I enjoy my Bedini Clarifier 2, and wouldn't even consider spending more. It's that good. The other models are a good way for the dealers who carry them to help make their Mercedes payments. If you want to help your dealer out with his luxurious perks, then go right ahead. |
Carl, do you find Bedini must be used every time CD is played, to get max benefit? Which Cds benefit most from clarifacation, and what areas of sound are enhanced? I must say Bedini II at $150 is easier to swallow, regards Sam |
They're all a bunch of crap. Don't you people realize that CDs are made of aluminum and plastic? Neither of those are magnetic. Even if there were trace elements of cobalt, nickel, or iron, it would be too insignificant to have any effect. We're only talking a few molecules here. It's right up there with green marker pens and the YBA blue light. And Voodoo, and.... I'm open to arguements. Let's have it... |
Magnetism of the plastic or the aluminum has far less to do with it, than does the potential energy (static electricity polarization) of the polycarbonate, IMHO. Shayner, don't you think I was skeptical at first, too? I'm not an utter fool, here..........Sam, I've NOT noticed that it affects some discs more than others, seems to be the same always, even on CD-R's. I use it every time I play a disc, if I want to get the maximum benefit. I don't always use it, though. It's nice to be able to choose to use it, or not to. And NO, I'm not one of the "hypertweakers" that feels the need to not only use the green pen, but draw complex star shapes all over the discs. Whether or not that might make an improvement, I'm just not willing to do it. it's time cosuming enough to polish them with Laserguide, and that's necessary. Afterall, polycarbonate is hardly true "highend optical lens quality" material, and the Laser Guide helps as much or more than the Bedini Clarifier. I've compared..............What I hear the Clarifier doing: I notice that detail and dynamics are increased, fatigue goes way down, and smoothness through the whole range is improved. All of those are cliches, but unless I do a comparison right now with a specific CD, I can't get any more detailed than those tired expressions. IT'S LIKE EVERYTHING ELSE, YOU TRY IT, IF IT WORKS FOR YOU, YOU BUY IT. Here's another tired expression: "nuff said".... |
Shayner, tweak items are very interesting because many times the exact scientific reason why they effect the sound is not fully understood. April/2000 issue of Stereophile page 193, Robt Duetsch tries Furutech unit and claims he hears improvement especially on frequently played CDs, and says Furutech provides FFT spectral analysis showing reduction of noise and distortion. My own experiments with heavy duty radio shack de-magnetizer have caught my attention, and I will pursue further....you are obviously correct that aluminum is not magnetic, but motor that drives CD has some magnetic flux which may be stored on CD? Who knows but the quest of the audiophile is to try different things, and use what works best in your system, regards....Sam |
Hi guys. If you want to get rid of static charge on your CDs, Carl, just clean the damn things. Also, CDs won't store magnetic anything, because they're not magnetic. Hey, Carl, maybe if you used a pen to draw on the CDs so they looked more like vinyl, they would sound better. HA! Just kidding. You're a good man. All I'll say is that if it sounds better to you, go for it. The main goal of this hobby is enjoyment, and if that's what it provides, go for it. Happy listening, people! |
Shayner, I just love to read posts from individuals like yourself. It's really comical how someone as yourself, a supposed audiophile, can make such a useless statement... "it would be too insignificant to have any effect". From this statement I can only draw the conclusion that you simply haven't even tried a product like the Furutech RD1 CD Demagnetizer. Note: you did not say that you can not hear a difference. You simply stated that "it would be too insignificant to have any effect". How the hell do you know? Did you try it? So then why don't you let everyone here know whether or not you have listened for yourself and drawn your own conclusion. You see, the major difference here is that dedicated audiophiles like myself will try near anything they get their hands on to improve their system performance and then audition for extended periods and ultimately decide if its' a step in the right direction and ultimately if its' worth the price. Well, in this system, the Furutech stayed. End of story! |
Shayner, I'm sure you're a good guy too, and it's a shame you can't hear my system, so you would understand why I feel the way I do about various things. If you ever travel near me, come by. |
Sam, I've also been wondering about the differences between the Bedini and the Furetech.I own a Bedini and am extremely pleased with the sonic improvements it provides.However,recently it seems utilizing the device produces what I believe is either a static build-up or a magnetizing of the disc.When the disc starts playing it skips terribly until I remove it and touch the bottom of the disc in the data area problably grounding the static/magnetic build-up.Discs not treated by the Bedini don't ever have this problem,but they also don't sound as good as the treated ones.I'd like to known if anyone else has experienced a similiar effect using their Bedini Ultra,and does the Furetech cause the same problem. Dennis |
Dennis, I've not experienced that. |
