Where do I go from here?

My music listening is primarily only through the mains, which is why I'm leaning toward a nicer 2 channel.  Let me throw in some amps I've seen here; Mac, NAD, Classe, Marantz, Anthem, even Krell in the solid state classe, with a few stereo tube amps or hybrids in the mix as well.  Much of my music listening is via Network services (Pandora, Media Monkey, etc.) but perhaps an upgrade to the Samsung Blu-Ray player is in order?

Thanks, tls 49, I started out that way, but for some reason I opted to use the 650, perhaps thinking bi-amping would make up the difference in power??  I will move things around a little and see what comes of it.  Would you forego the bi-amping then?  Or maybe keep the bi-amping and drive the mains with 4 channels (x 200) and use the remaining 2 for the surrounds?  That would leave the 650 to put the center on a 100 watt output @ 4 ohms (unless I bi-amp) and the surround backs at 50 watts into 8 ohms. (I love experimenting, BTW.)

Thanks, Bill.  The surround sound is less of a concern as I primarily listen in stereo.  I moved the Kef's from the main to the surround and they actually give the sound tracks a little more timbre and depth on the movies.  I am concerned with voice matching the fronts, however, which is why I am parting ways with the Kef IQ2 center and got the Motion 8.  Nothing wrong with the Kef's, I just wanted to move up a little from their entry level.

Thanks again, tls, I moved the amps around and went with the bi-amping (as you were responding, sorry) from the 1565 and put the center on the 5th channel.  Threw in a little Pink Floyd and had voices and instruments from the phantom center with some 'air' behind them, also, after a small tweak to the speaker position (I gave them about a 5 or 10 degree tilt backwards, and slid the left speaker about 2 inches further left), I had a broader and somewhat deeper soundstage.  I will double check on the Audyssey setting, but I don't believe I'm using it.  I will reroute the cabling tomorrow to your suggestion without the bi-amping and check for any difference.  Much appreciated.

your systems potential and the nature of your room may surprise you.

Hey m, thanks for your thoughts.  I have the mains spread about 8' apart, about 2 ' off the front wall (with sound baffling along the baseboard to reign in the bass a little), leaned back about 10 degrees, and slightly toed in.  My listening post is about 10' from each.  I moved them apart slowly until the phantom center started to disappear.  My mid surrounds are equidistant from the front wall and my listening spot.  The Klipsh, while not a true dipole, fire left and right a little higher on the back wall, again, equidistant from my spot.  I'm actually quite happy with the 7.1 setup, and movies on the 4k, 65" curved are pretty awesome.  I made the tweaks above last night and spread the soundstage and added a little depth.  I also agree that the room correction should be minimal if your setup is good.

Ok, soix, I'll give that a try tonight.  I had them closer, then spread them after I read the trick about moving them outward until the phantom center starts to dissolve then toe them in slightly.  I will move them closer together and away from the front wall to about 3'.  Bear in mind, these aren't the electrostats, but the bass port does fire backward, hence the sound dampening.

Your plethora of eclectic species of speakers is going to be a challenge to get it to sound "right". If you go Martin Logan, get all ML. Klipsch, all Klipsch. KEF, all KEF.  

Considering the fact that your front soundstage is ML, try to find the matching surrounds if possible.  

Also, with that Klipsch 10" sub, you will be longing for more really quickly.

Hey Bill.  I agree with your assessment. I am working toward adding some of the ML hybrids as the front mains, and moving the Motion 20's to the mid surround eventually.  At that point, I will decide if the Klipsch need to go.  So far, I am quite happy with those (and the rest for that matter).  It's a matter of pacing my build, unfortunately, I tell my wife, 'millionaire John will have this amp, or these speakers' LOL.  All in due time.  So you're thinking the speakers are the weak link then?

Great point, elizabeth!  I have a modest power conditioning strip that I purchased with the surround back speakers.  I did not notice a big difference at that time, but by now, I'm sure it's helping.  I have been using good shielded interconnects and cables all along, but noise (ac) is always a concern.  I am in the unfortunate position of having all of the wiring 'piled' up behind the entertainment center and have always tried to be cognizant of the ac issue, but I am afraid there is only so much I can do.  Perhaps a rack then should be considered??  Much less expensive than a Krell, eh?

I am wondering which of the components may represent the weak link to my music listening nirvana? ... Since I'm more interested in the musicality of the system, listening to a mix of female vocal, rock, and dipping into the ambient realm now and then, I'm considering the replacement of the Rotel RKD-650 with something in a nice stereo configuration, possibly 3-channel to pick up the center.

Thanks everyone, but we are getting a little off topic, IMO.  I have fiddled with speaker placement for several weeks to get to where I am with them, and I am not really interested in working on the surround system.  Let me ask this, then, if I am going to replace the 650, would a foray into the world of tube amps/monoblocks be a worthwhile investment?  I see the Prima Luna Prologue 7 for $1.7k, what are your thoughts on this matter?

There is a Cary CAD-808 (Rocket 88) in the same price range as well.

