Better DAC or better Streamer

I stress these are my own opinions and experiences and would in no way seek to diminish the experience of others who can justify the additional expense.

I can understand that streamers are not all the same but we may have a situation here, where once you reach a yet to be determined sweet spot there will be little sonic value in spending more. My question is; has the diminishing returns argument ever appeared more appropriate than applied to the realm of the streamer?

I guess I am suggesting that a streamer is a relatively simple machine that can be implemented at many levels. I recall using a PC in the past but software and noise were always an issue. So I get that a dedicated box is the way to go but beyond the use of a decent power supply, utilizing a well thought out circuit designed to reduce noise and populated by good components, there appears to be little opportunity for sonic improvement in employing super expensive esoteric components etc.

So short of the aesthetic and case work being pleasing on the eye and having a psychological feel good factor, it leaves GUI and software to consider, do you need a screen what services are available on the platform is their software upgraded regularly etc.

However for me, paying beyond a certain price/quality point for a standalone streamer is simply wasted money that could return more sonic bangs for the buck elsewhere, Namely the Chord Company DAVE DAC.

There is a school that suggests 30% Streamer and 70% DAC. Based on some recent listening in my system, I am going to stick my neck out and suggest as high as 20/80 Streamer to DAC could well be appropriate.

Now where this ceiling is with streamers has never been easy to determine and no one seems to be able to suggest a price beyond which there is no discernible sonic benefit.

Since the original questioner asked what would be the better upgrade, I believe it to be by any measure the DAVE DAC. It leaves some space for enjoyable experimentation to try a couple well regarded inexpensive streamers, some mid price and one or two "High End" ones. Hear for yourself via a resolving high quality DAC and make your own mind up.

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I suppose you could make the same argument for any solid state or a tube amplifier then, yes? So once someone gets to that 2-3K level, there are no further benefits to be had?

Yes I agree on the face of it, we could make that comparison/ argument but it would be a flawed one. When you consider what a streamer does in the chain, there are profound differences between the function of a Tube or SS amp in how their internal components reproduce the signal. A streamer goes nowhere near a music signal, it just hands off a stream of data its collected from a server.

Please forgive me following my maybe flawed or inadequate knowledge, but an amplifier is quite a different animal in a audio reproduction chain.(e.g) I suppose you could define it as the pre-amp and or power amp is processing the actual music and where as the streamer is collecting one’s and zeros.

For instance, of course you will know, in a push pull, transformer driven tube amplifier, there are many differences and quality indicators apparent when using better components, such as quality driver and power tubes which have an undeniable measurable and audible impact, if say a tube amp is capacitor coupled, the choice of cap’s and values will both profoundly affect the sound quality and signature, and there are more we could add and therefore there is a logical correlation between components ad sound quality, although many high end brands milk it by applying snake oil prices to HIFi gear more generally.

I have always thought of streamers as not even powerful PC’s, but as packet receivers, running bespoke software to allow us humans to understand the recompiled files via a rudimentary GUI.

For the uninitiated of which there are probably not many on our forum, so I will keep it respectfully short. When we select a track to play, the streamer communicates with the streaming service’s server to request the music file, the music file is transmitted from the server to the streamer in small units called data packets. Each packet contains a portion of the music file along with information about how to reassemble the data

The streamer simply receives these packets and reassembles them into a continuous stream of digital audio data. Just like a PC. this process is managed via industry standard protocols such as TCP (Transmission Control Protocol) and IP (Internet Protocol), which ensure that packets are delivered in the correct order and without errors. It then says over to you "DAVE" turn this little lot into music and that’s all the streamer does.

What it does is very well known in the computing world and the internet does send data packets at a staggering rate, approaching 0.5 zettabytes daily and all pretty much with extremely low error rates.

The streamer is then a after-all, just a singe application a focused but less noisy PC Its not even a "source" using the definition we all understand, It isn’t an all rounder it has but has but one job, collect data and pass it to a DAC.

So I find it incomprehensible to speculate that a streamer can have as much or as some have said more influence of the systems Sonic’s as a DAC.

If it’s not data compiling or error correction that defines its "better" sound as they all do that job and the as part of the defined internet protocols or its not a special "buffer"circuit, is it processor and or RAM speed? If someone has the answers I would genuinely, really like to know how..

As I have said I believe there are better ways to build streamers as some brands do very well but only to a point. As long as they collect compile and hand off like they should and noise is controlled, why would we expect anything more other than fancy App’s and or GUI’s or billet aluminium chassis etc..

Since the original questioner asked what would be the better upgrade, I believe it to be by any measure the DAVE DAC. It leaves some space for enjoyable experimentation to try a couple well regarded inexpensive streamers, some mid price and one or two "High End" ones. Hear for yourself via a resolving high quality DAC and make your own mind up.

I would just qualify the answer I gave as assuming you would be looking to use a standalone streamer with the DAVE, if not then of course, moving from a DAP to a decent streamer is the first option