Dedicated power circuits


I’m having some electrical work done including a whole house

generator, surge suppressor, and a new panel box. I am also going to have two dedicated power lines run for my stereo. I’ve read a lot on here about how this is a really nice upgrade and would greatly appreciate any advice to help me along on my project. Right now the plan is two 20 amp circuits with 10 gauge wire. One for my amp and one for my preamp and sources. My equipment is a McIntosh MC 452, a C47 right now but a C22 in the future, Rega P8, Rose hifi 150b,  McIntosh MR 74 tuner and Aerial 7t speakers. I’m also replacing my panel box with a new one. It’s a brand from a company that’s out of business and the quality and safety is suspect plus there are no new breakers available.

 

So starting with the breakers, then the wire and finally the receptacles what should I be looking for? The electrician that just left here is planning on the new panel being a Cutler Hammer brand. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

gphill

Showing 3 responses by minorl

it is not the end of the world, but, all lines on one leg is not accurate or necessary.

Make sure you have dedicated lines to the panel.  In other words, each hot, neutral and ground wire goes back to the panel directly and isn't shared by any other circuit.

Each piece of equipment converts the AC voltage to DC internally, and they should have adequate noise filtering internally.  Ground loops (hum) typically occurs when neutrals or hot is shared by other components and is not adequately filtered.

When the neutral has an actual voltage present over the ground level, then yes, you will have a ground loop problem.  This is why the grounding schemes within each component is very important.  You have nothing to do with that, but some designers (not typically anymore) don't design the ground schemes adequately.

You want to avoid putting components on the same legs as noise making components, like noisy lighting systems, etc.  Large motors, etc.

Most if not all adequately designed electrical home circuitry have balanced loads on each leg.  That is code.  So placing a large load on one leg unbalances the system and causes problems.

My system and many that I have helped put together for others have circuity on each leg and there is absolutely no problems at all and shouldn't be.

I'm an Electrical Engineer and also a Power Engineer (analog/digital design) for Aerospace and a Power Engineer for an Electrical Utility for over 45 years.  I design and build amplifiers, filters, etc. also.

I'm not trying to piss anyone off, but the "must be on the same leg" thing, is not accurate.  Just avoid or remove noise making equipment.

Also, I have noticed that it is a good idea to have the small signal equipment (CD player/transport, DAC, Turntable, Pre-Amp) connected to a decent power conditioner and then to a dedicated line and the amps connected directly to dedicated lines.  This is why I always recommend at least three dedicated lines and not two.

If you have more than one amp, then in my opinion, they should be on separate dedicated lines and the small signal equipment connected to the power conditioner and then to it's own dedicated line.

If you have amps that are basically arc welders, then putting them on the same leg is not a good idea electrically.  Anyway, your choice.

I try to plan for the future.  Start with one stereo amp, then yes, two dedicated lines.  But, what happens when you decide to upgrade and go mono amps???

Have fun in your goals and enjoy

@gphill do whatever you fell is best for you.

I'm not trying to argue with anyone here, however, ground loops occur if there is a voltage potential between the neutral and ground wires.

The only difference between the two hots coming into a home is the phase difference in the AC legs.  However, when that AC is converted to DC the PHase difference goes completely away.

That is it.

As I mentioned previously, sometimes people would connect to a hot leg that has noisy equipment connected to it or the grounding scheme in some audio equipment was improperly designed which causes ground loop issues.

Dedicated lines have the hot, neutral and ground go back to the service panel without sharing.  All circuit neutrals tie together at the service panel and all grounds tie together at the service panel.

If the leg has noisy components (AND) the internal power supply of certain audio equipment isn't up to snuff to eliminate noise properly, then, you MAY have noise.  if the grounding scheme in a particular audio equipment isn't designed properly (star ground, etc.), then you MAY have a ground loop.

But, like I said before, connecting to two legs is okay as long as you know what is on the legs.  Connecting everything to one leg is fine as long as you don't have arc welder amps that unbalance the system (noise anyone?) by drawing too much on one leg and unbalancing the system.

This is why Refrigerators, microwaves, electric washing machines, etc. as connected as balanced loads on home systems.

But I can tell you that people that claim to hear differences between all on one leg of split leg service, didn't do A/B comparisons (kind of hard to do that) and if they did, there was something else that caused the problem. like a really noisy equipment that was on that particular leg or worse, some audio component that didn't have a properly designed ground scheme.

In older equipment you would find the signal ground (for audio) and the chassis ground was connected.  not a good idea is it?  Many people know that now but back then?  not so much.  Or there were multiple signal ground points in a circuit instead of star grounding at the same point (physically).  Literally asking for a ground loop or hum problem. Has nothing at all to do with which AC leg was used.

In my experience, I have never seen an issue with all low level components tied to a decent power conditioner and then to a dedicated line and separate amps tied to their own dedicated line.

I have however many times found ground loops by the following method.

unplug everything.  Connecting the amp and speakers together only and turn the amp on. Noise?  yes, amp is the problem.  No?  then connect the pre-amp to the amp/speaker combination.  Noise?  yes, pre-amp or (interconnect cables) is the problem.  see where I'm going with this?  

Anyway, enjoy you system.  I know you will.