Best Way for my TT to reach my Pre-Amp!?


I have a Rega Planar 3 that sits a few feet too far away to reach my Marantz AV7704 phono stage.

whats the best way to reach my Marantz preamp processor with the short 2 foot phono cables that come with the Rega?

It sounds like rca extensions are going to cause too much capacitance and there is also a difference between phono extension cables and rca cables. Please teach me! 
craigert

Showing 21 responses by craigert

The problem is that I then need to bipass the phono Input of the Marantz which I have read is better than most other phono preamps I can buy. Will the added capacitance of an rca extension hurt the high end that much? 
How much will I need to spend on a phono preamp yo match the quality of the Marantz?

For instance, I don’t want to buy a phono preamp and have the sound be worse than having a longer phono cable. 
I will work on getting you more info. You guys are the best! Thank you all!

My cartridge is a Nagaoka MP-110!
Ok dumb question. When I buy a phono preamp, will no longer use the phono input of my preamp processor and will instead use the CD line level inputs correct?
Great to know thank you Al! 
I already wrote Marantz about the phono input capacitance. I will write them about the line level input impedance as well. 
I wish I understood how that all worked. Impede sounds like it’s resisting something. So if the Marantz has low impedance then why would a tube amp have a hard time with it? So would I also want to make sure the operating ohms of a tube amp is on the higher end and closer to 30-40k?
I have never been so excited to have to spend more money. Lol

My TT setup with my Monitor Audio Golds is already showing greater sound to my ears than my CDs, but that’s a whole other conversation/argument for another thread.

ok so here is the deal. I’m going to buy a phono preamp. The question is tube or solid state. If I buy solid state I have to go with my favorite brand from France, Atoll. I have a couple of their amps, and they absolutely blew away my $4500 Anthem A-5. I don’t even want the A-5 anymore but I’m keeping it to push surrounds in an Atmos theater I am building in the basement. 
I know just enough to be dangerous with this stuff, but with my Atoll amps I feel like there are little people inside of my speakers making the music. 
Haha thanks! I look young. I’m 46 years old though. I was probably like 38 in my profile pic back when I was still doing tournament paintball/speedball.  
I thought the AV7704 was the exact same as the former Marantz flagship AV8802 which is why I thought it might have a decent phono stage. 
Can somebody teach me how the capacitance works for matching to my Nagaoka MP-110? 
Thanks Al. I found a report that the cartridge capacitance for the MP-110 is either 100 or 300.

Is the goal to get the capacitance of the tone arm, phono cable, and input capacitance of the preamp to match the recommended total capacitance of the cartridge? 

What are your thoughts on tube preamp vs solid state. 
Gosh thanks everybody. I don’t think I have the time to address each one of you, but I want to make a few points as to where I am with all of this. 

I want to go back and study all of the impedance stuff because it’s interesting and I want to learn. 
I don’t think the Rega P3 has a separate ground wire.

I have decided on a new phono stage because it’s pretty unanimous it will give me better sound as well as solve my short cable problem. In this journey have learned to make my own Duelund interconnects for when I buy a phono stage. 
I either want to buy a Schiit Mani, Atoll P200SE, or tube phono stage which I haven’t researched enough yet.

I am not quite sure why the Marantz is the limiting factor since it’s just a preamp processor and I am using the best amp I have ever heard in my limited experience, using the Atoll 500 to biamp my MA Golds. However, I am not disagreeing with you, I just didn’t think the Marantz was doing very much in the equation. 

First, I love the analogies of Miller Carbon! It really paints the picture!

Also Greg, that makes total sense the way you explained it! Thank you!

Ok, so is there something you recommend that will act as a phono preamp that can also bipass the Marantz and go straight to my Atoll Amp being shared with the Marantz? 
I can’t stress enough the difference between the Atoll and the Anthem. How can a $4500 A5 Anthem sound like complete garbage next to the $2000 Atoll? It’s flat and dead where the Atoll is like sitting in the pit of an orchestra. 
All,
Thank you for the blue jeans cable suggestions but I make my own interconnects using either cardas rca connectors or neutrik balanced XML with Duelund oil infused cotton wrapped wire from Germany. If you haven’t heard about it, Google it. It’s great stuff! 
So just exploring I extended the TT phono cables to connect to the preamp using phono input selector. It introduced an intense hum only present on the phono input.

Is this due to the fact that my rca extension cables are not grounded like the TT phono cables? Now remember that I have a Rega and the grounding is not done through your typical separate grounding wire.
I used my own cables to extend the TT cable as well as purchased RCA cables. They both resulted in noise and hum in the phono stage of my Marantz. 
The crazy thing is this was a brand new P3 and I’ve used it without any trouble for a few months, then all of the sudden rumble from nowhere, so I moved the whole setup thinking the speaker was too close to the TT only to make the TT too far away from the Marantz and still rumble and now hum when the phono input is selected, and the TT isn’t even powered on! I have tried two different amps as well and the hum is still there, and I have a hum X on the amp power line plugged directly into the outlet in the wall. 
Thanks Al! I do t know why I didn’t think of getting back to basics. I’ll troubleshoot and report back. 
All,

The TT is turned OFF for the following troubleshooting. 
I play the system fine on every other input. As soon as I turn the input on the Marantz to Phono, there is hum. 
How can this be? 
Ok I think we are onto something.

First, the noise didn’t change when I moved the Marantz around. Second, I have a second Marantz (same one) that I tried and the noise was exactly the same.

Third, even though the TT was turned off I decided to remove the phono cables extensions and it got rid of the hum. I’m assuming it got rid of the ground hum since there is no ground wire coming from a Rega table to connect. 
HOWEVER, even though the hum is gone, in the phono selection of my Marantz when I crank it up there is a smooth hiss like the ocean. Is this inherent in all phono or will an external preamp that is of higher quality get rid of this?

Finally, the rumble problem is still there but that’s different issue. 
Also,I don’t have an external phono preamp to try at the moment. I will be ordering one soon though. 
Guys,
I may have figured it out and I would like to get your opinion. The P3 mass is 11 g. My Nagoaka MP-110 cartridge is 6.5 g with only a 6 for dynamic compliance. Using an online calculator this puts the resonant frequency at a 15-16 Hz!I believe it’s supposed to be around 10 Hz correct?
Do you agree this is most likely my problem?