05-14-12: Sebrof
Only one possible reason - Sellers believe the pieces are worth more than they are worth. I agree, of course. Just last year 334s were going for ~$3500, and I think to move mine now I'd have to offer them for $2000. I need the space more than the money, but perhaps I need to just bite the bullet and list them for $2000 and get it over with. :-) |
Could it be because most people by now have figured out the Levinson "house" sound and don't like it?
I have heard ML amps in three different systems and never cared for the sound any time. Now it might have been something other than the amps, but they were the only common denominator I'm not a believer that solid state amps that measure similarly sound significantly different. I know that's heresy to some, but the value proposition (at least for me) for amps like Levinson and Krell is that they act like consistent voltage sources with low distortion and low noise into low impedance or highly capacitive loads. Not too many amps can do that. They also have very low distortion at sub-1W output. These are differences which are known to audible. But I don't understand how there can be a "house sound" signature that can't be measured. Just thinking about it, it might be that the economic situation in the US is hitting people who tend to spend a lot on high-end audio pretty hard, reducing the market. ;-) |
Where have you been trying to sell the amp? Can't find an ad under your user name here.... It was a few months ago on Audiogon, and after the failure I've been watching the Levinson amp market for awhile to see what was going on, hence this thread. |
I wonder if one of the reasons for slowness in the market for Levinson amps, aside from the situation on Agon, is growing recognition that there are "two Levinsons" -- the equipment Mark Levinson actually designed himself, and the stuff designed and sold after he sold the company. In many cases, it takes a lot of effort to sort out which is which, and most folks probably don't want to invest the effort. And it's been so long since he had any association with the name that I suspect virtually all the cache is gone. Levinson wasn't the engineer who designed the components; that was Tom Colangelo, who went on with Levinson to form Cello. Levinson isn't a EE, he's a musician / recording engineer sort of guy. Levinson the man moved on from Mark Levinson the company before 1984, so the brand name has been without its name sake for a very long time. |
If you put a Krell amp in your system and a Levinson amp in the system unless you have hearing problems it is easy to hear the difference. I've owned both, I like the sound of both, but the products are voiced much differently and it is relatively easy to hear the differences in the designer's choices. I've owned Krell amps, and I guess we'll have to respectfully just agree to disagree. The newest Krell amps are pretty nice, IMO. Very low noise, incredible power. |
FWIW, I listed a 334 today for $2100, and it sold within an hour. |
Congrats Irvrobinson. I won't get in the middle of a Krell/Levinson debate, as I'm not a fan of either brand. I'm not trying to start a this versus that debate. I'm just saying I don't think either amp has a signature sound, especially since they both have ruler-flat frequency response curves. |
The Levinson 300s series is JUNK IMO...I wouldnt want it at any price.Prices on the cheap has nothing to do with the site,its the gear.Good luck with that one. Interesting perspective. Have you ever owned one? |
err, because they sound so poor? So far I've typed in and not posted five responses. Go away. |
05-17-12: Rhljazz
I would never buy due to the known cap problems and expense to repair. I talked to Harman about the so-called cap problem a while back. There were apparently some weak parts, not an endemic problem, and it wasn't even in the 334-336 series. The whole re-capping thing is audiophile paranoia nonsense. Just think about it... capacitors are commodities, they're not made special just for Harman. If Levinson amps need new capacitors so often, why don't all other class A/AB amps? |
05-18-12: Kcufnogoidua
I suspect the market for used Levinson amps is slow because the general movement in the audiophile realm is towards high efficiency / low power setups. High efficiency? You mean like Class D Crown amps? Or are you referring to something else? Please don't tell us about 6W single-ended tube amps or whatever, and they're somehow converting all of the Levinson buyers. :-) |
As a previous owner of a 336 (which I absolutely adored) and experienced the capacitor problem, I can sympathize with those who are leery of the 3xx series of amplifiers. How did the problem manifest itself? Did the amp fail? |
One morning I turned it on and there was static on the right channel. I power cycled it a few times, made sure there were no cabling issues, etc and could not get it to stop.
I called the ML support number and they said that more than likely it was a cap failing, which they confirmed and repaired. At the time they were still repairing the amplifiers in-house. Interesting. Thanks. |
Its documented fact the 300 series has/had issues out the yingyang (and has since day one).JUNK!!! Where is this documented? Just posts like yours? (I figured you never owned an ML product.) |
Read all the post on the net my friend..cant help it if ya got stuck holdin the 300 series bag,lol.Yes, never owned a 300 series but I would buy a 500 series. Just as I thought. Hearsay. I didn't get stuck; all of my ML equipment is now sold, but I'm left with a lot of respect for the designers of that generation. And that even includes the No39 CD player that needed a replacement circuit board, and I tested the slow and expensive service of Harman's out-sourced repair shop. (High Tech Masters) I'd still be a Levinson owner, but their latest stuff is priced too high for my sensibilities. |
The conclusion I'm drawing is that the ML amp market is down and slower because of the perception of reliability issues, customer service issues, and the high cost of parts and service. In the end it doesn't matter whether or not I agree with any of this, you guys have convinced me these are very likely the reasons. Thanks. |
