Who thinks $5K speaker cable really better than generic 14AWG cable?


I recently ordered high end speaker, power amp, and preamp to be installed in couple more weeks. So the next search are interconnect and speaker cable. After challenging the dealer and 3 of my so called audiophile friends, I think the only reason I would buy expensive cable is for its appearance to match with the high end gears but not for sound performance. I personally found out that $5K cable vs $10 cable are no difference, at least not to our ears. Prior to this, I was totally believe that cable makes a difference but not after this and reading few articles online.

Here is how I found out.

After the purchase of my system, I went to another dealer to ask for cable opinion (because the original dealer doesn't carry the brand I want) and once I told him my gears, he suggested me the high end expensive cable ranging from $5 - 10K pair, depending on length. He also suggested the minimum length must be 8-12ft. If longer than 12ft, I should upgrade to even more expensive series. So I challenged him that if he can show me the difference, I would purchase all 7 AQ Redwood cables from him.

It's a blind test and I would connect 3 different cables - 1 is the Audioquest Redwood, 1 is Cardas Audio Clear, and 1 my own generic 14AWG about 7ft. Same gears, same source, same song..... he started saying the first cable sound much better, wide, deep, bla...bla...bla......and second is decently good...bla...bla...bla.. and the last one sounded crappy and bla...bla...bla... BUT THE REALITY, I NEVER CHANGED THE CABLE, its the same 14AWG cable. I didn't disclosed and move on to second test. I told him I connected audioquest redwood but actually 14AWG and he started to praise the sound quality and next one I am connected the 14awg but actually is Redwood and he started to give negative comment. WOW!!!! Just blew me right off.

I did the same test with 3 of my audiophile friends and they all have difference inputs but no one really got it right. Especially the part where I use same generic 14awg cable and they all start to give different feedback!!!

SO WHAT DO YOU ALL THINK? OR I AM THE LAST PERSON TO FIND OUT THAT EXPENSIVE CABLE JUST A RIP OFF?
sautan904
Earlier this year there was a very lengthy thread here entitled "Why do people feel the need to buy expensive cable." I posted the following in that thread, which I think is sufficiently relevant to be worth repeating here in its entirety.

To put it all succinctly, my opinion is that as with most things in life the truth lies somewhere in the middle ground between extremist points of view.

Almarg 3-15-2016 3:30pm EDT
1)Wires sound different, to a greater or lesser degree depending not only on the wire but on the technical characteristics of what they are connecting, their lengths, the AC voltage and noise characteristics at the particular location in the case of power cords (at least), the system, the room, the recording, and the listener.

2)For many reasons, including synergy with the aforementioned variables, the correlation between cable price and cable performance is significantly less than 1.0 (i.e., significantly less than perfect).

3)Based in part on a substantial body of anecdotal evidence that has accumulated over the years, the correlation between cable price and cable performance is significantly greater than 0.0 (i.e., significantly greater than none).

4)It seems evident that some cables are overpriced, one reason among several being that their prices are determined in part based on what the market will bear. And it seems evident that SOME segment of the market assumes a higher degree of correlation between cable price and cable performance than is actually the case, and that segment of the market will therefore pay higher prices to achieve results that may (with sufficient experimentation) be achievable at lower prices in their particular cases.

5)Additional reasons that cables may in many cases be overpriced relative to the benefit they are likely to provide (I’m quoting from myself in the following thread from a couple of years ago; and pardon the redundancy with some of the points mentioned above):

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/small-cable-companies-making-preposterous-claims

(a)As seems to be generally agreed by most audiophiles, cable performance is highly system dependent.

(b)From a technical standpoint, it can be expected that cable performance will vary significantly depending on the technical characteristics of the components that are being connected, such as impedances. Even to the point of a comparison between two cables yielding exactly opposite results depending on what they are connecting. In past threads, such as this one, I have cited examples of situations in which exactly that can be expected to occur. [See especially both of the paragraphs in my post in that thread dated 12-15-2012 which begin with "one interesting example"].

