Why does my old CD player sound so much better than my new streamer?


Earlier this year I upgraded my system. Briefly, new Prima Luna Dialogue Premium HP integrated, new Lumin D2 streamer/DAC, kept my Tekton speakers, bought a 10 year old Muse Erato CD player, new Nordost Red Dawn cables all around.  After plenty of break in, the Lumin D2 streaming Tidal, even 24/96, does not sound close to as good as the Muse Erato.  I understand the Muse was about $10k new years ago, I paid $650 for it on Audiogon, is that the difference? It replaced my Naim I had for 20+ years and I bought it on the chance I want to listen to something not on Tidal, but now I'm going to CDs when I want to sit and listen instead of streaming. I considered upgrading to the Lumin T2, but will that be more of the same Lumin sound, which is accurate but thin and a little cold compared to the Muse.  I like the Lumin when just letting Tidal shuffle music as I move around the house, but from the opening note in an A/B test the Muse just sounds so much warmer, live and simply more enjoyable. Any thoughts or suggestions?
fsgattuso

Showing 6 responses by audiotroy

It has nothing to do with the switched mode power supply. The Lumin D2 actually sounds quite warm and should have far greater resolution than the old Muse Cd player.

A couple of questions: Have you played with the Lumins setup menu and tried the transoding to DSD function? The Lumin D2 sounds much warmer playing DSD files are you using the Lumin’s volume control?

Are you using a good power cable and ethernet cable? These make a very noticable improvement.

We would recommend you try the tips mentoned above, if you are still unhappy you can use the digtial output of the D2 into a warmer dac, the Ifi DSD pro is warmer, the Aqua Hifi La Voice is warm as well. 

Also you can get a bit more warmth by changing to one of the new AQ power cables and a set of Isoacoustics footers.

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ Lumin dealers
f917025 what cool aid are you drinking? Do you honestly think that the thousands and thousands of audiophiles accross the world are getting rid of their CD players because their new streamers suck?

We have been at this rodeo for 30 years, and often times when this situation occurs, it is a simple matter of finding out what the issue is, sometimes it is because the older unit is voiced to work better with the system as it is vs the new product which may be more transparent. 

Sometimes it is just a burn in warm up issue, a cold dac/ streamer or CD player will take one to two days to come back to sound quality after being unplugged and moved.

Other issues could be that this listener wants a really warm or more rolled off piece of digital where the Ifi DSD pro for example which uses tubes has a fatter more colored sound than the Lumin.

DSD sounds warmer based on the technlogy and how filters are applied, ask most listeners to decribe the sound quality of DSD vs PCM, 

We were around when DCS 20 years ago was showing how transcoded PCM files sounded distinctly different than the same file played as a PCM file. 

There is also no such thing as basic sound or intrinsic sound quality when a system is an aggregate of all of its parts. 

Think of it like cooking, you start with great ingredients, and then add a pinch of salt or pepper or other spices to bring out the flavors you wish. 

Most dishes even with great ingredients don't come alive until flavor enchancers are added to the meadly of the other ingredients.  If you omit the salt, pepper, vinegar or acidic ingredients, and other similar flavors even the great ingredients fail to capture the palet. 

Same thing with a warm beer, same product pretty uninspiring at room temp unless it is a porter or stout, but cool the beer to right temperature and add the right glass and the experience is radically different.

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ Lumin dealers







Yeti sorry to disagree, but there have been spectacular CD playback systems that were easily competitors to very high end vinyl playback.

We had the Audio Aero, Remiyo, CD players and they were both spectacularly musical. 

If you ever hear a T+A PDP 3000 playing a red book CD or SACD you would be blown away by the sound.

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ Lumin dealers
Again OP have you tried to run the D2 with DSD transcoding engaged?

Are you using a stock power cable?

How many hours are on the piece?

Are you using a stock ethernet cable?

All of these settings will affect sound quality. 

The DSD setting gives the D2 a much warmer fuller presentation.

Hey Rbsterno just wondering if you are going to be crying when PS comes out with their next version that magically won't be upgradable for a minor cost and you will be scrapping your DS. 

You will realize soon enough that FPGA doesn't get you as far as truly upgradable hardware, which is why we recommend the Aqua La Voice. 

Aqua will be introducing a totally bespoke custom designed and built streaming bridge that is designed by Aqua and not a  cheap "Chinese made streaming  board that many companies purchase instead of designing their own. 

Lets talk in six months and do a little head to head, our fully upgradable, modular dac with a bespoke streaming board of the highest quality, that is also FPGA based at the same price and see which you prefer. 

The future of digital is modular hardware, so what sounds good today can morph into what sounds even better tomorrow of course that is for the more expensive devices. For the less expensive ones that degree of modularity will be too expensive, for that reason a unit like the Lumin D2 which can morph into a pretty good streamer or the T2 which is basically a paired down Lumin U1 streamer makes a lot of sense, built in upgradablilty by virtue of becomming an excellent streamer to an even better dac. 

As per the OP he needs to play a bit more with the D2 or try an Ifi DSD Pro which is also tube based streamer which may be more full bodied for his taste and system's voicing. 

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ Lumin,. Ifi, and Aqua Dealers
Op use the line above and set PCM to DSD and then see how it sounds.

If we are correct you own me a beer.

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ Lumin dealers digital audio specialists
F917 please tell me how good your 1988 Sony trinitron looks compaired to todays best TVs look. 

We have been replacing CD players for years with streamers and the better streamers sound way better. 

Go listen to a good flac file ripped on an Innuous being feed to a good dac or dac streamer set up with good cables smokes the comparably priced CD.