Who OWNS Zu Audio Speakers- Especially Definition

With Virtue I need to wait for the DAC though. And waiting is so hard. I've had my eye on them for a while though, I don't think they've had any product for about 6 months. And their entry level is now $370. Not cheap.

I have no idea how their ICE class D really compares to whatever Harmon uses (which I guess is AB). Onkyo is also a class D, but their own design.

I have Mk4 Druids, not definitions. I listen to them about 7 feet away, but in a large space (vaulted ceilings, have to sit nearby to avoid reflection).

I think they are great. They've given up a lot of freq. responsiveness flatness for dynamics. Tone is also fantastic, although I don't know how you measure that. So they don't sound like "hi fi" speakers, but are engaging.

They also totally crank. I run them off a 15 W amp and can get them to do everything shy of concert level opera.

I'm finding I need stereo subs too btw.

Dotsystem:

Let me second your recommendation for Jim's book. I spent a weekend with it, tweaking the position, and it made a big difference.

I don't have the $ to upgrade to the presence or essence, so it will need to be subs and a receiver. Frankly, I'm nervous about Zu's change to a ribbon tweeter. I don't want that hi-fi top end "sparkle" and I don't want to give up any sensitivity/efficiency.

I do need help with a 2.2 amp/receiver question.

Just for fun, I ran the Zus off my old Yamaha HTIB since it had SPDIF input and I was hoping to run the system wirelessly through airport express. The Yamaha was notably worse than the sonic-T, so that is out.

Looking for a good amp that does better than 15W and can support 2.2. I also want it to have optical input and a good DAC.

Considering the Onkyo 5AV-L, Harmon Kardon 5490, but I have not heard them and don't know much about them. Onkyo has 40 W d-class and is meant to be "audiophile" but how it sounds, I do not know. HK 5490 has more Ws, but I have no idea how what class amp it is. Peachtree would also be a good choice, but $1200 is too much for me.

Suggestions?

Hi Wilsynet:

I borrowed a friends very expensive Rotel DSP + 7 channel 100W class-d amp. It's an ICE implementation, probably as good as any, and quite similar to Virtue.

I was surprised at how close the Rotel implementation was to my little sonic-impact 30W. At usual listening levels I don't think there was a thing to choose between them. The speakers and the room have a FAR greater impact to the sound in my implementation, and that is also where the benefits will come to my system in its current stage.

The Rotel also has its own DAC. I don't know what it is, it may be similar to the TI Burr Brown that lives in my little Headroom Headphone amp that I have been using as an external DAC.

Internal vs External DAC made a difference. The Rotel DAC vs little headphone amp DAC did not in my opinion. Of the difference was so small it was vastly overwhelmed by problems I have in my room.

I think if I am to make a material difference to my sound with a new amp, it would need to be a tube amp of some sort as the distortion that that adds is very real. I don't think that a 15W class d vs a 100W class d (volume aside) or any different DAC will solve any of the problems I hear in my system. They may be different, but not "better" as they are not solutions to the problems.

Adding a subwoofer made a material difference. Spent a good long while yesterday crawling around on my hands and knees to place it.

Wilsynet: I am surprised! Maybe I was naive thinking that a $50 2-channel amp would be noticeably inferior to a $2000 amp.

I think if I asked the group: which will sound better:
1) Sonic Impact + headphone DAC = $150
2) Rotel DSP + Rotel amp = $3000

They would say (2). Again, maybe I am wrong. We're comparing a $150 d-class amp with separate DAC/preamp to a $3000 d-class amp with separate (more expensive) DAC/preamp.

I think you are right though that a using just 2 out of a 7 channel amp, even if they are discrete, is not optimal, although now I am very very curious to compare it to a 2 channel ICE design. I would love to understand why running 2 channels out of a 7 channel amp (discrete) is different from running a 2 channel amp. If they are discrete it should be the same, right?

Wilsynet: I appreciate your advice.

And yes, my system is separates, but only just. I was in the market for a 2 channel system before the Rotels fell into my lap as loaners.

I'm a little appalled at how bad some of the design decisions at Arcom have been--why so little with digital input? It seems they have not heard about this little thing called a hard disk.

I'll send you a PM. I'm pretty tough with my amp demos btw. You'll be amazed how much tight SPL matching erases differences.

James: That sucks. You are a patient man.

Naggots: How do they sound when you increase the feedback? I get this big tonal suckout at low frequencies, and I think it's because there's a big impedance spike (or something) that more feedback in the amp could help with.

Naggots:

It makes sense that more feedback would help with the bass. Sure, it can cause other issues elsewhere too.

I'm a little surprised that it works well with as few watts as you have. 30W was too little for me, not so much from level (although that did become an issue when I cranked it) but just from straight bass control.

Woo hoo!

Really want to hear what you make of them -- good, bad, & ugly