Do we believe in Machina Dynamics?

Wakey Wakey, Norm. Nap time is over. Time to tell us all that you have never accepted a free or discounted product from Machina Dynamica.

This topic has, of course, been beaten nearly to death... but i can't resist.

The question raised in this thread -- do we "believe" in machina dynamica -- is perfectly stated. For at its root, the Machina Dynamic question is, as the question suggests,
a question of "belief." As such, the Machina Dynamica debate is a near perfect analog to the basic questions of religious belief; it forces us to confront the most fundamental questions of the human condition: the irreconcilable division between reason and faith.

In one camp we have the secular audiophiles. They apply reason and a scientific method to the evaluation of Machina Dynamic products. The secularists demand measurable, repeatable, and explainable evidence that a tiny little clock can produce an audible difference. Because no such evidence exists -- and even Machina Dynamica makes no attempt to suggest it does -- these secularists reject little clocks and pretty rocks as no more than a scam.

In the other camp, we have the believers. They need no "proof" as to why a blue CD cover creates extended bass response; it is sufficient for them that they believe it does. And by having faith that these products work, they actually "do" for the believers. Of course, many believers try to convert the heathen secularists by cloaking their support for Machina Dynamica products with scientific sounding explanations -- "outlet cover materials have different vibrational properties" -- but these explanations are as hollow and transparent as Intelligent Design. Reading the posts of these crusaders, one strains to accept that they even believe their own BS.

So, the debate over Machina Dynamica rages on. It is no more likely that we will develop a consensus on whether little pebbles add a sense of upper range air, as it is that we will agree on whether Jesus was the son of God or a just a humble carpenter. We can't reach this consensus because some of us appeal to reason for the answer, while others merely "believe." The bottom line is that both sides are "right" according to their own terms.

Be certain to buy matching Timex clocks and matching orange price stickers so the study participants don't know which is Machina Dynamica product and which is not. Same with the jars of pebbles.

Same with the $30 "Tru-Tone" Duplex Covers that you could purchase at Home Depot for $5.97.

Same with the "Special Helical Springs" that you could order on the internet from a hardware supply house for under $10 (although, addmitedly, they might not be "special" -- at least in the way MD means it).

Drew: With respect, their "physics" are widely regarded as a joke (or worse) and have been debunked all over the internet. Try a google search of any of Geoff Kait's "white papers" and you will see what i mean.

Although consistently entertaining, these recurring debates with Norm (and his mult Wellfed) are ultimately pointless.

Wellfed, and presumably Norm, are compensated shills for MD. They receive free or discounted product as a quid pro quo for their supportive comments. (norm: would you state publicly and unequivocally otherwise?) Their comments are not, therefore, the harmless rantings of madmen. They are bought and paid for conspirators in the scam. Why give them a pass when they fail to disclose?

how telling that, despite the relentless bashing of Machina Dynamica products on these boards, MD's proprietor refuses to join the discussion to offer any defense (explanation) either of his wares or those who have suffered such ridicule for supporting them. i suspect that even you, norm, must feel a twinge of resentment at having been so totally abandoned by the Big Guy.

one would think that Mr Kait would be eager (under the circumstances, maybe even compelled) to offer his point of view on the rationale and efficacy of his audio tweaks. what a great opportunity recent discussion threads have provided to make me and other bashers looks stupid by stepping up with a cogent, substantive discussion of his products. what a disappointment, therefore, that he can only muster a drive-by attack on Pauly, one of his detractors. his refusal to engage in a substantive discussion of his products can't be excused as a desire to stay "above the fray," as his own ad hominum attacks . rather, with only a moment's thought, it is clear why Mr Kait does not offer a substantive point of view on MD products: there is none.

How about some facts. How about telling all of us how you preformed your tests.
*What was the audio equipment you used in your test? Tell us about your system, including the ics and speaker cable used.
*Was there any power conditioners used between the audio equipment and the AC power receptacle/s used for the outlet cover plate experiment?
*Was aftermarket or DIY power cords used on any of the audio equipment plugged into the test recept/cover plate?
*Give us some examples of the music you used for your test.
*What were some of the things, from the music material you selected, did you listen for?

We need to know a little about the 120V ac delivery system you used for your test.

* Dedicated branch circuits?
* Just a regular convenience outlet branch circuit?
* Branch circuit wiring method including material used?
Installed in a metallic raceway with a metallic rough-in box?
NM-B cable, (Romex trade name)? Metal or plastic receptacle rough-in box?
Equipment grounding conductor/s, (safety equipment grounding conductor/s)? Connected to ground in the same panel the the branch circuit/s are fed from?
If not as above....safety equipment ground ran to an isolated outside grounding electrode, (ground rod), that is not connected to the main grounding electrode system of the houses main electrical service?

*What receptacle/s are you using?
Brand? Model number?
Does the receptacle have a steel ferrous back strap or a brass non-ferrous back strap?

