You can return any cable from any company immediately after one hour listening if you are not glad with them...Money back... Then the burn-in advice will not save you much returns....
Altough your explanation seem rational in marketing term, the trouble of all this process is pain in the ass even for Morrow....And it is not the majority of companies out there that advise us to let the cable burn in....It is only a few....
Think about all the troubles associated with this "useless" process only to bet that a few customers will not ask for the money after 200 hundred hours of unsatisfaction?
I cannot think that Morrow lied to all customers for a few bucks, i think that he love cables, make it a business, is proud of his cables and listen to all kind of cables to compare with his own....The more probable way to explain this burn-in clause, is to think that he experiment it himself at beginning....Like me when i purchase one at my own surprize....
Which customer will not ask for his money back for a cable he dont like, after 200 hours of listening , if he was paid many hundred dollars, even thousand dollars ?
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You can blindtest some little change....You cannot blindtest total transformation because it is plain for anybody to see(hear)...It is no more useful for anybody ....
Blindtest is there to validate (marketting practice) or invalidate (debunkers) some small variation like with a cable...
No one blindtest the acoustic of the same room before treatment and after it.,..
No one blindtest the electrical grid of a house before or after it is controlled...
No one blindtest the audio system before and after his many resonant parts are under controls, even if it is easier to perform than for the 2 others embeddings...
My point is many changes are so evident than blindtesting them has no interest, except for those who sell some product and those who debunk some product...
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Please understand that many (most?) audiophiles use there ears as a guide to what sounds best in there system(s). They do that regardless of measurements telling them there shouldn’t be a difference. That is the crux of it, & it ends up as a circular argument as those that cannot tell the difference tell those that do it’s simply bias, placebo, waste of money, wishful thinking, whatever.
I can tell you wholeheartedly that cables & tweaks make my system shine. Does it sound good without them? Yes... but it sounds a lot better with them in place. It is not an argument.... It is better, it is a complete case.... :) i could tell the same tale for sure for the judge..... Except i will add for example that there could or would not be a difference if someone add a piece of shungite on top of the amplifier transformer ( that will compress the sound and degrade it at this spot) or if someone add a piece of regular quartz at the same spot(that will increase too much mainly the high frequencies degrading also the sound in some opposite way); but there will be a big audible difference between these 2 .... I learned to play with these differences to reach the potential of my audio system with many other experiments in another different road also.... In relation with the kind of speakers you have, moving the chair will not change the sound in the same way, or on the same scale, that changing "some" cable or making the little experiment i just suggest...Distorting the imaging for example is very different than compressing the sound even if these may be linked.... I will add that my little experiment is more than most argument, because reproducible....Measurable? in theory yes....In practice probably,but i am in no way an engineer....And i cannot wait for them to transform my own audio system at peanuts costs for the better.... Homemade experiments are the road....Listening with the ears and the body is the way.... « Miracles are scientific fact incognito or in disguise»-A Russian clown P.S. i will repeat here that, like roberttdid advise, it is not a good idea for a beginner to invest big money on cables, there is much false marketing ploys here, and i will add that there is way more spectacular way to imporove the system mostly linked to the 3 embeddings of any audio system...Upgrading for a better design in an electronic component will give also better improvement than just changing a cable.... But for someone with a top of the world system already, rightly embed, some cable can make big differences, for most people ,s system not so much.... |
Those crazy eastern philosophies. In yoga there are the 5 yamas the first ahimsa is non-violence the second is satya, truthfulness. Centuries ago it was the other way around but they changed it. Why would they do that? The first was always considered the most important and truthfulness held that honored position for a long time but followers of Pantanjali kept fighting over what truth meant so it was changed and placed behind non-violence. Doesn’t mean anything something that entered my mind reading your post. Thanks very interesting post indeed... Except eastern philosophies are no more crazy than western one, they are complementary way of being culturally.... The changes you alluded to was simply a sign in the times (Aeon) to be read like a sign and understood.... Sometimes cultures like individuals collide without understanding themselves in their deep complementarities... It is like that in many forums.... :) My best to you.... |
it is not impossible for a cable to make a "difference", but cables make a very expensive tone control. You are right about that for sure.... And it is also my experience.... But perhaps it is not the facts or your experience that provoke some negative reactions.... I must say that you are very polite in pushing your way....And informative also....But perhaps lacking some flexibility .... :) |
« Truth is not experience, object, or opinion, or even concept, it is the emptiness where all there is is »- written on a china wall in ruins.
