Capacitor log Mundorf Silver in Oil


I wished I could find a log with information on caps. I have found many saying tremendous improvement etc. but not a detailed account of what the changes have been. I have had the same speakers for many years so am very familiar with them. (25+ years) The speakers are a set of Klipsch Lascala's. They have Alnico magnets in the mids and ceramic woofers and tweeters. The front end is Linn LP12 and Linn pre amp and amp. The speaker wire is 12 gauge and new wire.

I LOVE these speakers around 1 year ago they started to sound like garbage. As many have said they are VERY sensitive to the components before them. They are also showing what I think is the effect of worn out caps.

There are many out here on these boards I know of that are using the Klipsch (heritage) with cheaper Japanese electronics because the speakers are cheap! (for what they can do) One thing I would recommend is give these speakers the best quality musical sources you can afford. There is a LOT to get out of these speakers. My other speakers are Linn speakers at around 4k new with Linn tri-wire (I think about 1k for that) and the Klipsch DESTROY them in my mind. If you like "live feel" there is nothing like them. In fact it shocks me how little speakers have improved in 30 years (or 60 years in the Khorns instance)

In fact I question Linn's theory (that they have proved many times) that the source is the most important in the Hi-Fi chain. Linn's theory is top notch source with lessor rest of gear including speakers trumps expensive speakers with lessor source. I think is right if all things are equal but Klipsch heritage are NOT equal! They make a sound and feel that most either LOVE or hate. (I am in the LOVE camp and other speakers are boring to me)

So here goes and I hope this helps guys looking at caps in the future. Keep in mind Klipsch (heritage Khorns Belle's and Lascala's especially) are likely to show the effects of crossover changes more then most.

1 The caps are 30 years old and
2 the speakers being horn driven make changes 10x times more apparent.

Someone once told me find speakers and components you like THEN start to tweak if needed. Don't tweak something you not in love with. Makes sense to me.

So sound
Record is Let it Be (Beatles)
The voices are hard almost sounds like a worn out stylus.
Treble is very hard. I Me Mine has hard sounding guitars. Symbals sound awful. Everything has a digital vs. analog comparison x50! Paul's voice not as bad as John's and George's. Voices will crack.

different lp
Trumpets sound awful. Tambourine terrible. Bass is not great seems shy (compared to normal) but the bad caps draw soooooo much attention to the broken up mid range and hard highs that are not bright if anything it seems the highs are not working up to snuff. I have went many times to speaker to make sure tweeters are even working.

All in all they sound like crap except these Klipsch have such fantastic dynamics that even when not right they are exciting!

Makes me wonder about the people who do not like them if they are hearing worn out caps and cheap electronics? Then I can see why they do not like them! If I did not know better from 25+ years of ownership that would make sense.

For the new crossover I have chosen Mundorf Silver in Oil from what I have read and can afford. I want a warm not overly detailed sound as Klipsch already has lots of detail and does not need to be "livened up" they need lush smooth sounding caps. Hope I have made the right choice?

When the crossover is in I will do a initial impression on same lp's. Right now it goes from really bad (on what may be worn vinyl) to not as bad but NOT great on great vinyl. (I know the quality of the vinyl because tested on other speakers Linn)

The new caps are Mundorf Silver in Oil and new copper foil inductors are coming. I will at the same time be rewiring the speakers to 12 guage from the lamp cord that PWK put in. PWK was a master at getting very good sound often with crap by today's standards components.

