Why should audiophile deniers be allowed on an audiophile forum?

Be best, @mahgister and don't boolly people on Tvitter .

Sorry i read books and listen music... I am not on twitter, facebook or any social medias..

You mimic nonoise political folly... I despise Trump but i am against his censorship yes...

i despise Biden too...

Why bother--you would probably get that deleted also.

 

Are you another paranoiac?

What in the hell are the reason to accuse me of that?

i NEVER ask for censorship on any post here in 8 years..

 

You pick the wrong dude my friend...

I like to discuss unlike our friend nonoise who is ALWAYS RIGHT at the left part of the political wing and always in a war...

 discussing is not a war, it is an exhange of arguments and perspective in a friendly manner...

Take one of my post and take a point and try to contradict me... We will discuss...

If you are not able to do that refrain your insult my friend...

my post may be boring yes, why not? I am a human but they are not ALWAYS bs... I invite you to discuss if you are able ...

 

Your long winded BS posts are boring.

 

 

I love the way you keep proving me correct in my analysis of your responses,

For sure i proved you right...

I am sure that i did that...

Why do you think paranoiac political one or whatever are always proven right?

😁😊

Where are your arguments about my point?

No argument only a labelling name: cultist....

Grow a brain if you have no heart and only like to divide people in two factions..

Myself i speak with left or right people and dont accept political insults for me or for others...I prefer argument out of political propaganda...

Call me a man from the moon, with pedantic tendencies, it is not false... 😊😊😊😊

At least i dont label people ...It is my point... Discussion with arguments out of political myopia...it is not for your taste why?

In war there is no neutrality and you are at war for sure...And your are right and anyone out of your propaganda wrong... I know...Simple paranoiac game..

ok i will mute myself... It serve no purpose to go further...

 

 

And the cultists come out of the shadows and follow in lockstep with someone they can hide behind, thinking that in numbers, they have strength.

Complete political paranoia...

I spoke to you LIKE AN INDIVIDUAL, not like a number in the crowd of your political enemies...Or a "cultist"...If whom anyway? Trump? 😁😊 if i am not for Biden i am for Trump? what ridiculous logic...

I spoke to you about the bad idea to polarize threads with right/left political labelling names...

You are more silly than i was thinking...

By the way i dont like Trump but i am against his forced exclusion of youtube or twitter... I guess that in your political obsessive delirium you will classify me with him...

It serve no purpose to introduce these debates here ESPECIALLY if we are fanatic and unable to discuss save like in a war tactic fashion which is paranoia unleashed in your case..

Take philosophy course and let go politic... i was thinking few years ago that millercarbon was a political fanatic, he cannot hold a candle to you...i even can speak with him... 😁😊

 

 

it seems you have not read my answer... 

immatthewj

The matter seems to exceed your analysis ability...

You react to personality or political line too  instead of ideas...

Be happy...

😁😊

 

 

 

Excellent response mahgister. This life is not about two parties, but many people live in that unreality.

The problem is some attack others here about this divide which is a sleepwalking conditioned state entertained by the unelected powers that are behind world events...

And i prefer we all discuss peacefully without dividing ourself in these two ridiculous game called republican and democrat...

We all have our prefered choices between democrat and republicans but that does not matter much at the end, why then insulting the other party members here ?

children play....

 

We are not always on the same opinion but you   have common sense...

And i concur with your sentence here...

Taking the stand that others be silenced is far more offensive than any particular opinion on product X.

 

No mahgister, it’s you who makes this a political discussion, not me.

is it me or you who attack people to be trumpist all the time here?

You simply fail (on purpose it seems) to conflate politics with a point of view, every single time you’re in the minority or just flat out wrong.

I am not in the minory relatively to a party or in the majority , i despise political borderline because they are UPROOTED from reality... BIDEN/TRUMP affair means nothing anywhere on the globe now...

It’s your last line of defense, to claim someone is being political when they’re not.