« Truth is the light coming from no sun » Anonymus
« Truth is love, making everything possible, being nothing itself» -myself |
Roberttdid, i dont doubt a second your competence in audio....Not one second.... I know how to read between lines and not only lines...
You know way much than me in audio no doubt at all...
Is it clear?
But you dont imagine or know all that there is to know.... This is my point... And what i create homemade for my system with success would appear to you like non sense.... But....
:)
The cosmos is more vast than we think..... Audio is also a "cosmos".....
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Some has disdain for solutions that dont come from them or dont have a place in their frame of mind.... :)
Not me, i guess i was an audiophile, because the most important was for me to win a good hi-fi by my own means only ( i dont have the luxury of money). And i am not an engineer....
But in audio, the engineering basic design is already mature for the last 50 years, and except some new technology, the basic design is mature, then almost all product are on a quality/price ladder with 3 rungs : low, mid, high....Even dac technology begins to be good in the last decade and affordable...
Then for an audiophile, the S. Q. comes mostly from many other things than only electronical basic information or design... Pick some good E.C. (electronic component) on this ladder and the S. Q. increase will not come from basic electronical information mainly , but from the way you will embeds this audio system in your house and room....
Within 2 years of experiments each week mainly, i create my homemade low cost solutions to these 3 embeddings problem that would seem ridiculous or worst appalling in some case for a classical audio engineer... They works marvel for peanuts....My ears said so indeed....
No measuring electronic device would have made that possible...No way....
Controls of resonance, of the house electrical grid and last but not least of the acoustic with not only with passive materials but mostly active different ways can create a S. Q. "out of this world" without any unecessary upgrade...
My principal audio discovery after my own experience, is most people dont even know what the audio system they already own is able optimally to deliver....No electronic measuring device would replace the methods i had use to controls this 3 embeddings...For sure no change of cables too.... :)
For the cables problem, yes there is difference, no they are not generally big differences, and thirdly most people listen to cables in a non controlled environment then how can they be sure that their cables is the best?...
And last, most cables afficionados put their money at the wrong place, and for that i think like roberttdid and i have the same opinion .... But his measuring proof is for me unecessary and his blind testing obsession let me cold like ice.... My ears speak louder to me about cables differences so to speak.... :)
I trained my ears to transform my own system without needing any engineer, with good basic electronic component....I succeed for the cost of almost peanuts.... I dont sell nothing, my idea are free and i dont upgrade....
Regards to all.... |
Mahgister, that is a lot of conspiracy theory and ideas presented as facts without evidence for one post.
Sorry i dont get the conspiracy theory accusation....Do you live in Disney world, being a scientific and not knowing how international company use statistic in medical research, i guess you are an engineer? If you want i give to you the basic litterature about statistic use in medical field ? I am not a scientist myself but i know how to read ...It is a very actual problem in this pandemic by the way.... For the "facts" only your own " labelled" measures are facts no? Other ears experience are illusions.... Testimonies are not facts, anecdotal trivia they are....Human ears must be educated by numbers dials.... is it that? Is it the critical listening you speak about? I apologize for the sarcasm.... P.S. for the statistic one short beginnings: "The ongoing tyranny of statistical significance testing in biomedical research" by Andreas Stang Oliver Kuss The pdf is easy to spot on the web.... If you want explanation i am here :) If you can understand that you will know how to use statistic to inflect any result in the wished direction.... After understanding that we can discuss the difference between field observational medical research and the difference with methodological statistic research with the goal to sell you some "drug" .... But this will necessitate other articles and education.... Where is the conspiracy theory? Dont call something you dont understand with name you dont understand either.... |
Gives me any cable i will make it sound like a marvel in a few minutes, without measuring it at all, except with my ears , and using something that will vary in relation to the specific sound of your system.... I will not mention what is this varying materials, i dont want to schock the dogmas....And nobody has ever explain to me why this materials works that way in an audio system... It is only by experiments and listenings that i work my way with it....
I mention this because common sense is lacking about cables.... Common sense takes into the equation 2 things: the numbers of testimonies about cables differences, and the actual inability for our technology to measure and explain any differences, very subtle sometimes, in cables by our measuring limited apparatus for now....