The choice of speakers would be a toss up now depending on what I am listening to. Klipsch vastly more dynamic but if the breaking up of the sound becomes to much to effect enjoyment the Linn would be a better choice on that Lp. If I could I would switch a button back and forth between speakers depending on song and how bad the break-up sound was bothering me.

volleyguy

Showing 19 responses by roxy54

Grannyring,
Good points. Besides that, buying "better kit" as we all know by now, does not guarantee that all of the parts are the best that they can be.
I owned a pair of Spendor 9/1 speakers which cost around 6 grand in the early 90's. When I decided to upgrade the crossovers myself, I found that they were full of cheap Bennics also. I put in a bunch of Mundorf and Sonicaps and new wiring and the difference was very noticeable.
What a saga...you are a very patient man with a great deal of time on your hands. Congrats.
Volleyguy,
I have followed your journey, and I am aware that you go through all of your laborious capacitor experiments in the interest of better sound. With that in mind, I reccomend that you spend a small amount of money, and try AMR fuses in your gear that requires fuses. At only $20.00 a pop, I think you will be surprised and very pleased with the results.
Voleyguy,
I am the wrong person to ask about the science of fuses, or any other science for that matter. I do, however, know what I hear, and I was only suggesting that for a small amount of money, you might be surprised by the positive sonic result of trying the AMR fuses.
I used Neotech when rewiring Spendor 9/1 speakers a few years ago, replacing what appeared to be multistrand lamp cord, and was very pleased with the result.
I used Neotech to rewire some Spendors on the bass driver, and that was never mentioned to me. I don't unerstand how this bulk high purity wire could be directional. If it was me, I wouldn't sweat it.
I bought an Audio Note DAC 2.1 from Audio Note Kits about 5 months ago. I had it assembled (immaculately) by Digital Pete, who is officially sanctioned by Audio Note Kits to assemble their kits. I asked him if he could use the lower end Duelunds as the coupling caps, and he did so for an additional $400.00. I have to say to anyone who may have just added a Duelund cap to any component...be patient! It sounded good right away, and better in 2 weeks, but it is only after a little less than 5 months that I am finally hearing what they do when they are broken in. They are so natural sounding, and so worth the money.

Volleyguy1,
You were probably thinking that you wanted to have money left over for groceries! They are expensive for mere mortals. I would have loved them in my DAC too.
Reynolds853,
Thanks for that link. I think there may have been an answer to everyone's questions buried within the article. After an explanation of the long process of consructing the Cast capacitor with paper and copper foil and oil (very interesting process), there is a picture of what appears to be Cast capacitors that look the same as the oil and paper Cast capacitors, and the writer explains that they are a new product, Cast mylar capacitors.
This might explain Grannyring's experience with opening up one that appeared to be all plastic.
Audioman58,
Interesting and informative, but please slow down a bit. With the typos etc. it is very difficult to read. Thanks.
Volleyguy,
I was very interested in your observation that the Jupiters were sounded overdamped at first. I took delivery of a Audio Note Kits Kit 1 Tenth Anniversary 300b integrated 2 weeks ago,(professionally built for me by Digital Pete) and for a variety of reasons, I didn't have a lot of time to put hours on it. When I ordered it, I specified (and provided) (4) 0.22 Jupiter copper foil output caps. When I first started to listen, I was surprised by the poorly extended and bouncy, overdamped bass. Not being used to SET amps to begin with, I was a little alarmed. I knew efficiency was not a problem with my speakers.
Anyway, just a short time into break-in now, the bass is loosening up as well as becoming more extended. Overall, very happy with the sound, although I know there is a lott more burning in to go.
I want to say thanks to you, Charles and Grannyring for making me aware of these caps. I wanted really good ones, and even if I could have afforded Duelund CAST, or even the less expensive series that I have in my DAC, they would not have fit in the shallow chassis of the amp.
Hi Charles,
They do offer options. I opted for the Khozmo attenuator upgrade (I bought it as an integrated, it can also be configured as an just an amp) and the C core transformers, which are actually the biggest and most expensive difference between the 10th Anniversary and the regular unit.
Hi Grannyring,
I am interested in the WE 16 gauge wire, and I know this question has been asked before, but since you are knowledgeable about the subject, I will ask you.
Is there still any reliable source you can recommend that still may have this cloth coated wire, or the plastic coated. Finally, is the plastic coated worth buying or is it inferior?
Thanks, John

I also had a problem with oil leaking from a Duelund capacitor a few years ago. No support from Duelund or Parts Connextion.