Last line of defense about what? 😊 I dont argue small politic then i dont need a " line of defense "...Do you think we are in a continuous party political debate you and me ? lolll

Ask to all those you condemned to be on the wrong side of US politic in the last years who is "political" propagandist here and who is not between you and me ...I talk to everyone whatever the party... True politic is not republican versus democrat.... Awake...

That is exactly what you did when the great debate raged on about Covid and vaccines. You were dead wrong so your only ploy was to accuse others of being political, which was silly.

you have no idea what i think about covid for two reasons... first our vision of the crisis EVOLVED in these ongoing 2 years event now, and second i was proposing vaxx. for at risk people ONLY and no FORCED mandate vaccinations for ALL...This is the perspective which made sense for most scientists and people now...I was behind Nobel prize winner Luc Montagnier and Didier Raoult FROM THE BEGINNING, not Fauci monstruous action clear for all eyes to see now...

If one were to use a Venn diagram, the overlap with the general population would greatly overlap that of one particular party while the other one would barely do so, to the point where both circles would look almost adjacent. From that, you conclude that it’s politics when one side is, for the most part, accurately reflecting the views of the people while the other is just creating their own, alternative universe, which you seem to relish living in.

What you say here has nothing to do with me ... This is a reflection about Trump/Biden parties not about REALITY IN THE WORLD...You are so politically deluded you really think Trump/Biden are real and not puppets... Who give a damn about your counties analysis? Did i say you were wrong about that? No on the opposite i say that you are right but it is MEANINGLESS to understand the WORLD reality... You only are interested by dividing people here and promote your TRUTH : Biden against Trump... Children play ....

Read books quit american news propaganda on all news asset... It is the same in canada where Trudeau gives 600 millions dollars each year subventions for all newspapers... Do you think that truth can be seen in any official news?

Quit politic study philosophy and begin to love even Millercarbon...Or any trumpist... It will be an exercise...

Try it...

The brain work better when we love each other...

😁😊

 

«Only an ostrich think everyone is a troll»-Groucho Marx 🤓

 

 

Your answer made it clear that you dont get my point at all about a larger perspective in the world...

You reduce it to a Trump/ Biden divide... It is not even wrong it is small potatoes in this actual crisis...

Who in the entire world bother about a politic system controlled by invisible actors ? Everybody suffer on the planet because these real UNELECTED actors play their game even through insignificant political games here in Canada and in the US...

 

Only people who are brainwashed by news think that parties line matter now...

What’s purported to be a 50/50 split is more along the lines of 75/25, and that’s being generous. All this backs up my point that I’m not being political and I just represent the general consensus of the overwhelming majority of the country. How it’s portrayed in the media is a disservice and if you fall for it, that’s on you.

My point was: do not politicize the forum, and divide your american fellows, take them on the larger picture and this has nothing to do with the news in the USA...

Stop condemning people of the minority party here... Help all to take a larger perspective...Take a point of view OVER the parties line...A view which will make sense ALSO in all part of the world not in your county only...

Then you will not ostracize those who vote Trump....Trump is an invonvenient farce for some, Biden is a convenient farce for some... Thats all... Clowns are not real actors...They are played...

There is almost no troll here only some ostrichs....

When men are UPROOT from Nature and put to work for Abstract universal agenda by unelected powerful actors, (covid crisis, war) party line in Us or in Canada seems preposterous...If you are unable to see that you are lost even with the right numbers like in your last posts...

Numbers dont matter listen with your heart...

Party line politic is like party lines in audio ridiculous...

Acoustic and geopolitic explain thing not the parties...

There is an unlected new party on the block: transhumanism , the union of technology and greed and control, watch this ...

Trump and Biden are already dead they are sleepwalkers like Trudeau Macron ...

The world reacted with old cultures first , orthodox Tsar Putrin, Emperor XI, Guru Modi, these cultures are THOUSAND year old and more  etc how many people are not in this ridiculous puppets world of Occidental new world order conditioning, a march to uproot all humans from their history, humanity and from their own culture?

