idler where the motor is inches away from that cartridge. It will tell you right away if your setup is ok or has issues. Wires, TT motor related, other. Its a great test cartridge in this respect. Interesting Chris....as I have also found the 420STR to act much like a LOMC on my Victor DD in its susceptibility to 'feedback' when the volume is turned up? This despite the fact that the phono stage gain is set to the low MM value which, incidentally displays no such 'feedback' with 'normal' MMs? Do you have any thoughts on why this should be the case with the 420STR? |
Ct0517, on my TransFi the "loom problem" is compounded by slightly thicker discretely shielded wires, and by the extra wires required for a balanced circuit. The feather-lite short wand is particularly vulnerable to fouling.
http://cgim.audiogon.com/i/vs/i/f/1284313864.jpg
The gantry grommet is about half way across the LP. The loom is dressed like an egg-beater. It expands and contracts as it moves, with the force vectors of the discrete wires approximately cancelling. |
Chris: I am in total agreement concerning the sonic gains you must be getting in having the armboard separate from the plinth. If my room were larger, I'd try the same thing. I do however have some new thoughts in mind for a new armboard (replacing the stock one) that could isolate the ET better. I am going to try this at some point when I get my other issues worked out.
I'm totally happy with the "up @ over", and I have no doubt that with the new mounting structure I'm thinking of (will not be mounted to the TT base @ and I'm going to try Frogman's recommendation of the AN wire), I'll be even happier. One drawback with my current support structure is not very much room to access the lever to pull the spindle back. My new one will be mounted to the Symposium base thereby having better access and less vibration.
BTW Chris, I liked the pic you provided us of the wire Take Five Audio built for you. I loved the attention that was paid to the gradual step down coming out of the WBTs. Was this accomplished with teflon tubing?
Thanks for the compliment on my motor enclosure. I built it myself. My second try at one. I really learned alot from my first try. It may not pass a WAF, but to me the beauty is in it's solid construction and how it performs. I'm still planning on using a bearing/pinch roller scheme something like Dgarretson uses, that to me will be killer when it is finished.
Once you try thread drive, there's no going back, IMO. |
Hi Henry – welcome to the thread. I will reply to your question with my actual DD and idler impressions later. Need to catch up with the holiday weekend that was anything but a holiday with two soon to be 18 years olds packed up and sent away to college. Now I wait for their phone calls. Damn... now I need to change their phone plans before I get dinged with huge bills. :^( Slaw I am in total agreement concerning the sonic gains you must be getting in having the armboard separate from the plinth. Correction – replace the word plinth with platter, motor, bearing The word plinth is one of those bad words – it has been corrupted by analog audiophiles - IMO. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlinthPlinth to me means common platform. All my TT’s have a plinth. How the tonearm, motor, and platter, bearing connect to this common platform varies. There are good designs and bad designs. I have personally found that a well executed- bad design, can out perform a badly executed - good design. DG - need to look at that tonearm some more. living /breathing egg beater ? |
Chris: I am referring to 'plinth' as does VPI when describing their tt designs, and as far as I know, most TT manufacturerers do. I have to say, the wiki link you provided seems to confirm the intent I initially meant. The plinth in my TT is 'the' platform you speak of. The armboard is connected to this 'plinth', (and becomes part of it) that supports the platter and bearing. |
Chris: I think I oversimplified my response to this now, I appologize.
