I would like to start a thread, similar to Orpheus’ jazz site, for lovers of classical music. I will list some of my favorite recordings, CDs as well as LP’s. While good sound is not a prime requisite, it will be a consideration. Classical music lovers please feel free to add to my lists. Discussion of musical and recording issues will be welcome.
I’ll start with a list of CDs. Records to follow in a later post.
Berlioz: Symphonie Fantastique. Chesky — Royal Phil. Orch. Freccia, conductor. Mahler: Des Knaben Wunderhorn. Vanguard Classics — Vienna Festival Orch. Prohaska, conductor. Prokofiev: Scythian Suite et. al. DG — Chicago Symphony Abbado, conductor. Brahms: Symphony #1. Chesky — London Symph. Orch. Horenstein, conductor. Stravinsky: L’Histoire du Soldat. HDTT — Ars Nova. Mandell, conductor. Rachmaninoff: Symphonic Dances. Analogue Productions. — Dallas Symph Orch. Johanos, cond. Respighi: Roman Festivals et. al. Chesky — Royal Phil. Orch. Freccia, conductor.
All of the above happen to be great sounding recordings, but, as I said, sonics is not a prerequisite.
I will listen to them both, and see if I can hear your comments. Lord knows I am not qualified to judge, but I always look into ANYTHING recommended by The Frogman.
Mozart Mozart Overtures Academy of St. Martin-in-the-Fields Neville Marriner EMI Label, Recorded 1982
Marriner was one of the founders of ASMF. Now led by American Violinist Joshua Bell.
From the Notes: " A night at the opera has not always been the event of serious enjoyment it is today. In earlier days, noise from an audience bent on treating the opera as an excuse for social merriment was likely to compete with the start of the music, very much to the latter's disadvantage. To combat this, composers developed the Overture (literally "opening"), in which instruments struck up with a few loud chords to quell conversation and capture attention ..... Gradually these chords grew into a complete and self-contained movement..."
Excellent recorded sound, but for me the performance feels rushed, too fast. Heifetz was a fantastic virtuoso, but sometimes sounded as if he used his virtuosity for the sake of showmanship. His earlier recording of this concerto with Serge Koussevitsky and Boston symphony, while not nearly as good recorded sound wise is more musical, taken at more reasonable tempos. In fact, the performance is more than three minutes slower than the Reiner/Chicago; a good thing, in this case.
A favorite, warmer and more poetic performance is Nathan Milstein with Philarmonia Orchestra/Anatole Fistoulari. Of note is the fact that the first movement cadenza is by Milstein himself. Then again, I can’t think of a Milstein recording that I haven’t liked.
@schubert Well Len regarding Phillip he was pretty well liked up here not least for the fact that he was always aware that the Queen was first in everything. I see Nichola getting her two faced tribute in, she never hid her dislike of the Royals. I find that I can be a bit ambivalent about them in that I find that they can be good to promote the country but there are too many of them. It has gotten so bad now that the Queen is supporting some of them from her personal estates.
Jim, how do folk in Scotland Feel about the Prince passing ? I never thought that grown ups needed Royalty but after last few years here I'm not so sure.
In any event he seemed like a good enough bloke to me and I have a adult sadness for him . I wish we all has more sadness for these people upon their deaths .
From the notes: On New Year’s Day, 1879, the concerto was introduced at the Gewandhaus in Leipzig, on a program with an overture from a suite by Franz Lachner, an aria from Mozart’s Die Entfuhrung aus dem Serail and some Chopin songs sung by Marcella Sembrich, the Chaconne from Bach’s D minor Sonata for solo violin, and Beethoven’s Seventh Symphony. The concerto’s reception was typically Brahmsian in that it was simultaneously praised and damned. Tchaikovsky, writing to Mme. von Meck, called the introduction "an admirable pedestal for a statue." adding, "but the statue is not there: we get merely a second pedestal placed on the first."
IMO , this is a Great Oratorio which seem to get very little play anywhere and none in North/ America . I realize God is not in vogue but even an atheist could enjoy this Masterpiece . Mendelssohn , Elias, with his band the Gewandhaus, Leipzig .
I start with 2nd part as it is shorter and Elly Amellng starts it off . Words are from the Old Testament . The ever reliable Wolfgang Sawallisch at the helm.P.S. frogman, It came to Me, my first choice on the first day and page this forum started was the Mozart, Schubert , Serkin , Marlbourgh . Not far down the 1st page . About 41, Elly took over sung like an angle , my hair stood up !
