A simple request---Please pack audio gear well.

Speaking with a former electronics dealer, now a part of a major manufacturer of pro and counsumer audio gear, he told me when he was a dealer the greatest obstacle he had to overcome were common carriers.

Not recessions, manf. price hikes, inflation, or seasonal activity. Carriers.

His experience and on site tours of two major Fed Ex hubs showed him that in two locations the cnveyor belts used to do the sorting of the incoming & outgoing parcels took 4 - 5 ft. drops in at least one place during the transition at both Northern hubs.

4 to 5 foot drops are remarkably large drops. If the package doesn't drop well and rolls or bounces off of the lower conveyor belt, yet again the package falls further onto the (I assume) concrete floor!

I doubt seriously that makers of very heavy gear package them well enough to sustain themselves without issues by dropping a few off their loading docks in testing their packing.

Those two hubs he noted as having visited were Ft Wayne, In, and Ann Arbor, Mi. There may well be others.

I know of one person who used UPS and UPS packing to transmit some item and it was damaged upon arrival at the recipients address. UPS denied the claim initially, indicating improper packing of the item as fault. The shipper pointed to the check box where he had paid additionally for UPS packing on his receipt.

UPS then, paid the claim.

Jsd52756

you should be worried, as should we all.

On other fronts,

I won't dispute some of the above posts as to more 'declared value' being a determiner of how an item is handled, but when I worked for a air freight carrier, which by the way uses trucks too, the ONLY thing I was instructed to look for in handling packages were the slated delivery time and then the destination address.. Nothing further.

Nothing on the packages showed the declared value to us, nor did we take the time to look for such info.

An item labled "FRAGILE" "GLASS" ETC... received no special handling. Always being in an atmosphere of "hurry up" the big & heavy’s were the only things gaining added attention... for they usually need another pair of hands. big stuff on the bottom, little stuff up top. that was the norm in loading. Be it containers, trucks, or planes.

The care or attention level a package recieved was solely set by the person whose hands were on it at the time, there attitude, and how they felt that particular day. True enough though, time sensitive packages did obtain some priority, but no special handling. They just got pushed to the front of the line mostly. No special treatment otherwise.

A seller's past history is only some idication not an assurance or guarantee. neither is declaring a higher value on the goods being shipped. Although well intentioned or precautionary, it is money well wasted if that price can not be justified. Remember, claims agents work for the carrier. Their job is to ‘adjust’ the claim, not simply pay it outright.

Adjusting is the key word here. Adjusting to current, and true value. Emotions and attachments aside. I’ve personally been on both sides of that fence in the past, so I do have some insight there.

if a claim is pursued the carrier will ALWAYS request the declared value be justified by a 'BILL OF SALE' & "copies of the instruments used for the purchase"... copies of MO'S, cc'S, ONLINE TRANSFERS, ETC. PERIOD.

Save those receipts! Make several copies as claims departments will often lose them and request they be re-sent. Such were some of my experiences. Faxing and re-faxing, mailing and re-mailing is just a part of it all in trying to finalize claims.

An invoice reflecting the sale price and those ancillary costs required for ascertaining a true and validated cost for appropriate recovery, (if possible), including the transportation to and from the repair facility AS THOSE COSTS ARE THE RESULT OF THE TOTAL LOSS CAUSED BY MISHANDLING, needs be the last item submitted though they will ask you to do it far earlier. Don’t be in a big hurry here or you may be recovering less than is your due.

If in fact the component can NOT be repaired or replaced, a statement to that effect from a manufacturer/technician needs be had and copies sent along with the INVOICE for settlement.

One might also contest the original expense for shipping as the safe and proper conveyance of the product/item was not accomplished, breeching the contract for shipping and thus putting the carrier libel.

The current value is what should be or might be, paid. Not the original cost, (save those items bought new) and needs be submitted, PRIOR to SETTLEMENT, once EVERYTHING is clearly seen.

Collectors items, and antiques should be insured via some outside resource for a carriers claims adjuster is not inclined to place as high a value on such items as would the collector.

Given the above, and other insightful posts here, it is incumbent upon ‘US’ as sellers AND buyers to communicate our ‘special’ requests for packing. Assuming or presumptions won’t get it done and place the ones making them in perhaps, severe peril. Questions as to “how” a thing will be packed should be taken as an honest and sincere interest in the buying & selling transaction. Nothing further. Never an indictment but a matter of course.