Dgarretson: I looked again at your "egg beater" wire loom. Very interesting and "smart" execution. Question, Do the two 'outer strands' of your egg beater design, need to be slightly longer to acheive proper "force vector"? If so, does this have an effect on your balanced cable design? |
Slaw
The plinth in my TT is 'the' platform you speak of. The armboard is connected to this 'plinth', (and becomes part of it) that supports the platter and bearing. Here is some food for thought. I have found when comparing and listening to how the vibrations and resonances in this hobby affect the different sounds we get; that identifying “ground zero” aka the common base/plinth for all components in a turntable system (bearing/platter/spindle/motor/tonearm-cartridge) was important for me. Slaw – in your system pic - your motor/enclosure is not attached, or even on the same base as your VPI plinth - what this means to me ... Your VPI plinth is the plinth/base for only the platter/spindle/bearing and tonearm/cartridge. Your wall shelf is the plinth/base for the actual motor. Being a vibration/resonance hobby everything has an effect on your overall sound that we are getting so …. What is the overall turntable “system” common base/plinth that the overall sound is actually based on ? IMO 1) If all of your turntable parts were on one wall shelf your actual overall turntable system plinth would be that shelf. 2) If all of it was on two separate wall shelves then “The Wall” itself becomes the common base/plinth. 3) Still further based on your photo – if the motor is on the wall shelf and the remaining turntable parts on a floor rack - as it appears in your photo? , then both wall and floor factor in as a shared base/plinth for the turntable system, and how resonances and vibrations will affect the sound. Thoughts ? No more coffee for me this morning ... |
Interesting Chris....as I have also found the 420STR to act much like a LOMC on my Victor DD in its susceptibility to 'feedback' when the volume is turned up?
This despite the fact that the phono stage gain is set to the low MM value which, incidentally displays no such 'feedback' with 'normal' MMs?
Do you have any thoughts on why this should be the case with the 420STR? From the nude thread Perhaps the fact that the 420STR is like a giant antenna (according to Chris and the Professor Timeltel). Hi Henry – I gave this some more thought. I prefer to label the 420str as a “Nude” cartridge – I thought u would like this name? The 420str has very little “clothing” so why not call it nude. Its not damped and protected to the nine’s like other cartridges so it needs an arm that can pass thru or eliminate resonances really well. If you have any issues with your turntable setup, it will tell you like no other cartridge so far for me. This can be good or bad depending on your perspective. On a belt or thread drive TT where there is excellent motor isolation, this cartridge has had no issues for me whatsoever. It did however require me to lock things down better on the idler and dd tables, thus its value to me for more than just the sound, but as a test cartridge. I believe that most of the favorable impressions of the 420str here, were with belt / thread drive users ? Is this not so ? I look forward to your impressions of it Henry - on your Belt drive Raven when u get your phono stage up and running. As an update the 420str arrived safely and is with BT. Slaw – I found a Shawn Colvin - Steady On - LP. :^) |
Dear Chris, One may think 'one thread is not the other'
but I got not only 'philosophycal' but also psychological
(involving Freud) disagreement with Lew in the 'nude turntable project'. He persisted in his claim that 'plinth=base' because of the English dictionary (aka
synonym). I as a foreigner was obviously not aware of this 'fact'. That is to say that 'plinth' means the same as 'base'. Aka 'identity relationship' between meanings(??) However he also postulated 'the qualitative difference between a real plinth ' and those 'illegitimate footers'. But because my 'philosophical' opinion is that the meaning of
words depend on the context in which thy are used I mentioned my legs as footers and postulated the opposite. That they are an 'legitimate' base for my nacked or dressed body. However I also mentioned the possibility that in some future time I may need a 'plinth' like an wheel-chair. This I would think will mean some 'qualitative difference' with the previous state of affair but in the opposite 'direction' than assumed by Lew. This interesting (?) discussion was alas ended because of the irritation by some other member: no philosophycal BS in public please ; mail each other if you need.
