Powered speakers show audiophiles are confused


17 of 23 speakers in my studio and home theater systems are internally powered. My studio system is all Genelec and sounds very accurate. I know the best new concert and studio speakers are internally powered there are great technical reasons to design a speaker and an amp synergistically, this concept is much more important to sound quality than the vibration systems we often buy. How can an audiophile justify a vibration system of any sort with this in mind.

donavabdear

Speaking of subs and rooms, I have to add the general trend toward smaller subs in higher quantity is proving to be a better solution for most rooms and studios.  The desire for one big sub creates dominant rooms modes that are a bear to remove with giant nulls and huge peaks.  Although counter intuitive, adding more does indeed create more modes, but fewer are dominant.  We lose the lack of bass in one part of the room and the over abundance in another.  Locating 4 subs on 4 different walls at varying distances from corners can be a revelation.  Forget the stereo thing below 100Hz, sum it to mono and it can be very surprising.    

In studios, its a common complaint to have bass build up on the back wall (the wall behind you) so you always put the client couch there; he or she hears lots of bass and usually likes it.  At the mix position different story.  In studios were multiple people are working simultaneously in sessions such as tracking, scoring recording, the band in the control room while drums are tracked etc, good off axis performance of monitors and smooth room coverage of low end is much preferred.

Duke, who posts on this forum, has been espousing this multi sub solution for years.  

Brad 

 

@lonemountain 

Good info, 4 subs summed to mono, very doable for my room.

What do you use to EQ them? Minidsp? dspeaker?

Wow what a great chat very interesting and enjoyable! Made me miss my powered Acustat X’s with the tube amps built in and my Martin Logan Purity’s 🌝I think ML missed the boat not doing another better pair of powered speakers even if I’m not a fan a D class Amps The convenience is killer at a certain level. Thanks to everyone in the chat was a nice conversation indeed!

I found a solution to use my subs with both systems, need to get the DSPeaker Anti-Mode 8033 II, thanks @mijostyn, @phusis and @thespeakerdude

I’ll try 2.2 instead of 2.0 with the new Sony preamp:

The setup illustration is on their FAQ page if any one is curious:

https://www.dspeaker.com/faq-1

 

 

@lonemountain wrote:

 

Speaking of subs and rooms, I have to add the general trend toward smaller subs in higher quantity is proving to be a better solution for most rooms and studios.  The desire for one big sub creates dominant rooms modes that are a bear to remove with giant nulls and huge peaks. 

One doesn't exclude the other. Certainly in the context of my bringing up large subs it's with the outset of using two of them and no less, and more where permits and/or is willed/decided. What's most important is having the larger pair of subs placed along the front wall (preferably symmetrical to the mains); any addition of subs no. 3, 4 or more for a DBA can be significantly smaller and needn't be as extension capable/covering the same range as the larger ones; they'll still fulfill their "job" as extra bass sources to make for an acoustically smoother response. 

Although counter intuitive, adding more does indeed create more modes, but fewer are dominant.  We lose the lack of bass in one part of the room and the over abundance in another.  Locating 4 subs on 4 different walls at varying distances from corners can be a revelation.  Forget the stereo thing below 100Hz, sum it to mono and it can be very surprising.    

I find crossing subs even lower than 80Hz to necessitate symmetry-to-the-mains placement and stereo coupling. Most subs aren't low-passed with brick wall-steep slopes, and so the sloping response "bleeds" into the upper range to make for directional awareness. Moreover it can be argued whether the 80Hz barrier of "loss of directionality"-claim holds general credence. To me it's not a hard numerical value but rather a frequency range within which directionality gradually lets go, and extends further down than the oft claimed 80Hz.

Crossing higher than 60-70Hz at least while high-passing the mains I find symmetry-to-the-mains placement of subs to be paramount, and just has the whole sphere of sound snap more effectively into place. An asymmetrically placed DBA to me sounds more like headphone/inside the head bass, which isn't natural to me. I know many disagree, so be it; I'm keenly sensitive to symmetry placement and stereo coupling of subs, and so act accordingly when implementing subs.