No packing is immune to brutal or inconsiderate handling. BUT every effort needs be made to thwart those incidents. some statements from different carriers' claims adjuster regarding the carriers policy for paying a claim point to the container the item is shipped in be "new original" factory packing. Not previously used for shipping purposes! So very often a carrier will by default say "The pakcaging was at fault".

Some carriers even demand a deductible be removed from the declared value, in the amount of some hundreds of dollars for items not being shipped by the original manufacturers facilities. Others severely limit a declared value to only $500 toatl. Some have policies that preclude high end gear being shipped by them at all! (save from those being shipped by the manufacturer)

To that end I have looked locally and online to find some better methods and products for packing and have come up with two things. Closed cell foam and plywood.

Also carriers who are not in the mainstream and there fore do not handle near the volume of package other more well known commercial shippers do. If special treatment/handling or some greater care is being sought, try some of those carriers who simply ship in less numbers. I’vve have recent good success going just that way. Yes, the prices were competitive too.

Knox Foam near Knoxville Tn among others I’m sure, offers free samples of their closed cell foam in a variety of thicknesses and consistencies. For under $50 an awful lot of foam can be had. Enough to more securely pack a bunch of components. I do mean a bunch too!

The plywood can be had far easier, and re-used more than will cardboard! Local home improvement stores will even cut the stuff up for you to enable you to make a box … if you are really concerned OR if it’s a “keeper” item and no other containers for it can be had, like for post production or discontinued models.

Trust me here, given the costs of some makers double boxing cardboard offerings and the outlay for them running Prices exceeding $100 - $130 for factory double boxing is not uncommon. IF available. If shipped, even an empty brand new cardboard box might arrive wet or with other issues.

Plywood and foam will serve one far better and for far longer, costing much less! ..and there’ll be no shipping price to get them being added on.

The whole idea is to limit our being at risk. Shipping is risky business always. On the whole however I have to admit the majority of items I’ve shipped and received in the whole of my experiences with such, resulting in exceptions remains under 25%, regardless the carrier. Seldom was/is the packing the reason for the incident. Plywood, differing densities of foam, and some thoughtfulness go a long way to providing for a positive experience.

Take nothing for granted. Ask questions. Make those demands/requests for packing and choice of carrier with some thoughtfulness. Keep copies of receipts & bills of sale. Take photos.
Photos will help out a lot.

Paying sometimes thousands of dollars for gear requires additional expense for greater care in transportation. I used to not be a very good ‘tipper’ if at all, when eating out. I was told by a former waitress I was dating that if you can’t afford to tip well you can’t afford to go out to eat.

Same thing applies here in regard to buying preowned or new gear. Save what you can on the sale price with the seller… but don’t cut corners in the areas of packing & shipping… OR “receiving”. Making every 'reasonable' effort sure helps one to lower the anxiety and serves to promote safer shipping.... as 'claims' ain't 'gim-me's'. We all play a part in the transaction.

Tobias
Thanks... that info, just like learning to play poker, cost me some amount. I'd hate to see other's pay as dearly.

The notion of the flight cases is quite a good one too.

.,.and most recently, I've even heard tell, (though have no actual exp.) that carriers charge extra for wood crated items... Why? Splinters.... go figure.

Well, there you have it. it's extra for more protection. All the way around.

Naturally.

'Course there's always duct tape... or cut out cardboard + duct tape so the 'wood' isn't exposed.

I guess it always comes down to the same old question, "Just how important is it?"

DIY boxing & packing with substantial improvements via ply & foam, are IMO, the way to go. Especially if one has an item they wish to continue modding, or upgrading with the maker. Additionally, for those selling expensive one off, or no longer made products.... and for overall peace of mind.

Personally, I could care less what sort of packing (orig. or DIY) an item arrives safely within... Just so long as it DOES ARRIVE WITHOUT EXCEPTION (S).

Peace of mind is a priority for me. sometimes it has a price tag. it's price however pales in comparison to the cost of trying to regain it if some misfortune occurs, and outlay was not previously expended appropriately.

has anyone any experience with those who sell flight cases custom made for gear? Like Pelican, etc...???

What Swamp says is correct...

According to a higher up at manley, I was told the main thing to overcome in high end audio is the carriers. this person informed me of two places in the Fed Ex or maybe it UPS, whose major distribution hubs in Michigan & indiana have drops of 5 or 6 feet, from one conveyor belt to another.

IF during that drop the package bounces off the lower belt? It drops further onto a concrete floor!

RE 100 ft.?
Pack it back up & let's start at 20 ft. and work our way up! Video tape it and I'll buy a copy of that event!

Wanna sell that box?