I do feel sorry for Shayner, as he either 1) do not have extra cash to try out new products, 2) do not have a good system to bring out all the detail and good stuff from a CD, 3) cannot hear any different and just say NO to everything. I can guarrantee that if anyone that has even a decent mid-fi audio system (of course with good cables as well), they will hear an improvement IF the tweak do work. If a cheap CD player that can't pick up all the necessary signal from the CD that it suppose to, I don't think the tweak will help much. I have the luxury to own both the Clarifier I, and the RD-1, plus I tried the Radio Shack thing once when my audiophile friend visited me and bought along the Radio Shack tweak. We do many experiments and here is our observation. The Radio Shack tweak do work BUT it is just a "Better than nothing". The improvement from both the Clarifier and RD-1 are much better. The interesting part is that the Clarifier and RD-1 do improve sonic characteristic in different aspect. One do improve the detail of the high and the image is more focus, while the other do get a tigher bass, but the image is not as good. These symptoms can be created as will, as if the sonic char. is added on to the CD. Every time you apply one tweak to the CD, you will get one sonic char. If you apply the other tweak to the same CD, you will get another sonic char. HOWEVER, if you use the tweaks in a particular order, they will combind the sonic char. of both tweak!! I just don't know why, and it just like magic. I certainly think the Clarifier II will improve over the Clarifier I, but I don't have the money yet. I am happy to apply those tweaks on your CDs if you send me a couple of them of the same title, and let you be the judge. |
Dtsag,Carl I am pretty much a believer now, as this weekend I played 10-15 CDs I am very familiar with in the rock/alt category, I have treated them with Auric Illuminator because they had the familiar treble grain/glare common with mediocre recordings, Auric restored some smoothness to treble.....the radio shack de-magnetizer in every case improved further in this area.....if Bedini is even better I will have to try for sure....the trouble with tweaks is there is always one more to try, heh heh heh......regards Sam |
Hello again, people. For the record, here's my system: JmLabs Electra 905, crossed over with a Mirage BPSS-210 sub. Amp is now an Aragon 8008BB. The Pre is the Aurum. Interconnects are now Delta Labs Silver Ref-7. CD transport is an older EAD T-1000, with a Classe DAC-1. Power cords are all from Gutwire. Speaker cable is MITerminator-2s, a double run(2 pairs) for bi-wiring. I'm still looking for a replacement, not sure what to get yet. DTSAG, I probably make more money in a month than you do in a year. Yes, I tried my friends Bedini, and found it useless. Did you read all of my comments? If it makes you happy and works for you, all the more power to you. I have not tried the Furetech. Carl! I'm sure you have a great system. You've always got good advice here; not all of us have the same opinion, which is what makes this so interesting sometimes. Different points of view are always welcome, minus the personal criticism. Oh, and TONY007, my comments concerned the effects of magnetism on electrical, mechanical, and optical parts of a CD player in relation to it's size/strength. A few stray atoms of a magnetic substance left over from manufacturing will have no effect, physically, on anything. The forces concerned are too small. That means you won't hear them. Yes, I believe cables, etc, make a difference, but others won't. I don't understand why people are so hostile towards others with a different view. I could discuss this stuff with someone all day, but I won't argue. I won't insult anyone, either, or make implications about their lifestyle. That's not what this forum is for. Sharing opinions helps to educate others and let them form their own opinions. Go put on some tunes, grab a favorite beverage, and drop the attitude. Happy listening! |
Audiogon people are the world's best sudioforum! Please jump on me if you will, for what i say now you all already know; but i'll rearrange the events of postings up to now. If gold/aluminum will not magnetise then the cd "treatment" magnetic field can only be inside the minute amount of polycarb.material between the dot and dimple. Being spun at high speed and cutting through a steady magnetic field, this static "generator" definitely will form a certain static-charge pickup pattern on the optical surface. The "pattern" might just be the exact distribution pattern of the dots and dimples due to charged material thickness reference to the surface. To complicate matter, the charges can either be +ve, -ve or neutral, I truly don't know how this enhanced (by Bedini/Furutech) static map influences the optics during playback. Just to detract a little, all of us must have read or even tried the Statmat which does the exact reverse: designed to absorb atatic charges present to neutral for playback. My friend who markets the Statmat locally couldn't convince me to buy one, defference too subtle..maybe the demostudio was too rowdy at the time we tried that.Its the world dearest piece of sheet plastic, 3 sheets to a Bedini. The point is we should alway try to understand in detail, how things work for us (or against us audiophiles,) the way they do. IMHO diehard members Dtsag, Carl, Tony7, Denman,Megasam,Shayner all have true experiences of their own to share and their stand on the issue. I will go for neutralizing the cd to its original intended state by discharging all statics. This is my $0.20 worth. |
Static charges, even large electrical charges won't influence the optical paths, but will wreak havoc with the electrical components, probably by adding noise. Static build up is a negative charge only. Neutral would be no charge at all. |