Regards, |
Nikola I have to confess I wanted to say Nude cartridge on the Nudie thread but I thought I would be chastised so I said it here. :^( Some like to encase their whole TT system “in” a single base structure. Bring them all together so to speak in one base and therefore plinth. All entry level TT’s start life this way from what I have seen? Appears to be cost effective? We can use your Moldavian plinth holding your SP10 and tonearm/cartridge as an example of this. It is a true base and plinth (IMO) as it holds all the TT pieces on one base. Now others like to take the TT system pieces apart and see what happens. Motors separated and or the Tonearm on an armpod. On your Kuzma turntable, the plinth is the TT system plinth when you are using whichever tonearm is attached directly to it. However when you use your Kuzma TT with the tonearm that is attached to your armpod the TT “system” base/plinth is not the Kuzma plinth anymore – it is the surface they both rest on. Just my opinion. Why don’t you start a thread Nikola – How do you define a Plinth ? if you dare. However he also postulated 'the qualitative difference between a real plinth ' and those 'illegitimate footers'. But because my 'philosophical' opinion is that the meaning of words depend on the context in which thy are used I mentioned my legs as footers and postulated the opposite. That they are an 'legitimate' base for my nacked or dressed body. Those "illegitimate" footers that you and Lew are referring to (I experimented with as well in this fashion in the past) under a DD or idler only account for the bearing, motor, spindle, platter. This then requires a tonearm/cartridge off on its own somewhere on an armpod. The common base where these “footers” and armpod spikes meet - is the common base and TT system plinth- imo. There is no confusion here for me. This is very clear. Your own body footers (legs) support your your “whole body system”. |
Dear Chris, First of all thanks to remind me about the 'Moldovian plinth' for my SP 10. I totally fotget the thing. I use the original SH 10 B4 plinth with a very solid arm-base which is made from acryl layers gluead together in a shop where they produce name plates with addresses, etc. They use a laser for the purpose so my armbase is cut more precise than any cabinet maker can do.
Regarding your 'base' philosophy. Not to get involved in infinite regress or adding up of meanings, we all are moving at about 700 miles an hour, carried by the diurnal
rotation of our 'mother earth'. For your 'basic base' there is no futher reduction possible. But 'it' moves as Galilei persisted on and got in trouble with the 'mother church'.
As there are those who want to nail the meanings of words to some dictionary to get the correct use of language for all times (the English theachers ?) there are some others who want to nail everything around their TT's in order to sleep well: I deed everything I could think of so my conscience is pure. But alas the 'base of all bases' is still moving.
Btw I was somehow very fond of my own idea to use Lew's argument for the 'plinth' for my possible wheelchair. He is of course immens proud of his slate plinths. And because 'plinth=base' there is no better base for whatever TT than the slate kind. It should be counted as the real estate because of the weight and value.
Regards,
|
Chris: I think I see what you are saying. For clarification, I have two wall shelves, one supporting the motor and the other supporting the tt, phono stage and SDS. These are both connected to the same wall which has a huge effect on the sound, I agree. I tried to touch on this in my virtual system page. I do believe that it is a huge factor on how the system as a whole performs. I actually have plans for one day to 'rebuild this wall' to my specs. Thanks for reminding me of this, lol. Hope you enjoy the S Covlin. I got the 12" 45rpm maxi single recently. Sounds great! |
To anyone that has or is using the ET with a VPI acrylic armboard... Have you tried using it with and without the aluminum spacer that ET provides? If so, what were your impressions?
I personally have only tried it with the spacer, but now wonder if this could be a source of unwanted resonance using the acrylic armboard? |
Another point of possible resonance, to me.... As I've mentioned, I'm thinking of working on my current wire loom and will be building a new one also. The choice of cartridge clips is one of my concerns. I know that the Cardas are widely used and very economical. From my experience with these, they are so delicate that I have to wonder how much resonance they impart, especially after being unhooked from time to time. When I see a close up view of them, I cringe! I know in using the Acutex with it's angled pins, that I need something different from my current clips. The Vanden Hul look very promising. They seem to be made sturdier with an internal triangle shape that would grab the cart pins more securely (at three points) while the cable end still having the flexibility to slightly bend outwardly if necessary to allow enough wiggle room to mount the Acutex on the ET.
Any thoughts? |
Dear Slaw, the problem is not only the clips but also the(thin) tonearm wire . Not sure if you mean Cardas PCC Deluxe which are very good but pretty expensive. There are also Clearaudio clips which are very good made. They are also cheaper; 18 GBP on ebay.uk. What is also important are those heatshrinks which protect the wire. While not easy to solder the Clearaudio clips are the best in my opinion.
