Best setup for two subwoofers.

Thank you very much for the link, Les creative edge.

In the first half of the interview, I didn't hear anything on the subject of speakers, rooms, subwoofers, subwoofer placement, or psychoacoustics that I didn't already know. Not trying to be a smartass, but those are topics I have studied. Now I did learn some of the "why" behind limitations at the microphone end of the chain, and behind the fallacy of pursuing "ideal" room dimensions.

Much of the surround-sound discussion in the second half was EXTREMELY educational to me, as historically I've been a two-channel guy. Toole obviously can teach me a great deal about multichannel, so a few minutes ago I ordered his book. I have you to thank, Les creative edge, for making me aware that Toole's book contains a lot of valuable information I am not familiar with.

Back to the first half of the interview. Fascinating that Todd Welti, whose work I'm familiar with, was actually commissioned by Toole to investigate multisubs. I hadn't appreciated that it was Toole's idea first.

As far as subwoofer configuration goals, Toole apparently places top priority on bass efficiency rather than smoothness, as he prefers four in the corners over four at the wall midpoints. My top priority is smoothness, which comes at the expense of efficiency because destructive interference is the mechanism by which maximum smoothness is achieved.

The comparison I would like to see, but which I don't think anyone has made, is four subs at the midwall locations vs four subs in a thought-out asymmetrical configuration. I bet they both would sound pretty darn good.

Again thank you very much for this discussion and the link, without which I would have continued in my mistaken belief that there probably wasn't much in the book that would be new to me. At some point I wish to become competitive in the home theater sound system marketplace, and Toole's book will be a primary resource.

Duke

Duke,

Thanks and I'm glad posts like we've put here can be informative for each of us and others here. This is to be a fun hobby for us audio/video geeks as Scott Wilkenson would likely say. Too often, too many of us fret needlessly over things that can just take the fun out of the hobby.

I remember first hearing and reading about Dr. Toole back when I was a young kid in the early 80's. We had a KICK A$$ audio magazine here in Canada back then called Sound Canada and it was quite simply one of the finest audio magazines at the time and guys like Ian Masters, Dr. Toole and others wrote cool stuff in it often. Even though much of Dr. Toole's stuff was over my head then, today as a hobbiest and one who tries to keep an open mind I've learned things from him and other respected persons in the field.

If I may, I was very much anti-multi channel for music until recently. I got my Oppo BDP-83 with the AIR Record sampler Blu-ray and that was an aural revelation for me in how good properly engineered multi-channel sound can be. Mark Waldrep was also on Scott's podcast a while back, check it out to get his ideology on AIX Records and their efforts at making superior quality, hi rez multi-channel sound.

For me when listening by myself with a stereo LP, CD or tape, well I think that sounds the best if you can sit in the stereo sweet spot and you play back a good stereo recording. But a proper, hi rez multi-channel recording on good consumer gear that is properly setup and calibrated KICKS REGULAR STEREO'S A$$! 1-2-3 years ago I'd never admit to that. But having heard hi rez multi-channel sound on an AIX Blu-ray sampler disc with my modest but well setup system BLEW ME AWAY!

Well I sided tracked things bad enough, back to your regularly scheduled programming, LOL!

Thankyou all for the help. You really helped me understand the question I had and took me to a level beyond what I knew existed. I will try my best to experiment with the methods mentioned. Ill post results as to what other sub I pickup and how well everything is working together, as well as my placements. Thx again.

Gozren, I tip my hat to you for wading through all that and finding something useful. We kinda went off on a tangent or three there.

Very best of luck with your project... and if you get a chance to listen to the interview with Dr. Toole (episode 14 at the link Les creative edge posted), it's great stuff.

Duke

Bottom line here is you have so many variables in play here, it's gunna be nearly impossible for anyone to discern practical application here. I mean,it's all relative here, and any setup needs to balance out, with all issues addressed, and all variables qualified and considered, relative to "truth".
How big is this space? Can 2 subs even work in his room? I haven't seen it. How's the construction? What's the layout? How many seating positions in play? What's the lifestyle of the listener(s)?
Not considering all of the above -even knowing none of the variables - my simple answer is that you're likely going to run into fewer issues (phase, frequency response, comb-filtering, localization,etc ), and get the best integration and bass/sound quality running multiple subs (ok, in this case, two) if you try and keep a set of subs up near the front/center of the room or setup, near the center channel speaker. I would set them side by side in the middle of the front of the room (or stack 'em just off room center axis), along front wall, for a likley rock solid integration with a multi-channel system, and you'll have great off-axis phase integration with the main speakers, (if adjusted properly relative to mains/center), good integration, blending, etc, and you'll properly deal with modes 1 & 2 in the bass response (smoothing out the bottom). Anything else, and today's superb digital EQ's/DSP integrated into many AV recievers and pre-pro's is taking care of smoothing out things even further, fixing phase, level matching, response, yada, yada.
While you can put subs all around the room, in various places - with benefits one way or another - you'll be dealing with phase issues from seat to seating position and sub to speakers, challenging speaker to subwoofer integration from all seatting positions, distracting localization of upper freq's, obtrusive subwoofer speakers cluttering your space, etc.
Bottom line, keep it simple. And, of course, I know nothing of your room and associated equip.
Stick with what I'm advocating, and it'll likely fit very well, regardless of what your seutp is, and all the variables of which I know nothing of.