Phil, I have Druids mk4/08 with further upgraded tweeter network Mundorf silver oil cap etc same as zu Def2 and superfly. I also have 2 x mini methods.
In your opinion what improvements would I notice if I swapped with the superfly.
I love the Druids presentation, as close to live a I've had. The 2 mini methods add a huge amount of bass....... I can only imagine what the Def2 sound like in this department. I feel Druids excel in guitar and voice driven music, but they also sound great with electronic dance stuff.
So I guess I'm asking about the FRD and how much better is it in the superfy? |
Thanks, given the expense of shipping speaker to Australia it's probably not worth it.... However I may see if Zu would swap the FRD only in the future.....
I've also been thinking about remaking the Druid cabinet using some bitumen laminated noise gaurd ply we use in other applications, very dense and resonant free in comparison to mdf. |
I contacted zu about possible upgrades to my Mk408 Druids. Sean said the new soul frd would provide more mid presence at the expense of a liitle bass output. 12 ohms vs 16 ohms means my mundorf 1.0 cap and 12 ohm duelund resistor will need to be changed to a Duelund 10 ohm resistor.
So it's worth the gamble...... I think......
The Druids play dynamics like no other.... But I have mini methods filling the bass.
I will see if the wider dispersion of the soul frd interferes with the room. I disagree that the soul bass output will be more true than I have now. My bass is amazing at the moment from 40hz and lower.
Great hobby to be able to do these experiments and hear any results!!! |
gopher......The soul upgrade drivers will cost $400 after $200 back when I return my mk408 frd
the Duelund 10ohm resistors $40
as I live in Australia the the shipping cost is $1k and the upgrade to soul after selling Druids wld be another $1k..... I think I'll get 98% of what I want in the sound with the Frd upgrade. I acoustic damped the Druids boxes, upgraded hi pass for next to nothing ($200). As I mentioned before I have mini methods to help with bass...... Without which Druids would be lifeless in my room.
Worth a try anyway I think..... |
I found Zu varial and especially the Ash digital Ic to really open up the HF, compared to cardas and stereovox. I think as my pre and power amps are tubed maybe it was dark before?
For me it had more effect than changing amps? |
My room is large and L shaped, this is why I'm interested in the wider dispersion of the soul FRD. It measures 6m wide by 9m long with the foot of the L extending a further 6m. 6m is around 20ft.
Carpeted with soft furnishings. on One wall is a glass door measuring 2.7m high by 4m long.
I have the Druids around 2m from side walls and 2m apart. With toe in focussed to a point about 3.5m in front/center. The focal point is about 3 people wide.
I like to listen to blues, rock and dance style music. I have the mini methods filling in the bass. I find the bass levels increase and decrease as I walk around the room. I haven't treated for this. My floors are timber with carpet.
I found the mundorf caps made a difference and the ash digital make the treble far more open but not harsh...... Real sounding, the bass is incredible at times, tight fast no boom. The mid at the focal point is amazing, voices and guitars are in the room, you catch yourself lookig around for them such is the reality. I listen mainly standing up not sitting.
Off axis this dissapates, still sounds good but the image is gone. I hope the Soul FRD Improves this area
Due to kids the Druids are close to the back wall, I have the gap set at one cd case above the carpet with a vinyl floor tile on the carpet. The Druids are also held down with a bracket to prevent the children tipping them over.
I use zu libtec speaker cables, zu varial and zu ash ics. These replaced cardas golden cross and neutral refs and alphacore goertz mi2 speaker cables. |
After speaking to Sean he says the new FRD will have more pop in the mid bass but slightly less deep bass than the mk4/08 the combo of lighter cone and stronger motor. Should also have slightly more dynamic scale....... Wider soundstage would also be a benefit to me.
I listen standing and moving around mostly as I have kids running wild and don't usually have quality time. I agree seated is best........
The 2 minis integrate so well as I can move them around to suit the room. Something you can't do with presence or definitions. |
What is the difference in sound between1 and 2 x1uf mundorf silver oils? I have a single mundorf 1uf on my Druid Mk4/08 tweet |
Themadmilkman...... I have the Druids and due to the shipping costs to Australia I decided to try to upgrade them rather than ship out new Souls. I contacted Sean and after a few email exchanges he came up with a few ways to improve the Mk4/08 Driuds.