Well there is this guy called Heinz Holliger . As soon as your first CD started It came back to me . I had this recording a long time ago.In those days I didn’t care who was playing just wantedSchubert and Mozart .As I said Wright is lyrical + he REALLY helps the singer . There is a old Principle Oboe Man, soon to retire , In the Minnesota that does that as well and has a beautiful tone . Might be a tad easier on Oboe . Seems Wright has one tone, beautiful ..Karl has 2 . LOL.
Johann Strauss -- THE BLUE DANUBE Vienna State Opera Chorus Vienna Philharmonic Willi Boskovsky London label -- 1984
I remember the first time I heard this version, I was driving across Louisiana in my Taurus SHO, listening to PBS on the radio. Bought it as soon as I got home.
I went to Marlboro about a dozen times , Not hard when you live 60 miles away and not expensive . A truly great fest , far better than the one in Mass.
I will never forget sitting 20 feet bur I have from present boss, MitsukoUchida.playing Schubert , it was a cool day but the blouse on her small back was soaking wet. Not easy being great which she sure is .
I’m with Mazur , "I love every note he wrote " .Mazur had a large tome he wrote which showed that Sym 1-4 were of one piece .Could Be.I don’t have Brahms IQ score but I think he was the most intelligent of all the great composers .
It’s not really bias , like a women, you like what YOU like period .And if you buds say different F....... them.
P.S I don’t know if this is true or not and I have never said it . In 2 German books I read Brahms sleep with a bible under his pillow and knew every word of it. I imagine he could.
Thanks for your assessment, Schubert. Good point re Valente vs Elly. I’m very biased toward the Marlboro recording being one of the first Wright recordings I heard many years ago while still in HS. I will post Wright’s Brahms Clarinet sonatas later. You being a Brahms fan, I think you’ll enjoy them.
Rok, The “Gran Partita” is indeed magnificent. One of the greatest works for winds, Mozart’s genius is all over the work. Notice the use of two Bassett horns (essentially alto clarinets in F with extended range) bridging the range gap between the clarinets and bassoons. Wonderful color. Great
From The Notes: "The composition of the B-flat Serenade(K.361) coincided with Mozart's decision to leave his post with the Archbishop of Salzburg(Mozart injudiciously called his "slavery") and move to Vienna. The Serenade was apparently started in Munich late in 1780. The earliest public performance probably took place as part of a concert at Vienna's Burgtheater on March 23, 1784. Of the event, the playwright Johann Friedrich Schink wrote, "I have heard a piece for wind instruments by Herr Mozart today. Magnificent! It employed thirteen instruments, and at every instrument a master. The effect was Grand and Magnificent beyond description." -- Richard E. Rodda
Mozart's biographer concluded that Mozart choose this music as the entertainment music at his own wedding reception on August 4, 1782.
frogman, I finally got a "puter that let me hear Wright . In my hears he is very lyrical which is Schubert all the way .He and Karl are a draw to me . I know that Valente is a great singer and has sung all kinds of classical to great result .Including chamber and all else.
But for ME she is too much opera singer for Schubert.
Elly is the darling of the original crowd , a plain beautiful women’s voice .I can see he on the Herrt. Benita would be a stretch for ME .
That’s good Jim, you deserve it.Here in North America we used to have Spring for 2-3 months , down now to 2-3 weeks at best.
Seems to me that the pana thing is just showing that everything is related to everything . Mother nature seems fed up with the human race which has about killed her and it’s time for her to use what she has, the last card.
I fear for the young humans, most of the older ones care not .
frogman, you are a music maker and a upper level one at that. I’m just an old guy that has listened to a lot of music.I as much said my clarinet sucked , so Elly and Schubert is more than enough for me .I’m in 1% in love for Schubert and her.
Tone everyone can hear, only a star listener always hears pitch, someone like Jim . I only said Stolzman was good because he was American. I could take him or leave him , he was the star for years. My jury is in for Frost he plays like he wrote the music .
Had do, he knew how it really should be .
Jack is my uncle , at least I think he was.
I was always listening to Karl’s tone , he could give the conductor what he wanted with a blink of an eye.Makes me feel better than any other I have heard on his instrument Simple.
Thank you for your class . I truly appreciate them .
