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Best tube amp for electrostatic speakers

For over 35 years I've almost exclusively used either ribbons or electrostats with solid state amplification and have been generally happy with the sound. Over the last several years, though, my hearing has become somewhat degraded and more sensitive to certain frequencies. The frequencies which seem to cause the most discomfort occur in the 1400 to 1900Hz range and come across as "bright" to my hearing. After researching this matter and having been given some expert advice, I've decided to pursue the idea of replacing my present amplification equipment with tube based gear.

The purpose of this post, then, is to solicit advice regarding the best approach to making this decision based on the following information: the current basic equipment is Shanling Solid state CD player, Peachtree Audio Nova used as preamp, two DBX 1531 EQ's to help compensate for age related hearing loss, Peachtree 220 amp, Silversonic T114 cable and Martin Logan Ethos speakers.

The listening area is our living room measuring 15 by 22 feet with my listening position 16 feet from the plane of the 2 speakers which are positioned 11 feet apart measured center to center. Located between the 2 speakers is an entertainment center which is about 9 feet wide. My listening interests are varied from solo guitar and light jazz to occasional orchestral music. I don't generally listen at high volumes and am not particularly interested in strong bass except for the rare action movie background.

Unless not advisable for some reason, I would like to keep the Peachtree Nova as a preamp because of the significant latitude for source connection and what seems to have a decent internal DAC. If this option would substantially defeat the purpose of the intended modification I would work around it. I can no longer deal with sounds that are "bright" which I now find uncomfortable but detailed sound is very important.

So, the questions are: is the move to tubes the best option and, if so, what might be some reasonably priced amps that could accomplish the goal. This, of course, would take into consideration room size, etc. for determining power requirements. If there are other more practical and less expensive options to consider, I would appreciate that advice as well.
128x128broadstone

Showing 5 responses by zd542

zd542
5,339 posts
 
"So, the questions are: is the move to tubes the best option and, if so, what might be some reasonably priced amps that could accomplish the goal."

There's no guarantee that tubes will help. They can be bright just like SS. I would focus on getting the right gear regardless of whether its tube or SS. Also, just getting something that sounds rolled off/warm, probably fix your problem. I think your issue is more of a timbre/refinement problem in the high frequencies. For example, a cymbal can often sound like a harsh noise, and not a cymbal. If you can correct HF problems like that, you should be able to listen to your system.
zd542
5,339 posts
 
"Labtec, I got out the old test CD and tried listening to pink noise but didn't quit get the part about a comparison. The test disk presents pink noise starting at the left speaker, then right, then simultaneously, both in and out of phase. The thing I didn't expect nor understand is that the out of phase sound was almost exclusively from the right speaker. I'm sure I'm missing something here."

For the in phase test, pink noise coming from the left speaker should sound like its coming from the left speaker. Same thing with the right speaker. Both speakers simultaneously in phase should come from a center image between the speakers, just like a main vocal track.

If both speakers are playing pink noise simultaneously, but out of phase, the should be coming from 1 side. The location is usually somewhere between one of the speakers and the side wall.

If you're still not sure, there is an easier way to do this. First, play a CD you know well and that normally has a strong center vocal image. If you do hear a center vocal image the way its supposed to, that will indicate that you don't have a phase problem. (The type of phase that we are talking about here. There are different kinds of phase related issues.). I recommend you do 1 more test, just so you know what this type of thing sounds like. Go to just 1 of your speakers and reverse the speakers cables position on the binding post. (Put the + speaker cable on the - terminal, and put the - speaker cable on the + terminal.) Now, if you go back to your listening chair and play the same vocal track again, you will then see the vocal image shift to one side.
zd542
5,339 posts
 
Broadstone,

"To answer one question regarding the comparison of live versus recorded music, especially using the piano for reference, we have a piano and, yes, the same notes either recorded or live create the same discomfort. This fact, of course leads me to the conclusion that it is not a component of my system that is the culprit for at least this issue."

Looking at the above quote, the one thing that stands out is the fact that you have the same problem when you hear real instruments live. I think there's a very good chance that you will not fix this problem with equipment. Think of the live piano as the best or perfect stereo system there is. There's no where else to go. If you want to continue to listen to music, you may have to go in a non audiophile direction. Maybe just something for low volume background listening, or something similar. I wish that I was able to suggest some better options for you, but I can't. Hopefully, someone else will come up with something.
zd542
5,339 posts
 
"01-22-15: Mapman
Zd,

Well, there you go then. I don't doubt it can be done with the right amp and sound very good. I'll keep my eyes open for a chance to hear ML and tube amps myself."

OK, but how? If the OP can't listen to live acoustical instruments like a piano, what can be done? At first, we thought the problem may be an issue of timbre. Obviously, that can't be the case because you can't get better timbre than the actual instrument itself. And as a general rule, high end audio strives to reproduce that piano as accurately as possible.

Just to be clear, my last post on using tube amps with ML speakers was just to give actual examples that not only is it possible, I've seen ML themselves do it. I'm not saying tubes are the answer here. Given the type of problem the OP has, all the amps I can think of that may somehow address the issue are all solid state. For me personally, I approach a problem by focusing on the end results needed. I love tube gear, but I won't buy something just because it uses tubes. It has to be the right solution, or you just make the problem bigger.

So, going back to the problem at hand, what is the end result that we are looking for here? That's where I'm at a loss. If we don't know where we need to end up, and if its achievable, I don't see how we can fix anything. But that's just me. There's a lot of smart people here, so I'm hoping to be proven wrong.
zd542
5,339 posts
 
"Relatively few ML owners use tube amps I would think. Tube amps have never been in the picture."

Actually, that's not true. I've seen many ML systems that were powered by tubes. Here's a few examples.

My VAC 30/30 had no problem driving my SL-3's. A good friend of mine is very into vintage gear, and have seen him power his CLS's with many different tube amps, even SET's (I know that's not the perfect match, but I thought it worth mentioning because the amps were very low power.), A dealer I know well sells ML as his main line of speakers and always had them paired with Jadis and Sonic Frontiers tube amps. I was invited to a staff meeting after hours at a B&M store that I did a lot of business with, for a new product demo (Prodigy) with and Gayle Sanders, and he set them up with an ARC VT-100. One of the magazines, TAS I think, put together a recommended system consisting of an ARC VT-50 and the Aerius or SL3 (can't remember as it was a long time ago.). Singer demoed the SL2's with an ARC Classic 60 and CJ 11-A.

I could keep going on and on with the examples. But I think pairing ML and tubes is much more common than you think.
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