Regards, |
Nandric: I thought of the Cardas deluxe, ( I assume you are referring to the ones with the spring retainers). I'm not sure of how they will work in my particular situation. Thanks for your input. |
Slaw- I personally have only tried it with the spacer, but now wonder if this could be a source of unwanted resonance using the acrylic armboard? IMO – added resonance – yes. But whether it is a good or bad resonance in your setup only you can tell. Is this any different really than adding layers to the platter ? As ones system resolution rises its a resonance game we play with vinyl. Adding layers for me complicates things; as far as allowing me to understand what material/part is contributing to the sound. I believe it was used (shim) to keep from marring the acrylic surface with the 3 ET2 spikes. I did use it with the TNT. I don’t use it now – my 2 ET2 arms are mounted naked with their spikes. With the machine skills you have, as seen by your standalone motor assembly I would be making up 2 or 3 different material armboards. :^) Nandric
Regarding your 'base' philosophy. Not to get involved in infinite regress or adding up of meanings, we all are moving at about 700 miles an hour, carried by the diurnal
rotation of our 'mother earth'. For your 'basic base' there is no futher reduction possible. But 'it' moves as Galilei persisted on and got in trouble with the 'mother church'. Hi Nikola I personally learned a long time ago not to worry too much about things I have no control over such as the world spinning, 18 year old fraternal twins :^( , etc…. or I would have put myself 6 feet under already by now. I prefer to have fun in this hobby and in areas I have control over, solely based on what I am hearing. And because 'plinth=base' there is no better base for whatever TT than the slate kind. It should be counted as the real estate because of the weight and value. All materials resonate including slate. From what I recall reading (not listening) slate resonates around 121 hz (forget what thickness it was). Lower than your acrylic Kuzma which I believe was around 207-210 hz in the tests that were done; not sure again of thickness that was used. This info is avail on the internet if you google it. How accurate it is IDK. I have however read that using a full TT system plinth in a low resonating material helps to boost the bass in a room ? This could help if your room/speaker/placement combination is lacking in the low end ? Glad you’re having fun with your SP10 Nikola. |
Ct0517
Fyi the Final Audio TT uses a 35mm thick slab of superplastic zinc ( SPZ ) for the "plinth" - weight of plinth exclusive of platter/bearing/armpod/arm is approx 40kg. The inverted bearing and armpod are bolted directly to this slab. Info is here :
http://books.google.co.nz/books?id=ohQdU5ggcOIC&pg=PA143&lpg=PA143&dq=superplastic+zinc+(SPZ)&source=bl&ots=uDqm8e0JsG&sig=oPdsNcyBUypOB6D9VWdrx_vFdgQ&hl=en#v=onepage&q=superplastic%20zinc%20(SPZ)&f=false
The base is tight and quick.
My experience is that slate does ring. A friend of mine is now working on a ultra lightweight composite powdered ceramic sandwhich plinth for the Garrard 301 to try a "non stored energy" approach having discarded slate/panzerholz etc. |
In the time of Hegel the only methodological 'instruments' were the 'cocepts' and the 'S is P' sentence form. So to move farther Hegel invented that each concept has its opposite while the opposites have their own opposites, and so farther. I see that this 'method' is not only used to describe things but also put in practice: 'try the opposite if not satisfy with the actual concept results'.
Regards, |
Hi Dover – thx for the info. Please tell me there is not going to be a pop test quiz on that material.
More on resonances
My Verdier plinth – which holds the platter, armpod, spindle (no physical bearing) instead two large shielded magnets - is made of Granito.
Granito is a material composed by little pieces of marble of very different origin agglomerated inside a mold with cement. Machined and polished.
The resonance of the plinth with its suspension is about 5Hz and it is well absorbed by the air cavities.
The Granito and resonance info comes from Mr.Verdier himself to me in an email.
My SP10 unit (version 4) is bolted in by four - one inch solid stainless columns to an MDF plinth which in turn sits on a pneumatic suspension, which in turn is on a wall shelf (load bearing) The MDF base is a full TT system plinth as it holds all the goods. It supposedly resonates a little lower than slate. The armpod 19 lbs relies on its weight alone but my version 5 plans are to have it bolted in as well, and I am not sure what material the next plinth will be.