Arguing with "science" is ridiculous, technology is not science first, technology often create something before being able to explain it, happily for us; second, technology has no way to measure in a single way all the parameters involved in cables embeddings in an audio system, because "probably" there is more than the tech-brain think about this ears-audio phenomena....Technology works with experiments not dogmas....
Blind testing is not the "apex" of technological progress, but a debunkers technology and a marketters one also like statistics in a way....Pharma companies likes statistics very much over experiments by human doctor in the field guess why? If you know about statistics you know why....A clue: the bigger the numbers, the more you can play with them easily....
This is what my "ignoramus" common sense and experience dictates to me reading all these useless threads arguing cables makes no differences at all by principle or by "measure" aka blind test.... :)
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No one should be made to fell like a fool for what they hear, all these things destroy open conversations and the ability to learn anything. I must admit that this elementary trust is fundamental in an audio thread.... Or tomorrow we will ask measuring Artificial intelligence advice over or against our own ears.... Measuring thing is a must indeed, but no more when we reduce all sound quality to that only.... «Behind the ears it is the heart that listen» - Anonymus |
I will add that people too much obsessed in a positive way or in a negative way about cables dont understand the basic problem in audio sound experience.... :)
Sorry to offend some, but newbies to the hobby must read the truth.....
Advice for newby to the hobby: choose good, not too pricey, cables, and forget them for the years to comes, revisit them after the controls of the audio system 3 embeddings will be optimally implemented then upgrade the cables if you want to and never before .... :)
«My only master are my ears» - RCA Victor company’s dog
« My wife screams so loud that my oscilloscope knows better than me what she say»-Groucho Marx
« A flea whispers is so subtle but contains the world mysteries, alas! only my most sensible DB meter can catch it a bit» -Groucho Marx reading William Blake |
It can be the cables and it can be, if subtle differences are there to be distinguished at all, relative human biases....I cannot myself imagine that cables all sound like one another based on my experiences....
But most peoples invest too much money in cables.... Night and day differences comes from controls over the 3 embeddings of an audio system, not from cables in my experience, except by replacing a very bad one with a very good one, but this is exception not rule...
I dont understand all these childlike games here about cables....Common sense suffice to pose the problem and is sufficient to solve it.... Safe for those who wouched for no cables differences exist at all....And this is silly for those like me who hears differences....
A single difference between cables can be a result of some bias and can be placebo....But cumulative changes in the same positive directions cannot be reduced to illusion nor by blind test neither by measures....Then perhaps some single cable difference with another one can be argued for or against in a singular basis ....But cumulative positive differences is the heart of audio experience listening, that cannot be reduced to illusion only....
For me listening is my only way to test.... I test my own audio homemade tweaks with my ears for 2 years, and recreate completely my own sound experience by controlling the 3 embeddings, not by changing cables, even if they dont sound alike.... :)
I dont sell nor buy anything except peanuts costing materials in the last 2 years..... Then Hi-Fi experience cost peanuts if you want to invest your listening learning skills and some basics.... That is my grain of pepper.... |
No, they don’t try to convince them of it. They just state is as a fact ... while never putting their own ears/brain to critical evaluation.
This is a decree about all an undeterminate crowd, qualified by the name: audiophiles... Please note.... |
I am not this mahgister.... He is an a..h... but i am not one..
We use the same computer, his computer... But we dont speak to each other.... He knows that all audio is engineering facts only...Myself i work it with stones and cheap E.C. and materials to create wonder sound.... He thinks i am deluded or deaf... I think that he thinks too much of himself.... I dont like this mahgister at all.... I prefer the other one, the truest one, myself.... :)
Someday i will buy my own computer.....
By the way i am the right side of this brain, he is only the left side....
« Under the loving sun, hate is like a passing cloud my dear»-Groucho Marx |
Being fooled by others is part of life, no need to fear that....
