Do I need a subwoofer?


Hopefully I’ve framed this in a way to help people answer. Up until recently I have had a combo 2-channel/home theater system (Krell preamp with home theater bypass, Bryston 5 channel amp, PSB Synchrony 1s bi-amped speakers, Marantz home theater receiver, Power Sound Audio XV15 subwoofer, Oppo CD player). I wanted extra oomph for surround sound movie watching and occasionally some rock music, hence the sub. I was never really impressed with the XV15 sub (have it for sale now). It is insanely large and I wasn’t sure it was adding the oomph I expected, even after having a local hifi shop owner come out for a listen and tune.

What’s changed: A few weeks ago I inherited my late father’s B&W 801 speakers circa 1980, which I have put in place of my PSBs and am enjoying thoroughly despite the age difference.

My questions: (1) would a sub still be of value in my setup (I still like a lot of bass) and (2) what might folks recommend?

 

Thank you.

olfac87

Showing 9 responses by soix

@jerryg123 — I’d rethink that sub decision. Huge fan of ur speaks and ur hawks logo BTW. Lived in Chicago for a bit and sadly didn’t get to see them play in the old arena — one of my biggest sports regrets. Anyhoo, I was listening to an ultra mega system with “full-range” speaks that went down to the low 20s with stereo subs, and when he turned off the subs the whole soundstage collapsed and the dynamics and imaging of the whole thing took a huge step backwards. I was gobsmacked and didn’t wanna listen to his otherwise awesome system without the subs anymore — it was that huge of a difference and truly one of my top 3 AHA moments in audio (even surpassing the incredible impact of the oft-neglected preamp that is likewise HUGE IMHO).  I only say this to say that even with your incredibly awesome speakers I can only aspire to, you might wanna give those subs another crack crossed over suitably low that they don’t eff up all the goodness those QLNs produce. I mean, even Wilson uses subs with their Alexandras, so...

Well, this doesn’t have anything to do with law but rather experience in audio.  I stand by mine.  What’s yours?

Just say "I don’t agree with that particular opinion and here’s why"

Uh, that’s exactly what I did when I said I’d take two good but lesser subs over one “better” sub that you seemed to agree with. If you don’t like SVS subs that’s fine, but you actually agreed with me, so where u going with this?

I swear this forum has more crybabies than any other I’m aware of.

Well, no. This forum just tolerates people who come on here with credible experience based on years of listening and hearing lots of gear in lots of different scenarios. That I challenged you on a fairly minor point and you fail to respond intelligently says a lot about your credibility. But whatever, feel free to keep digging yourself deeper.

but with the rest of your system you really owe it to yourself to step up to a better pair.

But @shooter41, i didn’t ask for your “advice” such as it is. I just responded with an informed response and you’re defensive and offended despite agreeing with my contention that 2 or more subs are superior to one “better” sub. Why so touchy/insecure? Maybe regale us with your extensive background/credentials in audio? Please share what your depth of knowledge and experience is based on?

@shooter41 I didn’t ask.  You offered and I responded in kind.  Not royalty, just someone with some experience.  Your move chief. 

Gee Scooter, thanks so much for your prized advice.  I’ve reviewed high-end audio for about 20 years, so when I’m ready to add a couple, or even better a swarm, of subs to my 2-channel setup I think I’ll be ok.  But thanks so much for your thoughts. 

I do think it’s strange, though, that you’re using an SB2000 in a "fairly high-end" system. You need to increase your sub budget, there’s much better performance available for (in Rythmik’s case, at least) not much more money.

@shooter41 No, my feelings not hurt in the least. I transported my SB2000 from my HT in my family room just to see what it might add to my 2-channel system that consists of a Musician Pegasus R2R DAC, Bryston BP6 pre, McCormack DNA-0.5 RevA amp, and Soliloquy 6.2 speakers. The bass foundation was obvious, but the expansion of the soundstage in all directions along with improved imaging even with the one sub properly dialed in was pretty amazing and adding another I’d have to assume would improve things further still. I’ll take two SVS SB1000 Pros for significantly less $$$ over one comparable Rythmic or REL any day as I think two “lesser” yet still very capable subs trump one “better” sub, but you’re certainly entitled to your opinion.

REL is a good choice, SVS not so much for a music based system.

Really @shooter41? What’s your experience with sealed SVS subs? My experience with my SB2000 in a fairly high-end, 2-channel setup is pretty damn impressive and I’d think adding another would be even more so, so I’d be interested in what specific experience you have to say this? Yeah, I’d probably prefer Rythmic or maybe even Rel, but they’d both cost much more for similar performance so for the $ the SVS subs get you pretty damn good performance. Maybe you could share what their shortcomings are, because failing a direct comparison to pricier subs I’m at a loss for criticizing them for bass speed, musicality, or depth. Please explain.

In addition to adding bass, properly set up subs will also greatly improve imaging and expand the soundstage.  I’d recommend trying a pair of SVS SB1000 Pro subs you can get for under $1000 (they were running a sale recently but not sure if it’s still going) that are relatively small but will still get you down to an honest 20Hz and also offer integration software to help you get them dialed in properly.  And yes, you want two, not one sub — huge improvement.  SVS offers a generous and truly risk-free, in-home trial so if they don’t transform your system you can simply return them but highly doubt you will.  Hope this helps, and best of luck.