Why do you think we march through pandemy, war, climate crisis, financial apocalypse?

Bad luck? Think twice...

Forget Trump/Biden clowns think....And you will never go back to ideology...And condemn anyone here to be blind...

We are all blind but some guess about their blindspot others dont...

 

 

Canadian are not better for sure....

We are all in the same boat here, same blind spot in the 2 countries...

But i will not discuss politic here...

I only want to give you my hat and deepest respect... asvjerry

 

«Each meaning is an angle, and we are forming together the same circle»-Anonymus Egyptian priest

«Wait, there is no angle where i am»-Groucho Marx 🤓

«You mean the center?»-Harpo Marx

«I think the diameter can serve as a mediation between opposite brothers »-Chico Marx

«This become chinese now»-Groucho Marx 🤓

You remind me of someone i like very much... 😊

A big heart....

My deepest respect to you for sure

I love this thread. :-)

@mahgister

You’re so predictable, pedantic and clueless, waiting to pounce on matters you’re not very well versed on.

Unlike you i can admit my limitations..

I am very glad to say that you are not completely wrong here about me...

Yes i think that i can be "predictable" i guess after 7 thousand posts and more... Sorry to be boring at times ...

"Pedantic" ?.... yes i guess it comes from my 35 years in student counselling...And i love too much litterature, art, sciences, philosophy and i had the tendencies to use quotes or create mine... It may seems a bit pedantic indeed ... i am guilty...but i hope to be not ALWAYS pedantic ? 😊 The students forgave me all that alas! And i could not improve much...They forgave me because i am enthusiastic mind and i liked to recognize their personality good points...Then they pass over my defects i guess ...

"Clueless" ? Sometimes yes, like you are yourself on some matter... i am guitly too sometimes certainly...I dont want to contradict you here... 😁

Yes for this one too : " waiting to pounce on matters you’re not very well versed on."

I discussed here with someone 1 years or more ago on his expertise subject matter in audio, and i learned a lot through the process and i thank him sincerely for his patience because i dare to contradict him about a concept and i learned a lot in the process and i thank him for the gift of his time ... I am like you said... This comes from my relation with all students in all fields for 35 years...My worst problem is my too much liking about discussion... But i know when i am wrong and recognize it...Give me that...

You have seen trough me... 😋😊 i cannot hide myself....

Congratulations!

 

Now take a mirror and try the same lucid observation on you ...

It is not necessary to deliver the result to me...

Only think twice before accusing others of trolling, and before despising someone because they are not from YOUR political agenda or party...You have practice these accusations without end here...

The world crisis is impossible to understand with Biden/Trump polarizations...

We need something a bit more larger for perspective......

 

I must confess something here...It is not your fault completely.. But any discussion about American politics annoy me particularly nowadays in this world crisis...

Then i pick up your political persona or stance often in this thread, like a scapegoat hiding a bigger problem : the complete myopia of most americans about their politics..their blind spot so to speak...

i apologize for my impatience...

 

 

 

 

 

Accusation of impersonification...Or trolling...

And accusation of being a Trumpist ( i dont give a damn about Biden who will not make America great again for sure either)

You never change your tune nonoise...

You accuse someone each week of these sins..

That is something that is innerving...

 

Even if it was true....I dont have the faintest idea!

And it does not bother me why?

Because i am only interested by ARGUMENTS not by pseudo of people or political propaganda...

Are you paid to control avatar names history of each one here and their political rightheousness?

 

 

 

 

 

@jerryg123

You’re the same no matter what name you’ve posted under. Your past incarnations (user names) were full blown Trumpists.

 

You appear to want to be exposed to only one path to achieving acoustic nirvana. That is both boring, isolationist, and flawed. Both sides of the argument can have value to share with the other side. One side can share with the other how deviating from "perfect" can result in something that you like more, while the other side, can show them, once communicated, how to better achieve their goals.