But if fooling others is a heavy load to manage indeed, fooling oneself is an abyss.... |
« We can change, face, name, and modify our body, but we cannot change neither the soul nor the style»-Groucho Marx
:) |
Rejoice! there exist a photography..... :)
« The world like my wife is more complex than my brain » -Groucho Marx
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I’m not following your logic. I’m an atheist but I’ve never looked for any evidence to support it. I’m not sure where I would look or why. The religious see signs of his god anywhere....The atheist has the blinders that make him unable to see more than one idea or object at times...His faith is so powerful that he look at everything seeing sings of inexistence everywhere... My logic is a slave of my heart....And my heart is thirsty for truth...I dont give a dam for religion nor atheism or materialism.... They are the same superstition or faith for me on different guise....They are idols.... « We must pray thinking that God does not exist» Simone Weil |
I don’t have a religion. Religion would imply faith without evidence. Religious people have plenty of evidences in any religions.... Read about that to be enlightened... For me active atheists are like believers, the two look for evidences and discover plenty of them to confort their opposite and faith beliefs... I am more a sceptic who experiment or read and think....I dont like technological or religious dogmas.... I listen to some cable for example and my ears know....No need for a superficial theory....We dont know much us humans.... |
Your post at some level was an inane rant after all.
I dont think so....But your post is also a free attack....Take a mirror and look at you first....Your religion against cable change is not better than some cable zealot.... I dont like "cables thread arguing" because simple listening decide this matter....And you are right tough about the too much money people invest in cables, i am with you there at least.... :) But in any resolving audio system, many cables dont sound exactly the same and many cables are way better, some worse... The debate is closed for me after that.... :) |
Is there any data that supports the gain or loss of quality? Another one who think that data completely replace reality.....Read the article i just post there is some data that go in the way of the break-in hypothesis....But there is no ABSOLUTE data that will replace reality and the experience of many people for the time being.... Ok i quit for the night... :) All of this is subjective right? No not all break-in are subjective experience only, amplifier or dac break-in exist base on the working cycles of some of their electronic components... Read the article.... Good night.... |
Chord company, Moon audio, Morrow cables, etc they all experience break-in for diverse electronic components and cables... I experience it myself... We are all deluded....Say those who dont experience it, dont want to experience it ,even if this could be possible, so strong is their faith in their "understanding" of electronics.... Fact cannot pierce blinders.... Debunker are tedious....No explanation can contredict a fact, that is at the basis of many working audio company.... Marketting tactic some say.... But there exist not only the testimonies of many people, customers or designers, but many reasons why break-in can be real ... https://hometheaterhifi.com/editorial/hi-fi-audio-component-break-in-burn-in-fact-or-fiction/This article explain some and the writer seems very competent scientist to me.... For sure this prove nothing, but i am a bit tired by the stupidity of cables threads, cables break-in threads and vinyl/digital threads, etc... A bit of common sense suffice to reach a conclusion....It is useless to create debates about these matters.... Sorry for my rant.... |
Are we not all friends endowed with reason?
It is important to keep the humor and the "wit" without attacking anybody....
I apologize for my rant but.... |
I'd rather burn my money then waste it on shakti stones and other ridiculous tweaks.
A woman who consult an astrologer is in the same boat that the professional debunker... They has faith, a positive faith in one case, a negative faith in the other case... I am a true sceptic, i study....And for Shakti stone and other tweaks i simply try with success at low cost to reverse engineering them.... Opinions without any studies or any experiments are not of any use .... Sorry.... |
Nothing like a guy who sells "Magic Pebbles" Before mocking someone try it.... Put a big shungite stone on your amplifier and after that put a big chunk of quartz.... Listen to the difference, and call that your first lesson in non conventional audio... I apologize, but i am tired of childish mockeries and games...
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So I have said before and will continue to say until contrary evidence comes along that the people who think there's no difference, well they are right. For them there is no difference. Until they learn to differentiate there never will be. Because its not a matter of psychology, or opinion. Its a question of skill. And skills can be learned. If you want to be a good listener, its a skill you can learn. If you want to. But you do have to make the effort.
Good post.... Auditory hability are measured in Hertz perceived or not..... Listening hability are not measurable in this way.... All those debunkers are lazy or simplistic, when they equate perception of grain with illusion... :) |
roberttdid272 posts07-05-2020 4:18pmOne word Mahgister, religion.
And all the testimonies in this direction cannot be explained by an induced mass placebo effect taking place in several phases ...
Do you think that my work to increase my S.Q. at low cost by myself is religion? What do you think i think about your blinders? I think" religion"... A tech diploma or even a thesis in physics dont make someone immune to dogmas.... |
Truly people invest money in cables, and they make a little difference, a little one compared to any other way to improve our system....I know it by experience... But cables can also make a negative difference also.... This is particularly true for low or mid hi-fi audio system but even for top of the game one also....
Dont pay too much, choose them right, and forget them to turn your thinking to REAL audio problems to solve...