If your interested in a Bedini Ultra Clarifier, call up Music Direct and ask for Bes ( tell him i sent you ). They have several demo's / trade-ins when people "upgraded" to the Ultra Clarifier II. You can pick these up for a bargain and they work / look fine. It will do what your demagnetizer does, but with much more uniformity and far greater convenience. I think that your somewhere in the Chicagoland area and could have it shipped or even pick it up if you wanted to. They don't have much gear there, but do have a ton of discs to sort through. For the record, i too was a sceptic given my background. I am an electronics tech by trade and own a radio communications business. Don't ask me to explain how the Ultra-Clarifier works, but it does. My observations echo Carl's in the fact that everything sounds more detailed, less fatigueing and much smoother. I initially picked up a used hand-held clarifier and didn't obtain any beneficial results. I gave the desktop model a try and it was a night and day difference. As it turns out, i wasn't using the handheld version long enough to obtain the same benefits as what the desktop model does automatically. And to answer Dennis' question, i've never had any problems with using the Bedini. Sean > |
Sean, thanks for the tip, I already ordered Bedini II from Elusive Disc $150,close to where I now live, Cincinnati. BTW I lived in Chicago from 1979-91 in Lincoln Park, by Fullerton & Clark St, wish I was still there.....but things change. I have no doubt that Bedini II will work, but I think FuruTech design of keeping CD stationary while being treated is better concept, cost is much higher $300-350......thanks for all the useful comments guys....regards Sam |
"Shayner's" right. I had the Bedini Clarifier. Not only is it built cheesy, it's made absolutley no sonic improvements to my ears. In my opinion this classifies as one of Voodoo ripoff tweaks. Save your money. Buy a PS Audio P-300 for real sonic improvement. |
Shayner, it is you who needs to drop the attitude here. What a jerk you are! I quote: "DTSAG, I probably make more money in a month than you do in a year,"...then you are so stupid, you contradict yourself by saying: "different points of view are always welcome, minus the personal criticism". You need to clean up your own back yard on that one. Then you say, "I don't understand why people are so hostile towards others with a differnt view". Neither can I, cause you certainly are! By the way, nothing you have said so matter of factly, is quite as factual as you would like it to be, and none of us have any reason to think that your "views" have any validity at all on the subject of treating CD's with the items in question...you aren't even a civil person, and I have no patience for jerkwads like that. This is my final reply to you. |
Megasam; Thanks for the good thread. I've followed it with interest because I've also been interested in the Bedini Clarifiers. Dtsag-- no offence intended, but your User Name is also an acronym for "Drop The Snotty Attitude Guys" (DTSAG). I didn't pick up on this until Carl put it in capital letters. The thread got a little unruly in places, but I appreciate the GOOD information. Cheers. Craig. |
For those who are uncertain about laying out the $150.-$300 for demagnetizing(static removal),consider the better Radio Shack bulk eraser(under $50.) and give it a try.It has a 30 day full refund policy and you could either keep it ,return it if you hear no change or return it and go for the B C II or the RD1.I have the better R S bulk eraser(dead silent and quicker than BC II) and like it better than the old noisey hand held Bedini. |
While waiting for my Bedini II, I become more and more impressed with results from Radio Shack de-mag unit ($38). Here is how I get best results, get clear 2 sided plastic binder pages from business supply store and cut down 2 sides so remaining square is open two sides and 1 inch bigger than CD diameter. Slide in CD, have music side face up, hold de-mag unit very close to plastic surface, activate and make circular passes for 5 seconds, slowly pull away a couple feet and turn off. CD is now ready for play, reduced treble glare/grain and improved 3D spatial details most noticable, maximum improvement noted on average/below average recordings like rock/alt. If Bedini II can top this I will be impressed, as I will not be able to do without this tweak, I rank this up there close to same level of improvement I hear using Auric Illuminator on same discs ......regards Sam |
I have used my new Bedini II now on many CDs and it is a winner, for whatever reason it reduces HF grain/glare and slightly enhances overall detail resolution. The combination of Auric Illuminator/Bedini II will work wonders on average/below average recordings where change is most noticeable. I have many rock/alt CDs where @75% of HF grain/glare has been removed by this combination, makes them much more listenable. On good recordings the Bedini II effect is much more subtle, but still worthwile. The Furutech may be better unit, I did not audition, but the Bedini II at $150 is well worth the investment, I will be using it from now on, regards Sam |
Hi Sam; Thanks for the thread, the review of the Bedini Clarifier II, and your conclusions. How often do you use the Clarifier? I've been hemming and Hawing about buying one myself. Good info. Thanks. Craig. |
Craig, the whole process is automatic and takes less than 30 seconds, Bedinni II has auto timer, insert CD & push button. I use for every play. Unit is somewhat noisy during spin, I set on folded hand towel to muffle. I have small ornate table by CD library where I place Bedini II, and run through cycle. If you use Auric Illuminator in combination with Bedini II, you can get dramatic improvements on average/below average recordings, which covers many mainstream rock/alt from 60/70/80s. Many places sell for $149 like Galen Carol, Elusive Disc etc. These same places claim Furutech RD-1 is better, but cost is $300-349, I am happy with Bedini II |
Sam; Thanks again, I'll be giving Galen Carol a call. Craig. |
