Schu in that Titus is somewhat efficient and does not do much bass below 60 hertz or so a few good watts should go relatively far with chamber music in particular. Give it a shot and let me know how it turns out. I have visions of a set amp someday myself starting with the Titus and seeing how it goes. I would expect some good things to be heard. |
Do you still have the Triangle Titus?
I've always thought these would do quite well with a set for a lot of music including chamber for not much.b. I would give mine a shot before looking elsewhere. |
Having said all that, being one who is always ont eh lookout for something a little different, I greatly look forward to testing the SET amp waters myself someday soon starting with modest expectations 9and my triangle Titus speakers if I still have them)and seeing where things might go from there. |
A few watts shows its limitations most with lower frequencies. Either the speakers have to make up for the lack of muscle needed to produce quality bass by being very large and if also good quality very expensive, or else you have to punt on the bass to some extent with the speakers depending on your needs. You can have 2 or three bass, efficiency, or small size but not all three.
I heard large more expensive and "efficient" Zus off a set amp at a show a few years back. Sounded very good for smaller scale classical works but not for works requiring more power and muscle in the delivery. The Zu guy admitted the SET was underpowered for all kinds of music. He chose his demos carefully to play well within the limitations until I asked for something more challenging.
I think my little Titus speakers could have done equally well as the Zus (Essence I believe) with the music demoed. If they had used a more suitable powered amp then I think the results may have justified the cost of those Zus. The demo was clearly put together to convince people the Zus were suitable for use with a SET amp but they were definitely quite limited depending with the SET.
So I take all adverts regarding teh capabilities of "high efficeincy" speakers off a few watts of power with grains of salt. Maybe in some cases.
The only demo I have ever heard where a flea powered set performed top notch with all kinds of music involved very high efficiency, large and expensive custom Goto horns. I suspect other very high efficiency horns like Avantegarde can do the job as well. But I doubt any speakers are efficient enough to truly perform top tier off a few watts in lieu of being highly horn loaded to gain the efficiency needed. Even then large bass units are required to fill in the low end.
So I think one just has to be realistic about the limitations. For smaller rooms, lower volumes, and music forms where lower octaves do not mean much, you are golden with smaller high quality moderate efficiency speakers in many cases, but the ante increases exponentially from there. |
Also with a good quality powered sub or two set up just right, almost anything is possible otherwise. So there is always that very practical option available to help pick up the slack whenever needed. |
In that one cannot have all three of bass, efficiency and small size in a speaker its a useful exercise to rate a hifi speaker in each of these categories.
Being conservative on a scale of 1-10 for my Triangle Titus XS:
bass - 6
efficiency - 7
small size - 9
I also have Realistic Minimus 7s that I think could work well within their limits off a SET amp
bass - 4
efficiency - 5
small size - 10
Dynaudio Contour 1.3 mkII
bass - 7
efficiency - 4
small size - 8
OHM 100 Series 3
bass - 8
efficiency - 6
small size - 6
Adding good powered sub set up well to the mix eliminates the limitations in most all cases. |
Now, I will wait to hear results with Triangles and SET or SEP, if you are still inclined to take things even further in that direction. The EE amp seems pretty sweet already. Its one I have considered as well from time to time. |
My understanding is use of one output tube versus multiple tubes that must be "integrated" well as discussed above is the inherent advantage of a SET.
The downside is the power limitation and the distortion that comes into play if the amp is pushed hard at all.
So its a very clean pure and simple circuit design that is the benefit but the "slack" must be picked up elsewhere, by the speakers which correspondingly have to be very efficient and a very easy load otherwise you cross into high distortion territory a lot faster than with other more "scaled up" designs. |
Shu, I heard the Glow audio Single Ended Pentode design amp at a show a couple years back and thought the sound to be one of the best of show. Very nice product that will not break the bank!! I think think it was running with Audio Note speakers of some sort, or something similar, but not sure.
Some of the Decware amps have also caught my eye for just a bit more.
I think the speakers to be used and kinds of music to be played and how loud more than ever are perhaps the biggest considerations in determining what simple topology tube amp to choose. You can spend as much as one chooses on either amp or speakers depending. The work involved to deliver music realistically never changes, but there are many ways to skin that cat. |
If building around a particular SET amp, its only gonna pay to hear speakers with the chosen amp more so than ever. What speakers sound like with other amps will not mean much.
Schu already has the Triangle Titus speakers to try with his current EE amp and then maybe with teh new SET that I think have a chance to work well. I would wait to hear that first before making any other moves regarding speakers. |
Schubert, you made my day.
Glad to hear it seems to be working well. This may well accelerate my plunge towards a flea powered tube amp to use my Triangle Titus XS sooner rather than later.
Just goes to show to always take specs with a grain of salt. I see no reason why most any amp including SET would not do well with the Triangles. They are hard to beat in their price range as you describe and they have a reputation from users for sounding best with tube amps to start. |
My Triangle Titus have been the bomb for several months now in my wife's 12X12 cathedral ceiling sunroom, running off the 500 w/ch Bal canto ref1000m Class D amps in the basement below (via in-wall speaker wires I had run when the house was built).
So when I throw a flea powered tube amp at them some day, the other end of the amp spectrum essentially, it will be very interesting. They are the only speakers I own that might sound even better perhaps with just a few pure watts of tube amp power, but they are hard to fault as running currently even. |
AL just a gut estimation but I suspect the 90 db estimate to be reasonable based on the relative volume I achieve off the Titus compared to the other speakers I run off the same amp, dynaudio monitors and the Ohm Walsh both of which are generally rated a few db less efficient. The Titus are significantly more efficient and go louder much faster. The tradeoff for their size is the last octave of bass or so which helps make them a good match to a flea powered amp despite their small size. As mentioned they also employ a very simple crossover I seem to recall. Also as Schubert mentioned they use a lightweight paper cone bass driver and are very fast and detailed. They were the speakers that succeeded in weaning me off Magneplanar a number of years back. |
Insanity is a very effective pastime. 🤑 |
I have Isoacoustics stands under my Triangle Titus. The difference was huge, night and day in detail, soundstage, imaging, bass articulation. Herbie dots are a similar product to help isolate speakers from floor and room acoustics I believe so similar results not surprising. One would never know what the Triangles are capable of in my house without addressing the acoustic isolation issues. |
Ironically, I was looking at those Mapleshades and almost jumped. Then I found the Isoacoustics that appeared to address the same issues for 1/3 the cost and with many rave reviews on Amazon. Much different aesthetics though. isoacoustics are designed for pro use. Will be interested to hear about the Mapleshades. |