1. Paint the inside of the cabinet with Soundpaint or Quietcoat, 2 coats min (ala Soul)
2. Make a foam wedge (open cell)which fits into the cutout in the base plate of Druid with a 3/8" gap all round and extending upto the center of the tweeter.Stick the foam to the mesh with contact glue (Soul Essence ish) Improves bass and overall slam acording to Sean.
3. place a 1" dowel between the FRD and tweeter connecting the front and back of the cabinet.......glue in before soundpainting.
this is in addition to the Mudorf SIO cap and Duelund resistor upgrade (ala Soul)which I already have.
Another improvement I'm undertaking is to replace the FRD with Soul FRD. This require a resistor tweek from 12ohm to 10ohms.
all this is easily achievable for less than shipping (as I already have the High pass)
I'll report on the changes I find when completed. Even without the driver upgrade the box dampening/ foam wedge and extra brace will improve the Druid Sean suggests. |
The omen frd is the Druid mk4/08 with the new (essence) phase plug. The soul frd has a 60oz magnet and lighter paper cone..... Is completely different with the same phase plug.
Not sure about the omen tweet. The mesh screen protects the dome according to Gerrit.
12 ohm 97db vs 16ohm 101db.... |
From my talks with Sean, the Omen uses the Druid frd with new phase plug, the Soul the new frd with More attack and faster transients ESP in kick drum areas of bass/mid.
The Soul/Omen could be upgraded to almost superply status for $250 yourself if you don't mind diy. 2x Mundorf sio caps and Duelund resistors = $120 and quietcoat or soundpaint to paint the inside of cabinet for $80. Of course you would lose warranty. You could buy Soul/Omen keep them for a few years and then mod them......
I've modded my Druids with Seans advice to be very close to superply status...... I'll post a separate topic about it later. $500ish which is cheaper than selling/buying/shipping ( to Australia for me) and was fun to do ...... |
Good for you mate........ Awesome |
Themadmilkman....This is what I did......I mentioned this earlier.
I have Druid Mk4/08 and live in Oz......due to the cost of posting speakers i decided to mod them.....
I already had Mundorf silver oil caps and Duelund resistors in the Hi pass.
I purchased the Soul drivers from Zu and had some lengthy chats with Sean Via email.
Sean said to replace the 12 ohm resistor in the Hi pass with a 10 ohm Duelund.
He suggested that I paint the insides of the cabinet with Soundpaint or quiet coat...... a water based sound damping compound (same as Soul) I did and it added about 6-8lbs to each Druid.
Sean also suggested gluing a 1" dowel between the FRD and Tweeter and the back of the cabinet to stiffen it.....so I did.
Then he said to cut a Griewe wedge out of open cell foam (Sonnex or Melamine) this wedge is to leave a 3/8" gap all around the opening at the base of the Druid and to taper up to a point in the middle of the tweeter. The wedge is glued to the wire mesh covering the opening
These tweaks are cheap ($180ish).......bearing in mind that I already had the Hi Pass mod.....($150 ish from Partsconnexion) which all Druid owners should have anyway.....
The change is amazing.......the bass is much deeper and tighter......so much so i had to turn my Mini Method subs down. The speakers scale faster and seem more dynamic. The treble is more pronounced but still not bright......the Soul uses the same tweeter and Hi pass albeit without the Duelund brand resistor.
The mids are cleaner but not as warm as before, this may be what you heard between the Soul and Omen, Sean said the Omen uses the Mk4/08 FRD with the new phase plug .....there is more detail.......All in All about 95% of the Soul sound but with the higher and more distinct Druid Box.
These mods could be done to a Druid without changing the FRD........
For me it was fun to do and cheaper than the post for a new pair of Souls......my speakers are unique and sound really good. |
Themadmilkman.. I agree any changes are simple. Even changing the resistor value to reportedly the best sounding tweeter resistors you can buy only costs $16 each......
I like the fact that I've played a part and taken ownership in these speakers too, they sound great due to the few hours work I put into them....... |
Mundorf silver in oil 1uf with a 10ohm resistor on the 16 ohm FRD superfly and a 12 ohm resistor with the 12 ohm Druid/Omen FRD.
As far as i know. |
I heard the Druids had most synergy with Libtec cables. I preferred the mission ICs to the Varials and gedes.
No harm in checking out wywires......... Go for it :) |