I concur...

 

 

If an opinion differs from one’s own so what? Just stick by your convictions. Bad audiophile naysayers can’t really hurt you. Don’t be a baby! See that’s not so difficult is it?

Wise post with which i concur...

My best to mapman...

I dont know why i like you Helmholtzsoul...You remind me of someone ....

😁😉😊😊😊😊

 

Not exactly no...

All is not black and white...

I am perhaps guilty of loving to discuss too much... 😁😊

But it is better too much tolerance than less...

The only thing i cannot admit is insults with no logical arguments...i can accept insults against me IF WITH logical arguments...My back is enough solid... 😊 Anyway i will answer...Politely is the better...

And a thread is not a "jail" were some are in captivity... If you dont like the "cellmates" you go to another thread no?

I understand where you are coming from here. You are willing to put up with so much BS because in the end it’s worth it. I get it. But for others participating in the thread or others looking in, it’s an ugly situation.

 

 

An anecdote:

I had only two real "heavy" discussions here for the last 7 years...

One i will pass over...No relation to audio matters...

But the second one was also with someone i disagree with and it was about audio matter... . Our discussion last 2 months daily here...

The man was a very knowledgeable man in audio, way more than most here, me included ( I know this for a fact trust me)...

But no one is perfect...

I realized discussing "heavily" with him that he was not right about something important in audio : the timbre perception...

To make a story short i am indebdted to him so much , i wrote to him to thank him at the end in spite of the "heavy" sometimes hard discussion, because without him i would had never made my most important personal discovery in acoustic/psycho-acoustic...

Then you will understand why i try to appreciate all people, even if i heavily disagree with some, and why discussion based on arguments are so important...

My search to answer him because his knowledge was more than mine in all audio aspects , teach me a lot... At the end i made my most important discovery and i am greatly thankful to him... And he was perceived as a "troll" and act sometimes like one and he provoked some reaction in me not always positive because i am not perfect either...

Imagine now that this dude has been banned from here or cancelled because some described him as a troll?

i will have never made my search in acoustic to answer him and i will had never made my discovery...

Than my most precious moment here were with someone i disagree completely about something...I thank him till today...

Our best adviser are sometimes some we call our foes...

I dont want censorship of any kind... Save restricting the amount of insults someone can give to another one for sure...Politeness and arguments only....

 

 

For sure you are right about this kind of behaviour...What differentiate us is the amount of tolerance perhaps and  the way we can judge circonstance ...But you are right about the principle... I dont want to disagree with you on this at all...

But when someone comes in swearing and being totally disrespectful, this creates a negative atmosphere, and when let to fester gets out of control. It’s best to deal with it right away.

Sorry but personaly i welcome the " measuring gear fetichists" and their accusations of being wrong, biased, and credulous... 😁😊

If someone accuse me of lying i am a grown adult i dont want rules for protecting me... I can answer to someone...

Politeness must be respected for sure...

i dont like group closed on themselves anyway...

 

Thats all...

I am ok hilde45 with what you just said because the only common norm i see is politeness and logical arguments...

We cannot like someone else just said define rigousrously the topic of many thread in advance to be PURE AUDIO MATTER, if we want so it will be necessary to arbitrarily condemn some thread questions... i dont like that... I prefer some chaos to the lost of freedom...

Anyway what means staying on pure audio matter? 😁😊

 

 

For example: the discussion we have right now seems civil to me in this thread...And it is not pure audio matter at all...

To be frank i love too much people here to enjoy ONLY PURE AUDIO MATTER subject...

Anyway i know what the important matter in audio better than most: acoustic/psycho-acoustic...

I joke here for sure,

but i am also serious... Who is perfect? Not me... 😁😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊

Please dont ban me...

Thanks....

 

«The best rule is one rule: love each other like yourself... is it not the best rule?»-Anonymus Smith

«The best rule are the most difficult to apply»- anonymus ruler

 

 

A cooking forum is way more in a thin focus about world matter than an audiophile forum...

