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Benefit of Tube Dampers/Coolers on 6H30?

A quick search of the forums led me to the belief that the effectiveness of tube dampers and coolers is dependent on the tubes used.

I'm auditiioning an Ayon CD-2, and want to really hear what it's capable of before deciding to keep it (which I'm leaning toward anyway).

I'm curious about how beneficial dampers and coolers are on 6H30 tubes. And if they are helpful, which to use? I saw Mrtennis recommended the EAT coolers/dampers (http://www.elusivedisc.com/prodinfo.asp?number=MHEATDAMP)in another thread, and he stated they tamed some of the mid/treble glare in his unit, which is exactly the issue I have with the performance of the CD-2 right now. OTOH, it seems Herbie's halos (http://herbiesaudiolab.home.att.net/)are the most popular choice, although I sense the EATs are fairly new.

Then there are these, with a choice of brass or copper: http://www.audiotubes.com/damper.htm

These, which look very much like the EATs, but cheaper: http://www.partsconnexion.com/Advertising/audiogon/pearl.html

These for the *really* brave: http://www.realhamradio.com/liquid-cooling.htm

And I recently saw some coolers/dampers somewhere that looked like the EAT and pcX, but longer, covering almost the entire tube, although I can't find them now.

I'm a bit lost. Are any of these products superior to the others? Do any of them change the sound in different ways than the others? Would it be beneficial to combine products, such as Herbie's and the EAT on the tubes?

Are the 6H30 tubes so good they don't suffer from microphonics and other common tube characteristics such that the use of any of these devices would render little if any beneift?

Thanks to all for your thoughts.

HC
aggielaw

Showing 8 responses by samhar

samhar
1,048 posts
 
Aggielaw how's the listening progressing?
samhar
1,048 posts
 
The 6H30 based designs that I've heard had the "glare" you mentioned. The soundstage is bigger, images have greater separation and dynamics are increased, impressive at first listen, correct? I also found the decay to be very rapid and harmonics thin and short. Not SS but not tube.

I have a ARC CD3 MKll (SS) and wondered if the ARC CD7 (6H30 based) would provide some tube fullness to the mids and highs, specifically for female vocals. A friend brought his over and within minutes I wanted to pull it for the CD3 MKll .

I also owned a new amp with a 6H30 based impute section, it had the same traits, it's been sold after 550 hrs break-in. I wanted it to work but...

I checked out Stealth Cloud "9" P/C's they appear similar to V/D three wire design which I have owned. I found the V/D PC's were an aggressive cord and produced a similar sonic presentation to the 6H30 gear I mentioned. I pulled the V/D for a "stock" cord , better( in my system w/ my CDP). I bought a Purist Musaeus lower end of the line P/C trying to find a warmer less in your face cable. It worked great for my digital, did it create an $8500 CDP? No, but it did help with fuller highs, mids and bass.

I think the 6H30 has a hi-fi not a hi-end sound. I haven't heard any BAT gear
so I have no experience with VK's 6H30 designs.
samhar
1,048 posts
 
PS I'm ready to take my whuppen like a man!!!
samhar
1,048 posts
 
I think your hearing exceptionally, it's hard to stay the course with everyone's impute ( some probably have a horse in the race) and keep saying to yourself that just sounds forward and bright to me!! I live in a hot bed of ARC systems with people that love and defend "that" sound. Triple expresso vs Single Malt Scotch.
I didn't mean to say changing cords will make that great a difference with 6H30 design gear. It will just be less forward and thin not a change in the basic sound with the stock cord.
The tube dampeners will only take away what your trying to get, a rich warm tube bloom.(something that will never happen with the 6H30)
I pulled the dampers off the 6922's and 12AX7's in my Calypso preamp to get a richer sound. I like gear with 6922's, 12AX7's ETC. that permit me to modify the sound depending on my moods or the type of music I'm listening to, something you would be giving up.
Keep us appraised of your progress.
Sam
samhar
1,048 posts
 
Eee3 the stock 6H30 tubes in my now sold ARC VS-115 amp which I wanted to like and gave a fair amount of time to break in but never could quite like. I think the designers are stuck with this tube and are doing the best they can with a tube that's sonic characteristics aren't close to the 6922, 7308, 6DJ8,12AX7 and 12AU7 etc. They can't design for these tubes because there aren't enough around and so far the Russians and the Chinese haven't been able to produce tubes with comparable sonics. My experiment cost me a fair amount of money and my intention here is to back Aggielaw's impression of the sonics of the CD 2 , not to change his mind but to support his experience by making him aware that " its not him" others hear similar things!
samhar
1,048 posts
 
Sorry I was not aware that the nos tube were an enormous improvement over stock 6H30's. If there is a big difference in sound then Aggielaw might want to borrow some from the dealer so he knows what he's buying.
samhar
1,048 posts
 
Anything new or old to share about the CDP's?
samhar
1,048 posts
 
Since this thread started I purchased a C/J Act 2 (6H30p) that outperformed my previous Aesthetics Calypso (12AX7, 6922) and for many months I have been satisfied with the improved, dynamics, extension and inner detail the Act 2 brought to my system.
In an attempt to change/improve I rolled in some Electro Harmonix 6H30pi's that were fuller in the mids but less extended and dynamic than the stock Sovteks a trade-off I wasn't willing to make so the Sovteks went back in.
I'd held back from trying NOS Reflector 6H30p-DR because so many have said they weren't a big improvement if any improvement at all.

Eee3
You are correct on many counts!
I made a blanket statement without full knowledge/experience and to any that may have been negatively effected I apologize. (I apologized to Mr Tennis months ago for a related statement)
The NOS '83 Reflector 6H30p-DR's are an improvement over the other 6H30p tubes in my C/J Act 2 and by no small amount!!! I think the difference is comparable to the differences between a Sovtek 6922 and an Amperex US 7308 PQ White Label in all respects.

Aggielaw
If you haven't tried the NOS DR's it may solve what was bothering you or simply improve what you already like, they added a good amount of "fullness" as well as dynamics and extension to my system.
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