Streaming, Optimization and compromises


So, find out Covid hit some family members, Christmas called off so here at home with time on hands.

 

First off, this thread not for objectivists for whom general service computer good enough, heard your objections prior, no need to repeat.

 

Recently I've come to realization my extreme optimized mac mini will become obsolete sometime in near future. So once again investigating future server replacement.

 

First off, any quality server solution requires good power supply, whether internal or external, pure lps or combo of lps and switching such as Antipodes offers.

 

Now we come to output, I'm going to concentrate on the two most common outputs available, usb and ethernet. The first is usb, an inherently compromised digital audio interface. So we have a number of ways usb implemented in servers, usb directly off motherboard and various schemes for usb optimization. Directly off motherboard is serious compromise, noise inherent to motherboard, add to that running added processes to motherboard, therefore,  need to act as streamer in addition to server, which adds even more noise. Also, using motherboard power supply and motherboard clocking, all are serious compromises. Now, we can optimize usb output either internal or external, dedicated power supplies and clocking can improve usb out. In spite of all this, still have inherent liabilities of usb.

 

And now we come to ethernet out, a superior solution in my experience. I've bridged thunderbolt as ethernet out on my mac mini, far superior sound quality to the motherboard usb out. While I can't directly speak to superiority of ethernet to usb outputs on all servers, for sake of discussion I'll presume this to be true. My reasoning for this is with ethernet out one has option for FMC (fiber) and outboard streamer. Fiber eliminates all noise prior to FMC and outboard streaming relieves motherboard of those duties and isolates many choices of optimized streamer and dedicated power supplies for those steamers. These streamers will also optimize usb with dedicated clock. Your could also have many options of streamer/dac with ethernet out.

 

The way I see it, even ethernet out is somewhat compromised in that in order to take advantage of fiber's advantages one must use FMC. I'm now beginning to see fiber output on servers, Sonictransporter I9 is one I know of. Advantage of this is eliminating clutter in form of one FMC and attendant lps, although in my case requires FMC adapter.

 

At this point, I'd suggest ultimate streaming solution would be fiber out server to fiber capable streaming dac, lowest noise and reduction of clutter. Until this happens I see all present solutions as compromised to some degree. As far as my top choices for off the shelf solutions at this very moment. Antipodes, Innuos both have ethernet out options, both compromised usb outs except on highest level models. Mojo Audio Deja Vu has both optimized usb and ethernet on board.

 

What do others have to say in regard to my criticisms of usb outputs vs ethernet outs? Have any of you directly compared optimized usb to optimized ethernet outs on same server in your own setup? My take is usb meaningless, and if ethernet out is preferred setup, most server moves will be lateral for me. Doubtless  better usb out solutions available vs my  lousy mac mini usb outs, again, this not part of my question. Also, I'm not looking at streaming dacs in this equation. I'm happy with present dac with optimized usb in at this point. My discussion is only meant to compare server usb vs ethernet out interfacing with usb dacs.

sns

Scenarios you've laid out are good, exactly what I'm looking for with simplified nearly all fiber setup.

 

Yes, I have complex setup, something like ten steps just to get system up and running. Sounds good as is, assume potential for so much more. I'm not sure that streaming has any more inherent limitations than what's on a cd, perhaps it has more in that we can virtually eliminate jitter vs. cd playback.

Streaming definitely more complex undertaking than CD transport. That's why I place a premium on simplifying the network chain as much as possible. Fewer links means fewer weak spots. It can get overwhelming otherwise.

If you moved your local files to a SSD in the server, this would free up the second SFP port on the switch. No more NAS so one less box, one less LPS, less cables, less variables. Pretty streamlined chain.

Modem into switch

Fiber from switch into server

Fiber from switch into OpticalRendu or SignatureRendu

USB into DAC

Of course we could then have debate over NAS vs internal SSD. On one hand NAS offers complete isolation from server. On other hand internal SSD is simpler, and can be powered by dedicated 5v supply to isolate somewhat. The question then is the NAS going to be any less noisy than the SSD? The NAS itself is a SSD. If the answer is no, then we're adding unnecessary complexity with the NAS in the chain.

Almost all of the high-end servers available have internal SSD's for the OS and local files. The designers of these servers must not be too concerned with noise from the SSD, unless they are offering a SSD purely for convenience. Hard to believe that with some of these servers like the Taiko Extreme. No stone left unturned there.

+1 on the Small Green Computer references from @sgreg1 and @sonic79 

There are many moving parts across this subject and it's evolving at a tremendous pace, literally almost daily/weekly

One would like to think that networking standards and principles across data, voice, video and now hi-res audio would be consistent - but all the audio grade network equipment and cables on the market suggest that's not the case

Finding the sweet spot these days can be a who's who in the zoo mixed with a multitude of snake oil conspiracy theorists

@sns, sounds like you would benefit from an email exchange or phone conversation with Andrew Gillis

He's the founder of Small Green Computer, knows most of answers to your questions off the tip of his tongue and equally concerned about getting you the right information to make good decisions as much as he is in making a sale

I'm extremely pleased with the product performance and service from SGC

Best of luck navigating the numerous options