(c)It seems to be generally agreed by most audiophiles that cable performance cannot be either fully explained or fully predicted based on generally recognized science. It follows from that, however, that the cable designers have no way to accurately predict the point of demarcation between optimization of a given cable parameter or design characteristic and what may be overkill of that parameter or design characteristic, which will accomplish nothing in most or all applications. Therefore it can be expected that what is likely to be a significant driver of the cost of many very expensive cables is overkill of some or all of their design parameters and characteristics, which will accomplish nothing in most or all applications.

6)It can be expected that if SOME audiophiles whose cable experience has focused disproportionately on the higher part of the price spectrum were to give equal opportunity to a variety of cables at lower price points, and experiment with such cables as extensively as they do with higher priced cables, there is a significant chance that they may be able to achieve performance comparable to what they have achieved at those higher price points at significantly lower price points. A substantial body of anecdotal evidence that has been reported here and elsewhere supports that conclusion, for example the threads about vintage Western Electric wires.

7)It can be expected that if SOME audiophiles whose cable experience has focused disproportionately or entirely on the lower part of the price spectrum were to focus on the higher part of the price spectrum they might in some cases, depending in part on their equipment, be surprised at how good the results are. A substantial body of anecdotal evidence that has been reported here and elsewhere supports that conclusion

8)Some audiophiles care more than others about achieving the last 5 or 10 or 20% of the performance their components are capable of. Some are satisfied with 80% and just want to listen to music. Both approaches are equally valid.

9)Assertions that wire is just wire are erroneous, and that belief should not be promulgated.

10)Assertions that more expensive necessarily = better are also erroneous, and that belief should not be promulgated, by implication or otherwise.

11)Just as not all audible differences are measurable, not all measurable differences are audible. I say that in connection with measurable differences that are presented in some marketing literature.

12)An assertion that spending more on cables rather than less increases the **probability** of achieving optimal results is arguably correct, but pronouncements to that effect are not gospel. And opinions to the contrary, if presented in a respectful manner, can and should be discussed in a respectful manner.

Regards,
-- Al
@almarg
Thanks for injecting a bolus of reason into this thread! 

The basic premise of the cable deniers here seems to be well summed up by shadorne:

"Surely the wishful thinking is on the part of any person believing that a mere piece of copper wire (even some wire costing a ridiculous $5000) is going to transform their system in a SIGNIFICANT way?"

Well, for one thing, it seems to me that shadorne and other take it upon themselves to presume to know what is "significant" for others.  Well, who are they to know what is significant to someone else?  Who are they to presume to know the acuity of another's hearing, and how their brain perceives sound?

Also, in speaker cables, we are dealing with an analog signal, not 1s and 0s, as with digital signals.  We're told that, with digital, the device on the other end of the cable either gets the digits and decodes them, or it doesn't.   But the situation is totally different with speaker cables.  Actually, it seems absurd to me to think that cables constructed of widely differing materials and physical designs would sound alike at all.

So, back to "significance".  If a person is willing to purchase pricey cables in order to obtain an additional 5% of realistic presentation of the system's signal, why can't some people just accept that they can indeed hear a slight difference and that the product is worth it to them?
I agree with Goeffkait that bind tests have very limited value, but for the primary reason that they don't correspond to listening and therefore are invalid.

if I are merely hidden for your knowing what components are being used and you get to listen for a reasonable time to a known cut, one should get something out of them.

But a 30 second same/different task is useless as we don't listen like that when listening to music. I have been involved in such listening test of 30 seconds where after afterwards I listed for more extended time and always picked one unit as best. If you don't hear a difference between two components don't buy either. If you hear your piece sounding better, keep it. Screw anyone else opinion unless you have much prior experience they hear as you do.

How do you get confidence with so few audiophiles and dealers? THis is a major problem. I have many friends even in other countries that often give valid advice to me. But forget double blind 30, same/different tests and try to ignore bells and whistles.

But I do agree with him that many factors matter. No cytogenetic treatment, however. TEsla coil treatment is far superior.
I have decade old 1st generation Monster speaker cables in my basement.   Several years ago out of curiosity I installed them in my system.   Didn't take 30 seconds but immediately noticed collapsed soundstage, 2D (Bo, were you using Monster cables??), fuzzy, lack extension ... and NO bass.

Like I said earlier, OP is just a TROLL.  No way with Wilson Alexia, McIntosh ... and can't hear a difference between cables.