Add another sub or go with F30's?

Sell the REL and buy the Velodyne DD-15 or DD-18. The on board digital room correction system will take away all the boominess. The new DD series subs from Velodyne are going to change the way all subs are made.

Try the VenHaus cables they are reasonable and sound great. Also, there are many opinions on sub placement. I know that Revel recommneds however, I've read many accounts that subs sound cleaner on the same plane as your main speakers. I think some of the decision may need to be based on one sub vs. two. One sub may indeed like corner placement, but I suspect two would sound better as they may sound too boomy in the corners, and the nodes might cancel each other out. By all accounts two subs are better than one!

I hope somebody might pick up this old thread. I have the M20s and the B15 that a friend wants to sell set up in my living room. I've hooked them up to my current reference system using a Classe Six preamp and Levinson 23.5 amp. WOW! very impressive. The guy also let me take home his Levinson 383 that he had used with the M20s. I am considering buying all his gear for another system. I was wondering if there is any way to use the 383 with the B15, since there is no "pre out" on this integrated amp.

I could use the B15 and the M20s with my Melos SHA-1 preamp and a Levinson 27.5 if need be. The other major concern would be the need for 2 long interconnect runs of ten feet or more so the B15 can be placed in a corner like the instructions state. It seems to me that such long runs and the need to have two sets of interconnects and a subwoofer's electronics in the path between the amp and preamp would be deleterious to the sound. Not only that, but it will be deleterious to the wallet!! It would cost big bucks for 20 ft. of quality ICs. I was thinking of trying Signal Cables Silver Resolutions which could be bought for around $600 for two 10 foot pairs. Ar least you get the option of returning them in 30 days if you don't like the sound. I would have to use a single-ended cable from the Melos to the sub, but I could run balanced from the sub to the ML 23.5.

Any thoughts from those with experience are appreciated.

So, how did this end? Had you tried B15?

Hey Y'all,

I have about the same room set up as you, Garyb6, and I have two Strata IIIs. They are just what the doctor ordered. My room is 22'L x 12.5'w x 9'h and the back of the room, opposite the system, is open to the foyer. I've gone through three other subs, B&W ASW-500, no big deal, Velodyne FSX-12, better, and the Rel Q100. Every time I made a change, the system sounded better but there was something missing. After reading the recommendations hear on the 'Gon, I decided to try two subs. The result is amazing! First off, no standing waves, the opposing subs cancel them out. Second, you have two drivers and two amps doing the work of one. I've got all the output I can handle in a room that is pretty big and they are still as musical as all get out. I also have both of them set up behind my system in opposite corners; I was told, by a rep at Rel, that this is the best way to get the most from these subs. If you check the instructions, it will give you that as well. It is time consuming and tedious but, in the end, very much worth the work. Sugarbrie is correct that these subs do not go down enough to match well with a full range speaker in the future. But, if you get the second sub and set them up right, you won't ever want for full range speaker.

As for under the sub, I replaced the original spikes with Audiopoints on both subs and it tightened up the bass very nicely. I've also had great success with the Shunyata Diamondback power cords. They are not too expensive and you will hear an improvement.......John

I bought one of my REL's from David.

I am using the standard Vansevers power cords on the subs. Have not played around with cords on the subs too much; just something better than the OEM "black thing". I am not currently running double subs. I have separate audio and HT systems.

Sugarbrie, that's what David at Ambrosia said to me a year ago. He suggested the Stadium but I went with the Strata. Not that the Strata isn't a great sub, I still haven't maximised it's virtues and I think I will work on that until I can afford the upgrade. Come to think of it that's the fun of it. What's a good power cord for the RELs?

Yes Gary, it is a tough call which way to go.

I still kind of lean towards one Stadium, and then save up for two Stadiums if you want, which would then let you get almost any high-end full range speaker with future upgrades.

At some point two Status will not improve a high-end full range speaker very much. It goes to 18Hz, the Stadium to 12Hz and a more tuneful 12hz at that. The Stadium also has double the watts in the amp over the Stratus.

Steven: I'll look at the B15. Anyone have experience with using this with 383 and M20 combo?

Sugarbrie: I never could find a consensus on whether to use 2 Strata or 1 Stadium. The answer is probably system dependent.

Moemoney: I forgot to mention that I have the Strata sitting on a 2 1/4" slab of bedford limestone. I've wondered how it might sound behind listening area. Lazy of me not to have tried it yet but I will now.

I have own the REL Storm 111s and at first I had them placed between my two speakers, which at that time were the Dynaduio 1.3SEs, but when I change this up and moved the REL to the rear corner of the room the bass improvement was BIG. Also you will get a big improvement if you place a stone slate under the sub.

If you like how your system sounds in general, then dual subs should make a nice improvement without changing the character of your system.

There is also something to be said that maybe one Statium III might be better than two Stratus III, ie, upgrade instead of having two. The Stratus is a nice sub in its class, but the Stadium is a nice step up..

From all the wisdom I've read on Audiogon and many other sources, buy another sub, and work on placement. There is lots of advice out there on placement. I don't think you'll here a big difference in the mids and highs m30 vs the M20. The big difference would be the bass between the two. With the subs you are biamping and your Levinson 383 should sound its best. I'll bet it will be killer. You could also check into buying the model above the Rel Sub you have too.
Another option would be to pick up Revels B-15 sub.It sounds great with your speakers as I've heard it with them. It has great setup directions with a 15 inch woofer.
As I'm thinking that might be the best way to go.
Steven