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Which stereo amp to try under $30k

Having just made several upgrades to my system, it's now time for the amp. Given the number of amps in the 15-30k range, I'm guessing many of you have experiences with them. To get started, I'll tell you my (1) my guidance (2) my current list of options (3) My current setup. Looking forward to getting more options on my list, as I'd like to pull the trigger in about 2 months and need to start listening.

My Guidance
- Under $30k
- I need to be able to hear the amp before purchase, preferably at a local shop (SF Bay Area)
- New or used ok
- Large sound stage
- Bass
- More Bass... all the bass
- Very much prefer stereo to fit in my rack. I have small children and not enough room for monos.
- Prefer not tubes (already have a tube line stage - too hot for small children and don't fit in rack)
- I'm ok with a colored sound. Prefer musicality and realism over "accuracy" or "neutrality"
- Needs an absolute minimum of 150W based on how loud I listen
- 15/20A or something I can plug into a regular wall outlet

My Current List of options
- Luxman M900u (current top of list)
- Ayre VX-R Twenty
- Pass Labs XA160.8 (doesn't meet all of my guidance)
- Boulder 2160 (a little above budget)
- Audio Research 160S (doesn't meet all of my guidance)

My Current Setup
- AMG Viella Turbo Turntable w/ Koetsu Onyx Platinum Cartridge
- Boulder 508 Phono Stage
- Mytek Manhattan II DAC (next upgrade after the amp - maybe a dCS Bartok?)
- Audio Research Reference 6 line stage
- McIntosh MC452 power amplifier
- B&W 802D3 speakers
- AudioQuest and Nordost cabling or a Symposium Osiris rack

What I listen to: Anything from the 60s on vinyl, some things from the 70s on vinyl. A lot of large orchestral and jazz, also a fair amount of pop, from any decade, on vinyl and digital. Thanks for reading my long post! I'll keep this thread updated with amps I hear. Lots of great shops in the area. My two favorites are The Analog Room in Campbell and Music Lovers Audio in Oakland and SF.
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Showing 4 responses by almarg

almarg's avatar
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almarg
9,670 posts
 
P.S. to my previous post: Regarding the second of the two questions I stated, it occurs to me that the explanation **might** be that when the Innamorata specs refer to "power consumption" what is being referred to is what I believe most engineers would refer to as "power dissipation." If so the numbers I cited in regard to that question would make sense.

Usually I would expect "power consumption" to refer to how much power is drawn from the wall outlet, and is going into the amp. Which of course must be greater than the amount of power the amp is sending out to the speakers, and much greater in the case of a class A or AB amp. While "power dissipation" is equal to power in minus power out.

Regards,
-- Al

almarg's avatar
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almarg
9,670 posts
 
Regarding the Innamorata II Level II, while my understanding is that it is certainly a very fine amplifier, and while the following may very well not be issues, I would suggest that if you speak with Jeff you ask him the following questions about these specs:

150 wpc at 8 ohms, 210 wpc at 4 ohms

Power Consumption: 129 Watts idle, 350 Watts maximum

The questions:

1) Is the fact that the amp is only rated to provide 60 watts more into 4 ohms than into 8 ohms (210 watts vs. 150 watts, which is a difference of less than 1.5 db) a concern with your particular speakers? As George and I alluded to earlier the combination of impedance magnitude and impedance phase angle of your speakers probably represents an effective load of less than 2 ohms at certain bass frequencies.

2) No amplifier can provide 210 watts into each of two channels while consuming only 350 watts. And for that matter providing 300 watts (150 x 2 channels) while consuming 350 watts represents higher efficiency than can be expected of a non-class D amplifier (and I assume this amp is not class D). How can these numbers be reconciled?

As I mentioned, these questions may or may not represent issues in your particular application, or in other applications, but IMO they are certainly reasonable questions I would recommend asking.

Good luck. Regards,
-- Al

almarg's avatar
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almarg
9,670 posts
 
To be sure it's clear, my previous comments about the speaker not being friendly to tube amplification do not apply to the Aesthetix Atlas Eclipse, since its output stage is solid state.

Regards,
-- Al

almarg's avatar
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almarg
9,670 posts
 
The impedance curves shown in John Atkinson’s measurements of your speaker indicate, on paper at least, that the speaker is highly unfriendly to tube amplification. Especially in key parts of the bass region that you are concerned with, e.g. 50 to 100 Hz or so, taking into account the phase angle plot as well as the impedance magnitude.

Personally I would rule out the ARC 160S as a candidate "a priori," based on those impedance curves.

Good luck. Regards,
-- Al

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