Der Hirt auf dem Felsen, Op. 129, D. 965 · Anna Lucia Richter The clarinetist is not Leister tough....But he play well with the female voice...Not one beside the other...
Thanks for the clip. Lovely voice. More than I can say about the clarinetist; no poetry in his playing and hesitant phrasing. Unfortunately, for me, this makes the overall performance a case of “how am I doing”, but without “how are we doing”.
Obviously, we all appreciate different qualities in players. I hope you don’t mind some thoughts Re your list of clarinetists. For whatever it may be worth, there is practically universal agreement among players of the instrument in the following regards. In fairness, players of the instrument react to certain aspects of playing that may or may not be priorities for others.
Karl Leister. Very fine player and one of my favorites. If not for his questionable and sometimes imprecise intonation, it would be a toss up for me between he and Wright. Lovely tone and overall musicianship.
Martin Frost. Absolute phenom on the clarinet. Incredible technique and capable of doing things on the instrument previously thought impossible to execute. I think the jury is still out as to how much depth there is in performances of works that don’t require that kind of virtuosity.
Jack Brymer. Fine player, but nothing particularly distinctive about his playing.
Richard Stolzman. Certain charm to his playing, but his playing is thought to be somewhat crass with unusual use of vibrato and unrefined tone. Not well regarded among players.
Here is Leister on Der Hiirt in a fairly well balanced ensemble performance. Still, for me, not on the level of the Wright/Valente. Questionable pitch, but lovely tone.
Elly Ameling had a truly gorgeous voice. I remember going to Edinburgh one festival to hear Bryn Terfel at The Usher Hall it was an absolutely first class night . The program was Winterise and Die Schone Mullerin .
I do know he was slower that the Germans and the older I get the more I appreciate that in general .
Jack Brymer always had a place in my heart just because .I read his book on plane once , fun , even if I didn’t get it all.
Stolzman was good .Frost was here a lot with the SPCO , great when he wasn’t going crazy. My ALL time hero on the misery stick is Karl Leister with Karajan .He made zero mistakes and could change his tone about twice a second.When the players in the Berlin Phil are in awe ........But I have been told I have a German bias.
I remember this scene in an episode or 'POIROT', everyone is dressed to the nines in this grand house to listen to some 400 pound babe sing 'Lieder'. Once she starts, everyone's eyes glazed over almost instantly. Trying, as discreetly as possible, to check their watches. How much longer can she possibly go on?
Found a Terful jewel on You Tube ! https://youtu.be/Il-jv_7BLp0?t=2 Not even Bach can freeze me, literally , like Schubert can.Best thing I ever did was get a German girlfriend who could not speak English.Even if she was a b....h
I only am Schubert because of the first time I heard of this and needed something . While looking for that all I saw was R & R titles and thought these misguided fools need some class.
Wish I just chose Harry or Herman the German .
If you want a fabulous Schubert lieder outing this is the best I know . Brryn Terrful on DG 445 294-2GHHard to believe the Great Welchman could turn German but that fabulous voice can do anything .
I doubt if one can be found ,but who knows
rok . Would it be free trade if a firm was told what they could do or say by the Congress under threat of blackmail or punishment ?
From the Notes: "London at the end of the eighteenth century was indisputably the musical capital of Europe, Parisian musical life having collapsed in the wake of the French Revolution. Music publishing and instrument making were flourishing in London, and above all there was already an unusually well developed and diverse musical life --- public, open to everyone and governed by the rules of a free market."
One of Schubert’s (the other Schubert ☺️) last works and one of the the most charming chamber works in the literature. IMO, clarinet playing does not get better than this. Soprano Benita Valente is superb. Beautiful example of how to strike the right balance between “how are we doing” and “how am I doing. Definitive performance by most accounts:
Speer had an lQ of about 18O , right up with us . What Berlin Brigade did was rotate every Infantry Co . one Platoon a week. I just happen to be there . C/3/6th Infantry . Best unit I ever was in . Only one that ever had real discipline .
.My friends in the East Anglican Reg. told me the Russians didn’t hurt them but their food suck when the Soviets were on .Brits always had better Indtel .
Very nice piano playing, but bizarre interpretation of the music.
Well, as you said, they are French, after all. A Stereo Review recommendation. I can still see the page. Now, I will have to look for Martha Argerich. There is always something.(Gilda Radner)
Trust me, Black folks are not, and were never, upset over P&B. On occasion, they feel the need to 'act' like they are upset.