* Stainless plates used.
Ferrous (magnetic)?
Non-ferrous?
Was a magnet used to check?
*Please tell us how you experimented with the SS plates?
Here I am assuming you preformed you experiments using both ferrous and non-ferrous SS plates.....
When you experimented with the ferrous SS plate did try the plated not only grounded to the safety ground of the outlet but did you also float the ferrous SS plate above ground? Did you varify the back of the plate was not contacting the recept metallic supporting back strap?

And lastly, and I do not mean this as an insult in any way but it must be asked as it a "control" factor for any listening test. I can only guess your age from reading some of your posts, again only guessing, you are in your middle 60s or older. I have had my hearing tested in the last couple of years. When was your last hearing test?

Hmmmm, Jea69. Since when did the scientific method matter to you?

01-01-06: Jea48
Spiro, thank you for your response. The whole thing about an outlet cover plate changing the sound of my system is still a mystery to me, but my ears tell me it is a fact.

Maybe you should cover your tracks better before popping off. Just sayin'

How could i have missed this homage to rigorous analytical thinking:

08-16-04: Jea48
Short answer,yes!When it comes to Audio,I`ll beleive anything out there until proven otherwise!

Does anyone remember Crazy Eddie?

This thread is the gift that keeps on giving.

Norm: If your nonsense could not easily be explained by the fact that you are, by your own admission, a compensated shill for Machina Dynamica, your dimwitted comments would be truly inexplicable.

"audiofool and tooly"? how clever you are. i'll bet that one cracks you up every time you read it.

Street lights are on boys. Time to go home. Remember to take your pails and shovels.

Sorry, Tbag, you're not my mommy.

Freemand: I agree with your analysis. In the end, what ultimately matters is what the individual listener perceives. If, after putting an alarm clock in your room or having tones played over your phone or drinking a few glasses of Wild Irish Rose, you believe that your system sounds better, then it obviously was worth it to you. I don't think anyone disputes yours or Norm's or anyone else's experience (putting aside the obvious bias that arises when someone like Norm takes freebies, failes to disclose it, and then asserts publicly that they work).

Your analysis does not, however, address the issue of whether those "tweaks" have even a remote chance of helping others. If the point of this forum is to share experiences that may help others, it is important to separate tweaks that have no apparent explanation (which, more likely than not, induce a placebo effect that likely is not repeatable acrosss the population or even for an individual over time) and those that have some basis in rationale, scientific explanations (which are vastly more likely to have a similar effects on others' experiences).

Otherwise, Norm's anecodates about how little pebbles have changed his life are just that: cute, personal anecdotes that contribute nothing to the general understanding and improvement of the forum members' experiences.

I guess all you can do is buy the cheapest gear and enjoy it.

I knew it was just a matter of time until Norm resorted to a "my **** is bigger than yours" argument. For someone who shilling phone clicks, in the absence of any intelligent arguments, the ad hominum attcks are inevitable. But suggesting that someone can't afford to buy equipment as good as yours, Norm, is really crossing a line.

Time for you to take a refresher course on Audiogon posting guidelines and crawl back under your rock.

Ok, norm. Let me see if I have it right this time. Your position is that, if we don't trust clicks on a phone might improve the sound of our audio equipmeny, we are worthy of only the cheapest equipment.

Sorry that I didn't have the intellectual capacity to understand such a compelling point the first time.

Good thing there are deep thinkers like you to keep the high end manufacturers in business.

So if you have some extra time on your hands, you could visit the Machina Dynamica website. On the Teleportation Tweak page, Mr Kait introduces the product with a curious quote:

Fiery the angels fell.
Deep thunder rolled around their shores...
Burning with the fires of Orc.

This is a quote from the movie Blade Runner, which itself quotes (with slight modification) a poem, America: A Prophecy, by William Blake. Both Blade Runner and Blake's poem have been interpreted as being anti-establishment, suggesting a need to return to the past in order to make progress. Adding to this "Back to the Future" theme, Kait uses a picture of an old-fashioned telephone to promote the Teleportation Tweak.

Any theories on what Mr Kait's message could mean? Is he rejecting modern audiophile wisdowm in favor of his own concepts? But then what is so "retro" about his approach? Perhaps the secret of the Teleportation Tweak lies in the answer to this riddle.

Or not.

I purchased the Brilliant Pebbles through Auctions.
Weather these items are technical marvels or just common ordinary items,I really dont know. But, they do help improve the soundstage!

ozzy: from you system pics, i gather that you are Detroit Lions fan. guess that would explain your willingness to vastly overpay for something that you acknowledge to be a "common ordinary item."

And is the Detroit Lion fan comment anything but ad hominem?

Norm:

Go back to bed. No one is talking to you.

If you can't fall back asleep, re-read your rich history of posting on this and other sites: you are the absolute last person who should be criticizing others for personal attacks. You have mastered that tactic -- perhaps not surprisingly, given your inability to defend your positions with rationale thought.