The Nantais L75 is an all wood layered plinth and I have convinced myself that if I take my boat to the middle of Lake Ontario and drop it over it will sink. It feels like cement when carried.
This has been said before – The ET2.5 spindle resonates at 2-3 Hz. The skinnier ET 2.0 spindle resonates at around 5-6 hz.
Resonances can be fun ? |
Nandric: I took the plunge and ordered the Clearaudio. On Take Five Audio's site, they looked to be short enough to work well. Thanks for the tip for EBay.UK, which is where I ordered. |
Hi Slaw, They are 6x2 mm and made from beryllium/copper.
The shrink is 13 mm and can be cut of course. If you need
less expensive 'tags' for experiments there are also Michell Engineering 'solid brass /silver plated ' which look like Clearaudio and cost 12,50 GBP.
Regards, |
Slaw
I liked the pic you provided us of the wire Take Five Audio built for you. I loved the attention that was paid to the gradual step down coming out of the WBTs. Was this accomplished with teflon tubing? Slaw - I just got Gene's answer I am quoting. "For those WBT RCA's the buildup was done with several layers of shrinktube. The first piece is 1/16" CPX 100 Black, you have to be EXTREMELY careful when applying heat so that you do not fuse the insulation together on the wires. From there it is built up using 1/4" and 3/8" CPA type shrinktube with the last piece covering the first two for an overall clean stepped appearance." here's the pic again - I am not affiliated with Take Five - Just a customer. http://cgim.audiogon.com/i/vs/i/f/1332259084.jpg |
Thanks guys! I am not confident at all when it comes to soldering these little tonearm wires to heavier gauge clips. I just received my AN wire... boy is it skinny! The great part about it is, it is extremely flexible, which will ultimately be a plus with an ET wireloom. I have at least 3 projects ahead of me, all having to do with the ET.
Chris: My post regarding the aluminum plate supplied w/ the ET was just to hopefully get anyone's experience w/or w/o the plate on a VPI acrylic armboard. My concern being that the acrylic may be too soft or not, to be used w/o the plate, and how each may have sounded. I have, as an upcoming project, a DIY armboard, so I'll most likely eliminate the plate as I'll be using a harder substance as the interface. That's my plan and I'm sticking to it, (for now) lol.
Any tips on soldering will be very much appreciated. I'm usually more likely to take my sweet time getting mentally prepared. |
Hi Slaw, Use an old cart and put one tag in one of the connectors. Fasten the cart in an vice (?) and you have both hands free. One to hold the wire in the back of the tag the other for the soldering iron. Use first some old tags and wire for practise. |
Slaw -
With regard to the aluminium plate/acrylic. I would not run the plate, it's added resonance. I have moved away from metal spikes, and if I use them I radius the tip so it is not a sharp point. I say radius, as in rounded, NOT flat. The idea is a small radius tip sitting in a larger radius hole as per most unipivot bearings. My suggestion would be to radius the tip of the grubs screws and then you should be able to couple directly to the acrylic without damaging the surface. In an ideal world the acrylic would have a dimple in it for the radius tip to sit in. |
Slaw, working with AN wire is a delicate process, but with patience and care you can do it. Nandric's suggestion of anchoring the clips (one at a time; of course) on an old cartridge is a good one; you don't want solder "creeping" into the clip's sleeve. This can happen even if you hold or secure the clip vertically. A toothpick stuck in a large ball of modeling clay (or similar) also works well. The advantage here is being able to adjust the angle of the tooth pick/clip easily; horizontal is best.
-With the clip secured to the toothpick or cartridge, tin the clip's tab over it's entire length. Don't use too much solder; you don't need much.
-Now comes the hardest part; tinning the wire itself. After a lot of trial and error, I have found that the best technique is to melt a bead of solder unto the the iron's tip and with your other hand run the end of the wire through the bead of melted solder until you can see that the wire is coated with solder. Don't hold the wire in the solder bead too long or the wire itself will melt. Run it through slowly; it may take three or four times. Once the wife's insulation has melted the wire will be coated with solder; not before. If you try touching the wire with the tip of the iron you will probably melt the wire.