It is not necessary if you are deceived or frustrated to equate all cables with lamp cord either....
:)
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" Renounce or die "-Pope inquisitor
I renounce..... :)
By the way his cables are not sold for peanuts..... :) |
Glupson i thought about that advantage too.... But think about the trouble you give to yourself for 30 years in the business, burn in your cables and giving to others the same trouble KNOWING that this is bullshit?
In all probability the few return cables you spare yourself with dont equal all this trouble...
the only explanation that hit the road for me is that Mr. Morrow experiment that himself and know that for his cables the burn-in is not a myth.... This is the only reasonnable explanation...
And all the testimonies in this direction cannot be explained by an induced mass placebo effect taking place in several phases ....
By the way in these 2 hundred hours the cable audible effect pass indeed trough different stages that any customer can observe.... |
Lao Tse said that you can fill with bunk even a Ming vase.....
:)
«Bunk on the soil is only mud, but in a Ming vase it is really bunk»- Groucho Marx thinking about Wittgenstein. |
About burn-in cable....
A company very well known Morrow cables, recommend to his customers to wait at least 200 hundred hours before returning a cable and compare it to others one... They gives themselves the trouble to cook their cable themselves before selling them...
Now suppose you are Mr. Morrow himself , why in the hell ! would you give to yourself this trouble and to yours customers too, advising them to burn the cables you sold to them or burning it for them... Why ?
Ockham razor parsimonious explanation principle suggest to me that Mr. Morrow listening cables all his life know what he is talking about, dont you think? And dont you think a sane mind would spare himself this trouble if he can?
It is not scientific proof for sure here.... Only reasonnable thinking.... By the way i experimented this phenomena myself burning his interconnect Ma 3...This is not also a scientific proof....Only a testimony....
But wait a minute,if you had hundred of similar testimonies, is it not the beginning of a proof in a court of law, compared to a debunker obsession with his misconception of science ?
« Burn the cable, the boat is ready» -Groucho Marx |
Very good deduction..... And if their hearing is able to do the job sometimes the brain dont want, it is called a bias..... :)
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My 35 years old son say the same thing.... :) |
I think man is a cross between some god and some monkey and like said Pascal in other words than these, "who wants to be a god becomes a mammal ".
:) |
You didn’t insult me. If I couldn’t take a little disagreement over cables I don’t belong on the internet.
I am glad you are not.... I wish you the best.... |
djones i dont mean that to insult you...
read my explanation .... I apologize i dont wanted to be rude with you....Just giving my experience and answering your test challenge with my life real accidental test....
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It’s not really that hard mahgister. I come to your house and you step outside while I change 1 speaker cable or not. I touch nothing else. I blindfold you, you come back in sit in your favorite place and tell me which cable I changed or didn’t. Get it right 8 out of 10 times you have your objective proof a cable matters. You are very naive here,sorry.... Here is an anecdote that will explain the matter: When i listened my system some months ago, when accidentally some stones fell of my grid in the night before , i dont suspect it immediately at first, it takes sometimes, a few hours, and my listening being subconsciously unsatisfied was alerting my consciousness, i decided after a moment to verify the grid discovering the cause of the problem...This experience of the falling off of some stones changing the sound arrived a few times for me and for a friend of mine who tried my idea also.... It is not my HEARING consciousness that experienced on the spot and decided that the sound was not like it was one day ago.... At first i dont noticed something big or even something.... But with the times passing my FEELING subconsciousness alerted my consciousness.... My musical sound memory is there in my subconscious body not in my consciousness... It is not the exact memory of the sound that is imprinted in my body-brain, it is the FEELINGS in my sensitive body that contains the memory and that are the memory not the sound "per se"... Then if you understand what i speak about you can understand the absurdity of your proposal test in the conditions in which you imagine it... My regards to you.... P.S. but if i choose the musical files i use to test my audio system, i will probably pass your test with my stones grid or other tweaks easy to takes off.... with the cables it is too subtle and too long to takes them off and replace them and cables are sometimes very subtle in their differences.... :) Most people condition themselves not being able to hears any differences, their system is not even rightly embedded most of the times.... Listening is something we must learn....Hearing is quantifiable in hertz, listening hability is not..... |
I hope i am wrong.... :)
But perhaps establishing objectively the validity of a vax is more easy than to proove objectively something about cables experience.... :) |
objective proof does not have to have hard numbers, though it can, but critically it must isolate what is being tested, My experience with my electrical treated grid, in my house, with my electronic components, with my cd and files, the well known one i love the best, how can we reproduce that in an another location? You cannot isolate these encompassing elements all linked in one audio systen, MINE.... This Evidence is easily accessible to experience in your own house for yourself to repeat with your rightfully treated audio system.... Objective proof with a volontary crowd of guinea pigs and a repeatable experiment not so, especially in a non treated electrical grid, and with a non treated room , and with non controlled resonant system....They are many factors implicated dont you see? But your goal is it to make an experience for yourself? or debunk audiophile claim of differences? |
The electrical grid of the house is very important also in my experience.....