Here we speak about commercial, geopolitical, philosophical, scientific , and many others matter IMPLICATED in the business and in the hobby...

No cooking forum debate about inflated price of wheat...

Look at the vast varieties of audio threads and their opening question...

Then i agree with the politeness and constructive part,but it is impossible for all to agree on all matters RELATED to audio...

Try to make a list of matters related to audio... good luck, you will review all matters who exist even zoology...For example the different reactions of animals to sound and music...Even mathematics are related to audio by acoustic and digitral Fourier analysis...What a bat can hear? and what is listening is a neurology problem also...

Then will you ban some mathematician contesting the use of Fourier analysis in the definition of what a sound is?

Will you ban someone who discuss geopolitic and postal fees and all problems linked to world wide audio industry?

 I think we must BAN NO ONE....

It seems the fashion in Canada and in America now is to BAN everything we dont like...

Difficult and insane job...By insane people sorry....

 

 

 

Who decide who is a troll?

Are we a troll from the womb? 😁😊

or is being a troll is being a provocator times to times to stir the pot??

Some here are born with truth, armed with truth, and decide who is and who is not a troll...like some pope...

In my experience here trolls are not so common, most people here are people with a strong bias, we all have our own biases, i dont want to ban people save in exceptional case...

I prefer discussion with ARGUMENTS....

no one is able to PROVOKE ME why?

Because i can have arguments...and i can recognize if i am wrong with someone for some reason...

i dont want and will not call anybody here a "troll"...

I dont see that often...

What i see is sometimes some people time to time troll some discussion... But for godsake it is EASY to answer without insulting people...myself i certainly stir the pot sometimes... Am i a troll?

 

Why qualify someone of troll so easily?

Guess why?

Dividing people more is stupid...The good and the bad really? Some like to clothe themselves in "truth"...

I prefer clear and rational discussions...

i hate censorship... I dont hate any alleged "trolls" qualified so by a "pope"...

I like people of ANY kind, from any opinions, and from any ideology...

But i want to discuss not banning people... I even like the pope here... 😁😊

 

 

 

And who has the innate right to proclaim this save a "pope" :

«I don’t see why trolls should be given an equal footing in a forum dedicated to music enjoyment and the gear that gets us there. F*ck free speech. That’s been the rallying call of trolls, naysayers and provocateurs since, forever.»

Sorry i like free speech more than your proclaimed self rightfulness ...

Why not loving people who are not in accordance with our own "truth"?

I love millercarbon and nonoise alike... why?

Because they have strong character... And i am nor republican nor democrat this help a lot !

But i have also a strong character...And i am not perfect this is why i may apologize time to time...

😁😊

About free speech: the great Voltaire involved in all injustices combats of his time once said:

«Father, I hate what you write, but I will give 
my life so that you can continue to write.» 

These words are the sign of greatness...

Who will dare to contradict that?

The fathers of America constitution perfectly know Voltaire greatness, guess what comes from this fact ?

 

 

 

 

 

Cause and effect is a real thing. Live and learn.

Cause and effect are not a "thing"...Nor beliefs...

They are a complex conceptual and experimental process...Sometimes easy to verify...Sometimes not at all...

They are sometimes personal experience...

For example put a shungite piece on an amplifier and put a quartz piece and note the difference... If you experiment it many times you will infer a cause and an effect...

This is an experiment, not a "thing" not a scam...Not a belief...

i dont need that someone point to me a "cause" or an "effect" of his own choice... especially in audiophile threads...

I dont want to be rude with you mapman and i apologize for my posts to you but i must say that...

I know you are a trustful person only a bit more " sceptical" mind that i am...I am a mystic even if i read about sciences... 😁😊

 

Who decide who is a scammer and who is not?

You?

I prefer to test myself ...And i dont sell anything but i dont want to be paternally 

guided like a children...

If it is so easy to you to read THROUGH scammers intention, let me goes my way, i will myself decide for myself..