-Now, solder the tinned end unto the prepared clip's tab. I like to make sure that a little bit of solder (remember, don't use too much) runs unto the wire beyond the tinned section. This will provide some strain relief, as the insulated portion will be less susceptible to fracturing.
-Slip the heat shrink tubing over the wire unto the clip, making sure that it slips on past the tab and unto at least part of the sleeve for additional integrity and strain relief. Don't try to slip it on over the clip first.
-Unless the heat shrink tube fits very loosely (unlikely) I prefer to not heat-shrink it. This makes repairs much easier, by allowing you to carefully slip it off of the clip and reusing it.
Good luck, and let us know how you like the AN wire; it transformed the sound of my analog setup. |
****Once the wife's insulation has melted...."****
Cracked myself up. Once my wife's insulation has melted, my iron.... Well, I better stop there :-) |
****Once the wife's insulation has melted...."**** Frogman for me this wording conjures up a very vivid and clear image. Its at this point “once the wife’s insulation has melted” that she comes downstairs, knocks on the door and tells me in a stern voice to add more insulation to the ceiling and walls of my room. :^( My apologies for my feeble attempt at Balkan humour - I have probably left myself open to ridicule now by the humour master himself. |
All of the tips are greatly appreciated. Tinning both the wire and clips sounds logical. I've finally decided on armborad materials and will probably start that project first because of the familiar sound of my system at this point.
Frogman: In dressing the AN wire, did you twist the 4 wires together at any point for possible noise rejection? |
Dear Chris, 'add up solutions' never solve any problem at
all. Try to 'isolate' your wife.
Regards, |
One other thing, It's my understanding that the insulation on the AN wire serves as it's own flux, therefore negating it's prior removal. Is this correct? |
To remove whatever insulation I use aspirin. Lew thought for the headache connected with soldering work. But I am not joking. Put the wire on the aspirin than the soldering iron on the wire and aspirin and wonder. |
Nandric, Are you an early morning listener like me? Cool! I'm a little concerned when asking me to "wonder" though.
Just to share something I've recently discovered. You may see a need?
When I changed to high pressure, during this process is when my Airtech tank exploded, I used 3 moisture traps to help eliminate the moisture I was accummutating in my line. ( By the way, I noticed that these had the additional effect of eliminating the pulsing from the compressor).
I ultimately ended up using, on the upstream of the final regulator, a dessicant filter. While this worked and allowed visual proof that some moisture was still getting through, it became an expense that I didn't want to incur forever.
Enter, toilet paper filter. Yes. Some of you may be aware, but I recently discovered it. Initially it seemed odd. After researching it on several forums, I ordered mine.
I'm sure there is a DIY of building this but I figure in my own time and effort into such things along with the other more important things I can do. Anyway, the intial cost and, in a low flow situation as the Et is, there will probably be little to no replacement filter needed. They can be removed to dry out as an option to replacement.
Even if one thinks there is no moisture in their line, it may be worth putting in, (a one time basis), a dessicant filter, just to try. |
Dear Slaw, yes I am 'an early morning listener' like you
but because I test all kinds of MM carts I am of course
not listening to the music but only to the test records.
I have no idea what you are talking about but
assume that you also discovered some cheap methods
to test one or the other. BTW I use coffee filters to clean
the already used cleaning fluid for the LP's. No idea if this
works but the idea is that if you do the best you can there is no way
anybody can blame you . Now what about 'my' aspirin?
Regards, |
Here's the website:
www.aircomparts.com
Click on filters, may be the need to follow again.
If you Google 'compressed air toilet paper filters', you can follow links to user forums.
