B&W DM604 S2 worthy upgrade from DM603 ?

First, I don't see much benefit in having those big 603's as rear surrounds...they'll do nothing for 2-channel music listening, obviously, but even with movies or multi-channel music I don't see them making much difference given the way music and movies are mixed and the content that is distributed to the back channels with multi-channel music or movies. It's usually just ambient sounds, environmental sounds, which will gain very little in going from the 601 to the 603. And do you have a large enough room that it won't look awkward having large tower surrounds?

So the question becomes, how much difference between the 603 and the 604S2 - the main functional difference being the extra woofer. You already have a decent subwoofer, so it's not as if you're desperate for low end help (or you shouldn't be). Is the issue that when you listen to 2-channel music, you just don't like the balance presented from the 603's and you want more low-end presence? Unless this upgrade costs you very little, and the 604S2 are being dumped in your lap for a song, I don't see this changing your system all that much. Again, unless you don't like the way the 603 present 2 channel music, but you indicated you're not unhappy now.

What I don't know is whether the tweeter advancements between the series 1 600's and series 2 were such that you'd do this just for the tweeter change, if there even were many enhancements between series.

This may be an upgrade just for the sake of upgrading and curiosity - I don't know that it'll change your music all that much. Maybe someone who's experienced both series of the 600's can chime in...

long time back I used to own these speakers & wrote a review over on AudioAsylum http://db.audioasylum.com/mhtml/m.html?forum=speakers&n=126156&highlight=DM604S2+review+Bombaywalla&r=&search_url=%2Fcgi%2Fsearch.mpl%3Fsearchtext%3DDM604S2%2Breview%26b%3DAND%26topic%3D%26topics_only%3DN%26author%3DBombaywalla%26date1%3D%26date2%3D%26slowmessage%3D%26sort%3Ddate%26sortOrder%3DDESC%26forum%3DALL

With the electronics I had, I liked this speaker for the money that I paid for it. It's certainly not the best speaker & certainly not the ideal speaker but, like I said, pretty good for the money. Eventually, I sold the pair in favour of a time-coherent speaker & never looked back. I enjoyed my time with the DM604S2.
Hope that this helps.

Thanks for the replies! Unless someone chimes in with something that changes my mind, I think I'll save my money for some other toy!

I'm not as critical of quality as I suspect some of the folks on Audiogon are. I've spent a relatively small amount of money getting a relatively good surround sound system and I'm happy with it. I just realized my Velodyne subwoofer is 17 years old and still going strong, which means my B&Ws are about the same age. If I haven't found a need to upgrade in 17 years, I don't see any reason to do it now, especially for a "slight difference". No need to fix what isn't broken!

First, I don't see much benefit in having those big 603's as rear surrounds...they'll do nothing for 2-channel music listening, obviously, but even with movies or multi-channel music I don't see them making much difference given the way music and movies are mixed and the content that is distributed to the back channels with multi-channel music or movies. It's usually just ambient sounds, environmental sounds, which will gain very little in going from the 601 to the 603.

This was true years ago, however today all channels are discrete, uncompressed, and full bandwidth. A sound may move through the room in anyway imaginable, or be fixed at any place in the room, therefore any two or more speakers may be used to create the sound. Take a look at this picture. Obviously, that jet would sound the same using identical speakers for the front and rear, however using very small rear speakers compared to the front will result in that 747 jet on the front sounding like a much smaller aircraft on the rear. Ideally the best home theater would have identical speakers all the way around, however this is usually not practical without a dedicated room. Take a look a this article, especially the last line. Obviously, action movies will benefit the most from the upgrade, and IMHO, there will be much more than a "slight difference".

So the question becomes, how much difference between the 603 and the 604S2 - the main functional difference being the extra woofer.

Actually, more than just a extra woofer. Series 2 improvements over Series 1 include the following,

1) Redesigned woofers for a much stiffer cone.

2) Redesigned midrange with added phase plug.

3) Redesigned tweeter with Nautilus technology. This also applies to the CC6 S2.

Again, IMHO, there will be more than a "slight difference" between your DM603 and the DM604 S2.

So yes, I recommend the upgrade, but only at a reasonable price, and maybe negotiate to take the CC6 S2 for a better deal.

Hmmm. Now I'm thinking again. What would you say is a "reasonable price" or are we supposed to talk money in the forum? $400/pr, $600/pr, $800/pr? Rather than really asking what they are worth, what I have to determine is - how cheap do I need to get them in order to not be disappointed that I spent the money. Even $800 wouldn't break my bank, but I'd hate to waste it when I could spend it on something else that would make me happier.

And even though I don't have a room that would lend itself to 7.1, I can easily put the DM601 towers in the rear without them looking out of place, so aesthetics is not really a concern.

@Tls49, that's good info regarding the distribution of content across multichannel, I'm glad you pointed all of that out. Using that info, it sounds like more of a benefit than I thought, in re-purposing the 603 from front to back.

Thanks, Bcgator, glad to help.

Smhyde, here's the MSRP for the speakers when new,

DM604 S2 - $1600/pr

CC6 S2 - $350/ea

Assuming the speakers function perfectly, IMHO, price would be an absolute maximum of $650 for the DM604 S2's, and $150 for the CC6 S2, and they would need to be in perfect cosmetic condition with original shipping cartons, carpet spikes, and rubber feet. Ideally, somewhat less would be better, and adjust price for any cosmetic issues. If there is a functional issue, or any physical damage to a driver, price should drop dramatically, as parts are expensive, and it would be best to check availability. It may be possible to see prices higher than this on ebay, which is usually due to a bidding war between two potential buyers, and the seller still has fees of 15-20% after the sale.

If you do decide to go for the DM604 S2's, I would also get the CC6 S2. This would keep a match for the front three speakers, and the Nautilus tweeter in the CC6 S2 is definitely better than the tweeter in the CC6.

Thanks Bcgator,

The speakers seem to sound find, but one thing I did notice that has me a little nervous about them - there appears to be an ever so slight amount of rust on the bolts that hold the speakers in the cabinet. In my area that could be an indication that they were in a waterfront home and subjected to a salty environment. If it's just a tiny bit of surface rust on those bolts, I suppose I could live with that, but I just wonder if that's a warning sign that I should move on for possible other reasons.

Other than that, they appear to be in good condition. I'm sure there are no boxes. I don't know about the carpet spikes and rubber feet.

I don't recall my DM603s coming with spikes - or maybe I have them in storage and have forgotten about them.

Smhyde,
Tls49 has been very helpful here re. info & pricing. I just wanted to add my 2 cents re. pricing: I bought my DM604S2 back in 2001 brand new from the retail store for less than $800/speaker. They always went for a discount. I.E. the street price for brand new speakers was always less than $1600/pair. I believe I paid something like $1400/pair. Today we are in 2014, 13 years later. if you can help it, I would say that you should pay less than $600/pair today after 13 years & a little bit of rust on the bolts holding the drivers in the cabinet.
Given the info provided by Tls49, I agree that the DM604S2 would be a very nice upgrade for you for (hopefully) not too much money.
Of course, my opinion, FWIW. thanks.

Smhyde, if you determine that the rust is due to a salty environment, keep in mind that the internals of the speaker have been exposed to that same environment because this is a ported speaker. The same would not be true for a sealed cabinet speaker.

Tough call, but if this is due to a salty environment, IMHO, I would probably pass on them, unless you can get them extremely cheap.

Tls49 - that's my precise concern... I'd almost want to remove one speaker to look inside. I don't know if they would let me do that (or if it's really as easy as unbolting it).