I dont like scammers groups but i dont like  also ALLEGED and self promoted NON-scammer  professional skeptic group...

I want to listen to each one here INDIVIDUALLY...

Scapegoating is like censorship...I hate it...

Scammers are everywhere these days and many are quite sophisticated in their methods so always beware. Emotional appeals to try and trigger a quick and poorly thought out response is a common tactic. It’s easy to read up and learn about what goes on these days.

 

Thanks for this truthful post artemus_5

my deepest respect....

Anybody individually must be welcome here ...

Why individually?

Because the goal of any education is to detach the individual from the groups and make him able to reinstall himself in the group less as a sheep but like a conscious individual being...

I hate censorship...

I hate groups...

I hate crowds...

I like discussions...

And do you want any audiophile being excluded from a group of non audiophiles?

i hate woke stupidity...

i love people of any kind INDIVIDUALLY... Like Christ i hate mobs of any kind ...

But if groups must be created for the sake of the society i will accept them but with SANE biological distinctions... 😁😊

My respect goes to individual only...

I count a couple of two to be an individual nevermind the sexes...

 

«Crowd begin with three adults »- Groucho Marx 🤓

«I discount children »

 

«In crowd there is the sheeps, the leader and the shaman, i prefer to stay out and i created the job of being a clown»-Groucho Marx 🤓

«Most clowns are free thinkers , and most free thinkers are perceived as clowns»-Groucho Marx 🤓

« Together we are way too much people brothers»-Groucho Marx 🤓

 

 

 

You are right for sure and i only hope you will not hate me for my bad habit...

Happy easter night 

Everyone is entitled to there opinions, but where I draw the line is when people go off  and start bringing in politics, religion or race into a thread about cables or equipment. This is  Hifi forum.
 

My 2 cents.

JD

Obviously you confused americanized democratic Taiwan, with old continental imperial China...

And it is not necessary to travel in a Hilton hotel in british Hong Kong or Taiwan to know that the self censorship is not only linked to the political power traditionally present which weight over their head for millenias but ALSO to the power of the family who is a powerful hierarchised extensive clanic affair with very precise rules of interaction. ..

And reading Confucius ethic is better than eating burger in Hilton hotel with some modernized chinese engineer to learn culture and inconscious collective archetypes ruling them ...Sorry... 😁😊

I spoke here about the general culture not about some modern chinese individuals you meet in their modern business buildings ...they are like us they want freedom...but their culture, history and backgrounds differ completely...

Self censorship is more heavy in SOME traditionalist society, it is an anthropological fact...The free individual with his free speech right is an invention of modern European times...

Even if there has been always through history some revendication of freedom... The history of Spartacus in the Roman times is interesting for example... Revendication by chineese people now dont erase completely their traditional "etiquette" and social submission generally coming from a long programmed history ...With one billion and more people and more than 3 millenias of history, and high culture, china has many habits and customs that implicate more self censorship than what are accustomed north Americans in particular ...

In a word chinese has invented everything technological way before europeans most of the times till the 17 th century, but a chinese Freud for example could not exist why?

Answer this and you will understand what i spoke about...

 

 

 

Obviously you have never been to China and interacted with Chinese people

China was a self censoring society for millenias...

They invented diplomacy....because they prefered to integrate in their midst invaders  and make commercial alliance  than brutal  imperialism like Romans did...

Cina was many kingdom in an already  large territory seeking unity, tome was a village seeking expansion...

 

 Us we are younger, and dont wanted this self censorship, which is  installed  now in North America...

It begin in plain sight  with our imitation of china politic and social method in the pandemy ...

Some forces are unelected over andbehind  our "apparent " democracies now...

With self censorship, free speech is condemned...The same self censorship destroyed the Soviet Empire he was already in ruins when Reagan give it a push......

We are contaminated now by forces of power and control behind the door of elected poeople, this was so decades ago but now it is visible in plain sight...