Why "splay" walls 4 custom listening room design?


I'm currious if some of the more informed and experienced audio guys out there can shead some light on this one, or at least add some input? I have been reading some posts on this sight, and others regarding "splaying" walls for better sound in general from a room. I've been in the process of designing a room from scratch, and have some issues of strong doubt regarding the benefits this would hae for my custom listening room. I plan on doing both extensive home theater and 2 channel music listening in the room, and want to design it with the best dimmensions and acoustical attributes and treatments possible.
I have been an avid reader of the Home Theater Architect in Stereophiles Home Theater Magazine since it started, and personally share a lot of the system set up and room design and acoustical approaches that that collumn preaches. Infact I believe the writer of that Article bills himself as the best designer in the business, with the best credentials, and supposedly he designed the Disney Imax venue at Disney world. So it sounds like he knows what he's doing, and is respected and experienced quite well for me to want to believe what he teaches I suppose.
I have also other info from other sources I've acquired over the years, and just don't see what, if any, benefit I would derive from actually designing a room with "non parallel" surfaces. I know I've heard on at least a few occasions on this web site that I've heard people recommend doing the "splayed walls" thing, but I have some questions. If non symetrical splayed wall rooms is the answer for smoothing out bass anomalies more evenly, and taking care of slap echo (which I understand), then how can you expect to get any semblance of symetry with regards to both the speakers and the listeng seats, in a multi seating set up?! My vision of this is that there would have to be speakers in some rather random and non symetrical placings to get good sound overall, and would this be practical for convenience? but what about getting everything symetrically layed out for the overall pressentation and balance with a possible projector screen or monitor, as well as other possible listeners in the room?
It just sounds rather random and non uniform. I am also inclined to believe that having more than one seat in room like this would cause me to have to place chairs all around the room in some rather scatered patterns and placings due to the more random nature of the sound in a more trapezoid shaped splayed walled room. I think in a more symetrical shaped rectangular kind of room I would at least be able to predict what was going to sound like what in different symetrical seating possitions, and I could make things neater and more organized from a design and astetic standpoint, I guess.
Any other input would be appreciated. Does anyone here have any experience with splayed room design? I was once in a room at a local audio store which did a room with splayed walls, and didn't see what the bid deal was. But then I'm new to doing anything this ambitious.
Thanx for any input.
wooterb

Showing 3 responses by rives

Wooterb, first I should comment on Russ H. HT home theater architect. Just because he designed IMAX doesn't mean he is qualified for small room acoustics--they are very different. The fact is Russ H. is very qualified for small room acoustics, but my point is, don't take someone that has done studios and theaters as an expert in home theater or small listening room applications. Small rooms (less than 8000 cubic feet) for home listening and HT are very different animals--but the tools of the trade are the same. In fact we are redoing some rooms that were done by studio engineers--they were perfect for studios, the reverb times and everything are right on--but they sound terrible for home listening.

Now on to your real question: splayed walls. Two parallel walls will produce room modes. Some of these modes can have very high Q factors (they are narrow band and highly peaked). When you splay the walls you don't eliminate the mode, but you distribute it. The Q factor goes down as does the peak. The more the splay the lower the Q factor, until at some point there is basically very little left of a room mode. Splaying walls if very effective in this matter.

Why don't people splay walls? It's costly. It doesn't work that great for the resale value of your home. It is "unpredictable". The last statement is not at all true, but has been quoted from Alton Everest and others. He also doesn't believe splaying is very effective: calling it nominal--but I disagree here as well. (Everest's books by the way are still excellent--I just don't agree with everything in them) Splaying the walls is very predictable, but the math is much more complicated and not easily described. If you do intend to splay the walls, it's a good idea to work with an acoustical engineer and make sure it's right. I don't recommend most people to go the splayed wall route alone.

A comment on the golden triangle: Most of the previous work in our opinion is not quite right. It evenly weights axial, transaxial, and oblique modes. Oblique modes are almost negligible and axial should have 3 times the weighting factor of the transaxial. We are working on new ratios and new methods that better distribute actual real world results. We are not done with this work yet, and still take each room as a case by case basis.

As to Bill E. room: It will be fantastic. Bill is fortunate enough to be able to spend what is necessary to build this room (in an existing house no less- far more expensive than new construction). There are no parallel walls save one in the rear which is such a small surface area it is negligible. It is designed for 2 channel only, and the difference in design for 2 channel vs HT is pretty great. We are very anxious to get this room complete--and listen.

Please do visit our website at www.rivesaudio.com. It has been mentioned and the tutorial in the acoustical issues section should be helpful.
Wooterb: Please read my response more carefully. I said he is VERY qualified. "The fact is Russ H. is very qualified for small room acoustics" My point was that some people--not Russ--who do large room acoustics and studios are not qualified for small rooms. Russ most definitely is--and I would never imply anything differently. As to where you can buy CARA 2.1 software, we sell it on our website, or you can call us directly 800-959-6553. It is a very good package.
Clueless and Jadem6: You all have brought up important points that absolutely deserve attention. In general, proper construction can be more important than all sorts of esoteric materials. Abundant screws is a must, but the real key is to create layers of varying density material. For this we generally use 2 layers of gypsum sandwiched by a third low density layer. This gets rid of the drum effect because for the drum to resonate it needs one somewhat uniform medium. Layering up gypsum does not get rid of the problem, but it does reduce it by building up mass and by staggering the layers. Another area, that you did not bring up was glass--it leaks bass badly and reflects mids and highs. On top of that--if left as is--it resonates very badly, and is usually a source of serious problems in listening rooms. There are solutions for this too, but I won't go into the details.
The other aspect about computer programs, not having the data to properly measure these things--that is absolutely correct. There is a book published by our illustrious government on noise control. It was published in 1980 and is out of print (and very hard to find). It has tables upon tables of absorption coefficients for most building materials and even sandwiched structures like those mentioned above. Doors, walls, floors--it's there. We use this in all of our calculations. Even with this abumdance of data--the computer can't quite do everything--here's the problem:
You want to retain your bass energy--so you build a rigid wall. Unfortunately, this rigid wall is going to create bass modes with a very high Q factor. So, you could go the opposite way, and have single layer gypsum. You won't have the high Q bass mode, but you will have resonance from the "drum" effect and you will lose and have sloppy bass. So what is the answer? There is no one answer. It depends on room dimensions, furnishings, speakers used, taste of listening, volume of typical listening. If there was one answer--why would people need acoustical consulting services? We could all just follow a simple method and be done with it, but it's not that simple.
The computer and calculations are great tools, they are just that--tools and need be used appropriately and whoever is using them needs to understand their limitations. In fact, we are redesigning a listening room that was designed by someone who had designed a number of studios (that does not make them a bad designer--but in this example it just didn't work). The room, purely from a calculations and frequency measurement point of view is excellent. The reverberation times and frequency response are just what they should be--but the room sounds terrible. I won't go into the details of the problems, but suffice to say--you can design a room that based solely on computer programs and caculations that will sound terrible. At the same time, however, the computer and calculations are necessary to determine if a particular design is going to work--you know if the frequency response and other measurements are off based on these--you have more work to do. But when you do get the right calculations--it doesn't mean you have the best possible room.