And passive room treatment only are not sufficient to gives wings to the audio system most of the times....ACTIVE room tretament is necessary for that unbeknownst to most.... :) |
Subjective proof.
A subjective proof is an oxymoron.... There is only subjective experience and experience are always subjective... The true reason why cables importance is exagerated among audiophiles is in relation to the more impactful other urgent problems to solve: principally the 3 embeddings... An objective proof in matter of cable is nearly impossible because of all factors implicated and also because it is impossible to reduce experiencing consciousness to numbers dials in principle....And the experiencing of cable difference is most of the time easy to test ourself by replacing one, for sure that is not a proof only an experience.... :) My best.... « i divorce because i fail to choose my wife in a blindtest»- Groucho Marx « After seeing God, after this experience, who wants on top of that a proof ? » -Groucho Marx |
(Please forgive my irony if you are a complete beginner and just recently discovered the room importance).
Even many of those who speak about the room importance underestimated the impact of room treatment.... Most people think about passive room tretment when they think about this matter...It is ONLY the 1/3 of the problem.... In my experience and experiment in a DEDICATED audio room 2/3 of the results comes from ACTIVE room treatment... Then forgive my lack of irony and seriousness if you are a beginner in these matter or think you are not one.. :) |
EVERYTHING is equally important in my system. I neglect NOTHING!
I understand you perfectly.... Same thing for me.... But we must decide if we will invest thousand of dollars for example in mechanical resonance controls? Or in the house electrical grid controls? Or in the acoustic of the room? If our ressources are limited or scarce what will be the most important thing to invest in and in what proportion compared to the others problems? I only think that cables comes last after these 3..... :) |
Keep your 50 dollars cables.... But treat your room and prepare yourself for a big surprize....
The best improvement is not about cables but a dedicated controlled audio only room.... :) |
The same cables dont create the same difference in different audio system and embeddings.... Their impact results is not also related to their price....
These are the reasons behind all these debates....And at the end cables makes most of the times way less impact than the rightful controls of the 3 embeddings of the audio system....
Then people speaking about cables often dont owns an audio system rightly embedded; because if their system would be rightfully embedded they will not speak so much about trivial matters and evident perceptible effects of cables in any refine and minimally rightly embedded audio system.... |
And in my considerable experience, things like shungite, quartz, myrtlewood, and the like placed on top of electrical components such as amplifier transformers achieve their results through a pair of phenomena called confirmation bias and expectational bias. But if you think these things make your system sound better, then that’s all that matters, isn’t it? Me, I think taking the money that others spend on improvements of dubious scientific worth, And buying more music improves my system immensely. :) I respect your experience, but mine is different... Do you think that my unconscious was inventing a specific bias to the compressive effect of sound by shungite, the very different decompressive effect of quartz? the audible effect on the imaging by kambaba jasper, the cleaning powerful effect on all frequencies of herkimer diamond and all other very specific effects of all stones, negative effects and positives effects also of lava beads, amethysts, Tourmaline ? For the money question, all my tweaks are homemade and low costs, all comes from my own experiments... All my idea are free and i sell nothing... The results are powerful and cost peanuts, there is limit to what your imagination can create without your consent except among few total lunatics in asylum unfit to walk... Your answer remind me of the explanation about UFO by military intelligence 60 years ago....Awake yourself....Dont trust others and experiment yourself .... :) |
He does not answer about my simple test.....I begin to doubt about his seriousness.... |
You are perhaps right, perhaps not.... We will see....
I am the only one here that has propose a SIMPLE experiment to do and doable by anybody....
Blindtesting methodology is complex...But with my simple experiment we can kill many cats with one stone...
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