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Denon AVR vs. Martin Logan Electrostats

My main speakers are Martin Logan "Source" (ESL electrostatic panels) added to a system powered by Denon AVR-X3000. Previous main speakers were Martin Logan SLM-XL (part of the Motion series), and volume was fine. Now with the ESL's, the AVR can't deliver enough volume, and because of the low impedance of these speakers, fear the AVR is struggling with the load. Martin Logan website recommends using 'quality' amplification, which they define as, "...nearly doubles power from 8ohm to 4ohm load, and doubles again to 2ohm load...". Denon says their "X" receivers nearly double power between 8ohm and 4ohm, but no mention of 2ohm (so I suspect 4ohm is their limit).

My question is, will an upgraded Denon AVR with more power (AVR-X4500H, or 6500H) supply the needed power to get the most of these Martin Logan's, or is a pre/pro required.

I am a fan of the Denon feature set (for HT), and have thoroughly enjoyed the X3000 for many years, so wouldn't mind upgrading if that will fix the problem. But anything above that (cost-wise) or loss of features is not the direction I want to go.

If Denon doesn't offer an AVR that will push these ESL's, then I'd rather replace the ESL's with something else. DefTech is out (can't tolerate the shrill sound of those aluminum tweeters), and I know from the Martin Logan SLM-XL's that I really like AMT tweeters, and am perfectly ok with any good soft dome. Most likely speaker substitute would be either Golden Ear (which I have auditioned - they are awesome and awesomely expensive) or Emotiva (which I have not heard) - both have good reviews. I have also heard Martin Logan Motion 60XT, but was underwhelmed (too bright and with cabinet resonance when pushed). 

Any thoughts would be appreciated. Hoping others with ML ESL experience could tell me straight if Denon AVR-X**** just won't deliver, and I need to go speaker shopping. Will be tough giving those up, if that's the case - these electrostatic speakers are truly amazing (even when underpowered).
mwatsme

Showing 3 responses by mwatsme

mwatsme's avatar
mwatsme OP
188 posts
 
Thank you for the replies, and some great ideas. The point of running setup again should have been obvious, and probably would have if I'd had a monitor connected to see the Denon on-screen menu. As it was, we moved into a new house nearly a year ago, and before the HT was unpacked, basement flooded, inspiring many months of work on my part. During that time, purchased the Source speakers and they sat in storage (after a quick connection to be sure they worked). Now the Denon is out of moth balls, but still no monitor connected. Rerunning Audyssey should be the next step, if previous settings are still in effect, the mains are probably set to "small speaker". Also, I was reading in the manual of AVR-X6500H, that impedance is selectable in the menu too, and this is probably true for my X3000 as well.

Also appreciated the idea of using pre-outs to another more capable amp for the Source speakers. This would be a great option, especially if Source's might be upgraded later to larger electrostats. I am fond of their qualities.

Taking it to the next level with Denon's sister Marantz is another good idea. Although, not sure I'm that much of a hobbyist. It opens up another level of upgrade potentials that seem endless. I was looking at Emotiva amps (really like the modular construction), and thinking that might work, then noticed the price of the matching preamp, and thought oops - this game is for enthusiasts with a different budget for such endeavors.
mwatsme's avatar
mwatsme OP
188 posts
 
Is there a 2-channel version of the Rotel RMB-1585, or another equal performing recommendation for 2 channel? None of the other speakers in the system are as demanding and could run on AVR power.

Unless the Source's are replaced with another set of larger ML panels, and repurposed for surround use... and so begins the never-ending spiral of upgrades.

Seriously though, is there a 2-channel amp recommendation? To be used with Denon X6***-series AVR pre-outs.
mwatsme's avatar
mwatsme OP
188 posts
 
I solved this problem by replacing the ML Source speakers with Golden Ear Triton 3+. And while the Tritons don't have the 'magic' planar sound, they do a very good job for home theater purposes, and are not demanding of the amp.

Sources have moved to 2-channel music-only room. So still need an amp for best results, but thinking integrated with bluetooth and wifi capability that can drive down to 2ohm - possibly NAD C3** or can anyone recommend something else?
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