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Background noise problems

Hi,

I posted around 2 months ago on this issue, but like an idiot, I was due for vacation in Bali a few days after I posted and missed most of the conversation. Anyways, I have tried a few more things and was hoping for some feedback....

Here is my situation: I am getting upper-frequency "snow" coming out of my speakers. My current setup is a Gold-level McCormack DNA-125 amp, Herron VTSP-1a/166 preamp, and Sony 9000es CDP that has been upgraded to VSE Level 6, with Tyler Acoustics Linbrook Signature speakers. Except for the snow that I am getting (sounds like a snowy TV) the system sounds great. Unfortunately, I am hearing the hiss around 20 feet away.

Here is what I have tried so far:
1) substituting a Eastern Electric Minimax preamp for the Herron: less of the hiss sound, but still present. I am assuming the preamp has less gain?
2) Substitute a Consonance CDP for the Sony. Not much change in background hiss
3) substitute a Jolida integrated amp for the Herron/McCormack combo, input from the Sony: this virtually eliminated the hiss

I have had the Herron checked over by Keith, replaced tubes, and everything has checked out. The McCormack was recently upgraded, but it is possible something is wrong there. The Sony unit was also recently upgraded from Level 5 to Level 6, but the hiss was there before the upgrade and still remains.

A few notes: I hear the hiss as soon as the Herron is engaged, whether or not it is receiving an input. The hiss is the same on all inputs, whether or not they have an active input or are not connected. The speakers are basically dead silent when only the amp is engaged.

It makes me think that I have some issue with compatibility in my system with the Herron, but as I am still getting some background noise on the substitute preamp, I am wondering where to go from here. The Jolida intergrated was basically quiet, which is a good sign.

Where should I go from here? I have the makings of a superb-sounding system, but need to get rid of this background noise. It can be heard easily in the music. Thanks in advance!
dawgcatching

Showing 8 responses by dawgcatching

dawgcatching OP
139 posts
 
Thanks for the replies. I also suspect it is related to the preamp, as I have pretty much tried everything else. Keith noted the gain may be an issue, but he couldn't put his finger on a "this is definitely causing the noise" problem. I checked all of the tubes (as did Keith when he had it in) and they have all checked out.

Thorman: I did try changing interconnects, so that wasn't it.

Tvad: The system sounds great except for the hiss, which is so loud that is audible at least 15 feet away. It really detracts from the music, which is why it is really bothering me. It is like looking outside through a really dirty window. My old system used to have a minor hiss, which was slightly annoying but not a deal breaker, but this can be heard through the music at all times.

Mr_hosehead: well, the Jolida was quiet, which was terrific. With regard to musicality, it was really flat and lacking detail. My current components are great, except for that loud hiss that I can't seem to get rid of.

MIsstl: If I need to look at a different preamp, what range would I be looking at for a gain to reduce the noise? If the Herron is 80db, then what would be better, or ideal? Is there a general rule, or is it something I will just have to try and compare? The EE Minimax I tried again last night (which got a bit quieter after I swapped the rectifier tube, and wasn't bad) actually looks higher at a 96db s/n ratio, but that may not compare directly with the 80db you were speaking of (I wasn't familiar with the moving coil input term) .

Also, is there an input resistance mismatch that could be causing this?
dawgcatching OP
139 posts
 
MIsstl,

Yes, I didn't see any gain-setting switches to play around with. I just got the preamp back from Keith at Herron, where he tested the preamp and didn't find anything out of the ordinary. He gave me some things to try (which I did) and it didn't solve the problem). He was very helpful, but in the end, couldn't figure out what was happening, except that it wasn't a faulty preamp, which leads me to believe there is a compatiblity issue with the amp.

I will give the preamp a go in another system.

dawgcatching OP
139 posts
 
Perhaps another thought: does anyone think there could be an issue with speaker cable? I don't see why there would be (I am using Signal Cable bi-wire) but thought I would throw that out there as something I hadn't yet pondered.
dawgcatching OP
139 posts
 
Hi Rodman99999,

I just had my tubes tested, and also have a brand new batch here just in case. I swapped in the new tubes, and had no change. Tubes were my initial thought as well. My other preamp that I tried also has the background noise, although only at around 2/3 the noise of the Herron.
dawgcatching OP
139 posts
 
Well, I called McCormack (talked with Kris I believe) and he gave me a tip that I hadn't thought of (and I don't know why it would even matter). But it did. His idea was to turn the preamp on, with IC's connected to the input, but not to the pre. As mentioned earlier, the amp was dead quiet with IC's connected to the pre (but the preamp was off) and would get noisy as soon as the output tubes were active on the preamp.

Well, with the IC's connected to the amp only, that loud white noise came out of the speakers, but as soon as I plugged in the IC's to the pre and turned it on again, it was quiet.

So, it seems that there is something going on with the amp. As it is under warranty by SMC, I will call Kris tomorrow and see if he has any ideas.

Any reason the amp would be noisy only with the IC's not connected on the preamp side? It made the problem very difficult to diagnose.
dawgcatching OP
139 posts
 
Thanks for the note. I will call McCormack again and see what they say. Another user (4yanx) has my McCormack/Herron setup and loves it. I sent him an email to see if he had any of these issues.

I also saw that Stereophile bit about the high voltage gain on the 225. I don't know if the 125 is the same, but I will ask.
dawgcatching OP
139 posts
 
Thanks. I spoke again with SMC, and they said I was doing the IC test incorrectly. What he suggested instead was that I take the units to my workplace (out in the woods, a resort that has very clean power most likely, as there is power to vacation houses that are empty this time of year). I wanted to try it away from town and any RFI interference that perhaps would be an issue, and this area is pretty remote.

End result was that running through my monitors at work, I had the same issues with the preamp and amp engaged. So, I know it isn't my house electrical nor is it RFI.

As a test, I took my work amplifier home and hooked it up (Arcam A75). It is DEAD quiet, and I am listening to it right now. And, the Arcam has pre-outs, so I hooked those up to the McCormack again. Voila-dead silent.

There is some incompatiblity issue going on here between the amp and preamp. I have had the unit checked out by Keith Herron 2 times in the past 6 months (including the 1a/166 upgrade) and he couldn't find anything wrong. I will give him a ring and see if there is something else that he can think of, some reason why this pre isn't working with the amp. I have picked both his brain and the guys at SMC, and nobody has yet figured out a reason why I would be having this issue.

Thanks again for everyone's help. I will let you know if I ever do find out what is wrong with my pre-amp combo.
dawgcatching OP
139 posts
 
Hi all,

Well, I have more or less figured it out. Due to the sensitivity of my speakers and amp, combined with some noise induced by tubes in general (something ambient in this area that tubes are picking up) a tube preamp is basically out of the question. Every tube pre I have tried just hasn't worked out. I am extremely frustrated right now, but at this point, it is time to step back and look for a good SS pre, or a dead-quiet tube pre (I hear the Dehavilland Ultraverve qualifies on this front).

Thanks to the forum for helping me out, and Keith at Herron and Steve and Kris at SMC Audio for helping me to isolate the problem.
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