You know what they say, The Germans are either at your throat or at your feet. During the time you met them, they were in foot mode.
I got to Germany a year after his (Speer) release. He was quite the celeb. Played the press and public like a top. I was also there when he died, in Frankfurt.
If not for the Soviets, we would have also let the other monster out.
Check this rok, I was Sgt . of the Guard in Spadau(Berlin) Prison one morning . , French, UK, Soviets and us rotated every 3 month to keep the only two Nazis left there, Speer and Hess . Went around the mess corner and ran into Speer , who was every inch the gent , said in English " Good morning Sargent ,looks like a nice day" . He extended his hand and out of habit I took it .
Hour later I went by Hess and he said " guten Morgen " as he tended his flowers .Must of cost millions to keep two old guys .
A few days ago, in a comment made partially in response to Schubert’s statement that Samuel Barber was the “foremost American composer”, I wrote that I agreed “if in strict keeping with the subject of this thread”. When I wrote that, I had George Gershwin in mind as contender for the title of “foremost”, with the qualification that he was not, in a strict sense, a Classical composer. Wonderful composer and arguably the greatest American song writer.
“Porgy and Bess” is a wonderful work and a true landmark in many respects and very controversial to say the least. Despite its huge success, many objected (and still do) to the idea of a white man’s notion of what life in the South at the time was like for blacks and that it promulgated racial stereotypes. In fact, to put Gershwin’s grasp (or lack thereof) of the subject in perspective, it should be noted that Gershwin spent a summer (?!) in South Carolina in order to get a sense of the flavor of black life in the South. At the same time many in the black arts community were glad for the fact that the work gave black singers an opportunity to perform on stage in a work on such a grand scale and of that “seriousness”. Gershwin insisted, and his estate still insists, that the cast be all black. The challenge was and still is in finding a large cast that can sing credibly in an operatic style as well as being able to bring a Jazz sensibility to some of the material. As an aside, he used a three saxophone section in his orchestration of the work. As we know, several of the songs have become Jazz standards. Gershwin called his work a “folk opera”.
Why all the above? Therein lies the reason that I have trouble with the Labeque interpretation of the “Porgy and Bess Fantasy (for two pianos)”. Very nice piano playing, but bizarre interpretation of the music. I know the music very well and I almost don’t recognize the music in spots. Too much “affectation”; and way too “precious” and languorous. Dare I say it? Too French. There is no hint of “folk” (Jazz) or Americana anywhere.
I find this rendition to be much truer to Gershwin’s intent; at least, based on how the music is approached the vast majority of the time:
Btw, the composer “Aldridge Grainger” is none other than Percy Grainger; Australian born, but citizen of the US and “American” composer by any standard.
FANTASY ON GEORGES GERSHWIN’S "PORGY AND BESS" FOR TWO PIANOS
KATIA and MARIELLE LABEQUE(piano)
The Notes: The fantasy is by Australian born composer Aldridge Grainger(1882-1961) who was an ardent admirer of the music of George Gershwin. Here the Fantasy is recorded in its entirely for the first time.
rok, I have to go to Church on TV .First one I flipped today started with about 15 minutes of Messiah, Organ, brass and percussion.Pretty Place with no others in it . My first Presbyterian Church, good sermon as well. Preacher was almost like Charles Stanley in Bible knowledge !
frogman , I am all into diversity in large countries like the USA. Over 10% of Minnesota population are refuges or immigrants and we are better for it in our Nations largest % iof Federal Voters. . My best friend is Chinese and a nicer man I have never known .
It can be not so good for little countries
Little European Counties like Austria , 8 million, Slovenia 2 million,Czech Republic 3 mill ,fear for their culture and unlike USA have real reason to . They have taken as much people as they can take and are musical lands that want what they have. Big -hearted Sweden is falling apart for taking more than it could handle .Germany , The Euro Engine with about 90 mil took a million in one year and 2,500 refugees raped German women on New Years in Berlin.
inna, What you said proves what I have thought, you are mentally ill.
frogman , I think that were he still alive, that Prof would say what you did . It was said in the 1960’s and took about 2 minutes . It stuck in MY mind .
I have noticed over the years that many players have become more harsh etc. I thought it might be because the World they were born into was that.
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