My test is as I descibed earier, by using the disposable dessicant filters vs this one. Maybe not scientific but I'll stand by my 'end user' method. |
Slaw - fwiw - the 3 spikes on the base of the ET2 are stainless steel 10-32 cone point set screws available from any supplier. An excellent suggestion I thought from Dover to just file them down to use naked with acrylic or any other material you don’t want to mar. Ordering a few gives you options with a few different armboards. Nandric
Try to 'isolate' your wife Well Nikola - I am a little confused. Since Serbians according to you are known as natural born warriors, I dare not ask what the Serbian way is to isolate your wife. I am curious though how it is done in your Netherlands. I have taken what I consider the sub optimal way of dealing with this problem – much like a sub sonic filter, I turn on my own filter. I realize this is just a bandaid and does not solve the problem, just like a sub sonic filter. |
Slaw, I braided (twisted) the wires in pairs; red/green, white/blue. I would not braid all four. |
Dear Chris, The Serbian worriors already own or can buy an Kalashnikov for about $200. Those can be used for, uh, the radical 'isolation'. But the custom is to return the wife to her mother if not satisfy with, say,her cook capability.
As the passionate worriors the Serbians never missed any of the Balkans wars nor do they need any reason to start one (aka 'pure passion'). The result is an huge shortage
of young man while everybody like to have grandkids. So to get a son in law is a very difficult proposition. The logical or even more practical consequence is to offer dowry and other 'convenient' conditions to 'seduce' a young man to marry your daugther. One of those is of course the 'return warranty'. You can imagine the problems by parents with more than one daugther. So the Serbians also have the China paradox but much smaller qua extension. As you of course know no Chinese wants a daugther. Because of this fact the number of the Chinese population is not only a paradox but also an enigma.
But the Serbian case is more a look alike with the Spartan case. At some point in time just one worrior is left over.
My advice to you? You can ask her mother first if she still loves her daugther and than ask the right question.
Regards,
|
Dover's suggestion was a very good one that I failed to acknowledge. I appreciate all of the info I'm getting here. |
I've been listening to my DIY armboard and thought I'd try to give some of my impressions. Since it's totally DIY in nature, there's really nothing to compare it to.
The materials are 3 layers consisting of: the top plate is 1/2" Purpleheart (a very dense hardwood), the 2nd layer, which I bonded to the top layer, is 3'8" Baltic birch plywood, the bottom interface, (which I view as a combination of isolation/damping), is a 1/4" sheet of engineered wood flooring underlayment. (I purposely didn't bond this layer in order to have a way to evaluate other materials in this situation). I have no idea what the actual materials are but I'm sure it's a recycled product. I experimented with it when I was constructing my motor enclosure.
I'm a self-described "shade tree mechanic" of the audio world. I don't have any scientific means of evaluating materials, just soaking in everything I've seen, heard and read about over the years, then somehow, coming up with my own variations of the above.
I'm going to try and post pictures of it temporarily on my virtual systems page, just to let you get an idea of it visually. Since it's a prototype, I didn't go for a visually pleasing product overall.
The overall sound is very, very good. I realize that there are several changes here, one is the absence of the stock tonearm/armboard interface plate. I really wanted to get rid of anything that could be a resonance inhibitor.
I'm sure you all are aware of evaluating changes in your system and how they are 'recording dependant'.
Let's start with my standby recording in which I use to evaluate any changes I make. Shawn Colvin "Steady On". I can't say it's a reference recording but it meets my criteria not only as a damn good record, but it has most of all of the aspects one would need to evaluate every aspect of a recording, IMO.
The vocals on this @ (every lp I've heard since) are spot on. No hint of any unnatural element. Actually, the vocals seem noticeably more well integrated into the whole picture. I hear no loss of detail or inner detail. What seems to be of any concern at all is, on some familiar records, there could be a slight, "rounding off or softening" of bass, though no loss of bass lines. Upon listening to Van Morrison "Moondance" Direct Disk Labs, it sounds pretty awesome! I'm wondering, given all of the unknown changes here, if this may be a factor due to the removal of the factory plate mentioned above? I realize there's more going on here than that however.
I'm really intrigued by the end result of this project, given the unknown scientific nature of the differences I'm hearing.
|
I meant to explain the most important aspect (IMO) of these changes. I am still getting the swag my head, stomp my feet, getting into the music, viscerol feeling that is so necessary to ultimate joy of enjoying music.
That says something?! |
Could this armboard be more receptive of the forthcoming AN wireloom upgrade? |
