Considering switching from Audio Research to PrimaLuna, troube with VS115 amp


Hello everyone, I have question that I hope some of you either can answer or have an opinion on. Ever since I was 17, I have always wanted to own Audio Research equipment. I’m 56 now, and finally was able to fulfill my life long dream. My first acquisition was an ARC LS15 pre-amp bought here used in mint condition. I paired it with a Vincent 331MK hybrid amp also bought here used in mint condition. The resulting sound was impressive. After that, I started looking for an ARC amp I could afford. The resulting search found me an ARC VS115 amp also here in used, awesome condition. This is where my problems and my doubts started. Upon hooking up the amp to my system, a tube in the left channel arced and blew a resistor. I had to take the amp to an ARC dealer and he installed a new resistor and suggested I buy all new tubes from ARC for the amp. I did and when I got back home, I again hooked up the amp and immediately upon turning the amp on, I started to hear thumping sounds coming from my left speaker, then, two left channel output tubes started to glow a very bright orange, and then white smoke started to rise from one of the tube sockets. I immediately turned the amp off. I called the dealer and he suggested I mail the unit back to ARC. I did and I am now waiting to see what they say.

During this time, I started to search out other brands and came across one called PrimaLuna. I have watched their videos and seen them compared to ARC equipment. Their build quality seems to be superior to ARC and the reviews are over the top. I am looking at their Dialogue Premium HP amp and their Dialogue Premium pre-amp. For what they cost, considering how they are built and supposedly sound compared to units costing 3 to 4 times their price, they almost seem too good to be true. Anyway, my bubble has been burst, and in simple terms, I am considering jumping ship and going with another company instead of ARC, despite all those years of drooling and waiting.

My main question is this, is there anyone out there that either owns PrimaLuna or has had experience with the equipment and can give me their opinion on owning and using it. Then, my second question is how does PrimaLuna really compare to other high end equipment such as ARC. Kevin Deal in his videos on PrimaLuna makes a very compelling case for the equipment. In one video, he compares an ARC LS17SE to the PrimaLuna pre-amp.

My last question is in regards to my ARC VS115 amp problems. Anyone have an opinion on what is going on with my amp or a VS115 in general. For those of you who want to know what else is in my system, I am using KEF 104ab speakers, a Cambridge Azur 752BD Blu-ray player as my CD player, Morrow Audio Cables and I am considering getting the Sony HAP-Z1ES music player for my digital files.

I greatly appreciate all who take the time to comment and give their opinions. I will be glad to answer any questions you may ask or provide additional. Thanks for your help. Steve.


128x128skyhawk51

Welcome to the world of high end audio.  High end cars, high end watches, etc. 

1) when spending money, it is the responsibility of the buyer to do their homework and know that you get what you pay for and the more research and testing you do the safer you are.

2) typically (not always), expensive equipment, especially equipment that is highly technical and delicate, require more high end maintenance and it more costly to maintain.

As an Electrical Engineer, I can tell you that no matter the manufacturer, parts fail.  Deal with it.

Same with cars.  Parts fail. There is no such thing as a 100% reliable anything. 

I believe in this case, the item was purchased used, without warranty.  That, to me means that you really don't know how the item was treated or used in the past.  It is like buying a really nice fast expensive car with very low miles.  You might think you are getting a real bargain, only to realize latter that the first owner really dogged  that car.  Raced it, etc.  So, just because it has "low miles" doesn't mean it wasn't abused.

Audio Research, like some other manufacturers makes some high quality equipment.  That does not mean they won't fail at some time.  Remember, Audio Research does not make the tubes.  they can test them till the cows come home and evaluate the tubes to death, but since they don't make them, it can't be totally their fault if a tube fails prematurely.  That is why there is a warranty period.

Audio Research will repair all the equipment that they have made from day one, with exception of maybe one or two where parts are no longer available or where they don't have the parts in stock anymore and they are no longer available.

Airplane manufacturers build the planes.  They recommend engines for the buyers.  If the buyer choses to purchase and have installed other engines contrary to the plane manufacturer's recommendation, is it the plane manufacturer's fault if the engine fails?

Sorry for the lengthy rant, but, I have seen numerous posts negative to Audio Research and they all end with it really not being Audio Research's fault.  One was the fault of the distributor. This one could be the previous owner's lack of proper use. 

but, my ultimate test, knowing that stuff happens and things break no matter how well designed, it when I send it back to the manufacturer for repair.  How is the repair work?  Does the unit work well now?  if so, that is all I care about.

but, for people to think that things won't fail at one time or another, or for them to be angry or disappointed when it does occur, it really not realistic or reasonable.  This is why proper maintenance and servicing is so important.  It helps prevent failure.

most people wait till something fails. not cool.

Primaluna may make some good equipment.  I don't know.  However, how would you feel if you purchased a Primaluna piece used and it failed?  Is that Primaluna's fault?  maybe not.

I'm at the point where I really want to buy from manufacturer's with good track records related to repairs.  Martin Logan still makes panels for much earlier speaker models.  Audio Research will repair just about every piece they have made.  Same is true for Atmosphere and some others. 

Take it slow, enjoy the music

mlnorl,

Wel said. Thank You. I try to ignore the whining.

Space Shuttles blow-up.
skyhawk51 I would just relax and have fun. You have a nice amp and preamp, and I suspect you will get many hours of enjoyment from it.  In a month or so all this angst will fade I suspect.  

Some amps don't have plate fuses and rely on sacrificial resistors.  If the amp breaks again fix it yourself.  It's not that tough. Or find a local tech. Tube amps are very simple by nature.   

My biggest hope is that people try owning tubes at least once in their life.  I would rather have a very good $2399 tube integrated over a $20,000 stack of reference solid state separates.  I mean that. If I had only solid state my listening would drop by 50%.  Or more.  

 
Funny I have always had tubes in my rig. Like tube gear. Now no tubes and I listen even more. Depends on the system put together and it's resulting sound. Not a tube vs. SS issue always. We listen to complete systems right? 
It's official.  We will do an precise level-matched A/B comparison of the ARC VSI75 and the DiaLogue Premium integrated amps.   Also attending is Bob Levi President of the L.A. and Orange County Audio Society.  

Both are fabulous amplifiers.  We'll meet at 10 am this Saturday.  Can a couple of you guys come?  It's open to all.