Thanks, soix.  I went with the Marantz pre for the 1.4a HDMI in/outs.  I have the 4k tv which looks very nice through the pre/pro (it also passively passes signal in standby) , and I actually just recently moved away from the (Onkyo) receiver for more flexibility.  The other matter is that much of my listening is done through the DLNA feature of the pre with Media Monkey for the several thousand flac songs I have on hard disc.  I need to check the DVD palyer tho, it may also have that feature.  (I need to get a rack soon, LOL)

Thanks, atmasphere.  I wouldn't need the 3rd channel for listening as it would be strictly a dialog channel for movies.  I've been toying with the notion of tubes for awhile.  I see several used options in the sub $2k range.  Any I should avoid or consider more strongly?

Thanks, aux.  Good stuff right there.  I am going to look into the Parasound.  I have seen them listed and read some reviews and they seem to be well received in the audiophile community.  I am also considering upgrading the DVD to something better, which would then become my source for more of my listening.

So here are my takeaways.  I really don't want to add another pre to the line-up, and at the moment, the upgrade to the Marantz is off the table.  It seems that in order to not add to the complexity of the system, I can utilize the 'Pure Direct' (Source Direct) feature of the Marantz to get the best signal passed through the pre.  If I then relegate the RMB-1565 to the surround channels for the digital work of theater and use a decent stereo tube or dual mono amplifiers for my front speakers for 2 channel listening, I should gain the most with the least amount of restructuring the system.  Would you guys (and maybe gals) agree this a fair assessment?

soix, how much would I be sacrificing for the Hegel 160?  I see one of those at TMRAudio in my price range.

Again, great advice, thank you (all) for your insight.  I am absorbing all the good info and will take my time and not rush into anything.  Perhaps a little more tweaking before I pull the trigger on a bigger ticket item.

I'm a little unsure as to how an integrated would meld into the existing HT?  It would replace the RKB-650 obviously, and serve signal to the mains from the DLNA feature or the DVD audio. but how would I switch to HT and the Marantz and RMB-1565?  Sorry, but I said I was newbie ;-)  Extra insight would be greatly appreciated.

Now I'm really confused, I thought the idea was to bypass the pre/pro of the Marantz entirely to get a cleaner signal.

Ahhh, the light goes on.  You guys are a TON of help.  So, basically, it breaks down to either the Hegel 160 or the Parasound integrated dually sourced from the DVD/CD player or HT, or, if I want to use the Marantz pre, I've looked into the Bryston 3B-SST, with a 20 year warranty and wonderful reviews, or perhaps the Anthem MCA-225 as dedicated 2 channel amps.  All of these are in that $1500-$2000 range, and I REALLY wish there was a way to audition them all, :-(

Thanks again, and in the FWIW column, I am definitely leaning toward the Hegel.  If I opt not to do that, I will eventually be upgrading the Marantz, for sure.  I won't say cost is no worry, but I can find a little here and there when I need it (by selling something usually, lol).

Thanks, aux.  As I am going to sleep on this for a few days before I pull the trigger (and maybe sell a motorcycle in the meantime) it may come down to what's available and when.  Hegel, Parasound, I believe either would be a definite step in the right direction.  Anybody want a very slightly used RKB-650 for their office?  Wait, maybe I do ;-)

Update:I talked to a dealer about the pre section of the Marantz and his comment was 'Marantz has gone a long way in making their pre amp section invisible', or something like that.  That, and the consideration that I must keep the whole system as user friendly as possible for my wife, I went with the Parasound Halo A21 with the remote 12v trigger.  Under $2k with shipping so it feels like I got a deal at least.  The Classe` CA-201 was in the running right up until the end, great reviews, awesome piece, but the remote trigger was weird.  An RJ-12 plug from the looks of it.  Not certain if it was a momentary switch or required a constant 12v.  The Bryston 3B-SST was also in the running, but is has some odd terminal posts.  (What is it with these Canadians, eh?)  No offense meant, no hate mail please ;-)
aalenik- It is a 'spare' motorcycle, lol.  I have a decent power conditioner that I bought from a local music store that was closing it's doors.  Right around $300 MSRP if I recall.  Not the best, but much better than a power strip ;-)

"Close Enough to the Very Best"

The Absolute Sound magazine awarded the Halo A21 its "Editors' Choice" recommendation for 2012. "Though not the last word in solid-state amplification, the A21 comes close enough to the very best, at such an affordable price…"

"Its luxurious appearance is more than skin deep. Parasound’s A21 dispensed truly sumptuous sound," notes England's Hi-Fi News magazine for November 2011. "Demonstrating the control and grip of the Bryston and Anthem but with the velvety midband richness of the ATC, the Parasound’s ability to resolve detail, while remaining composed and easy on the ear, proved the equal of my ‘reference’ Levinson amplifier."

I am certainly not going to experience any buyer's remorse on this.  Sorry, soix.  I will need something with a nice warm sound for the ribbon tweeters of the ML Motion 20's.  But hey, everyone has their opinion, and I have seen that they are quite varied, especially on this forum.  Should I need a pre/pro upgrade in the future, well, that seems to be part of what I enjoy as well ;-)  And BTW, John Curl, so,,,,,,,,,,

Again, I appreciate all the input and opinions that were/are offered.  The ear is a very intangible asset, and each has their own taste and level of sonic interpretation.  I only wish (again) that I had a place to audition the gear without a $500 plane ticket.  Even then, the likelihood that any store will have my exact setup for an a/b comparison is highly unlikely so one is still open to the possibility of making a choice which is regrettable.  As I said, tho, I am convinced that either would be a huge step forward in my music adventure.  And now, I can start the search for the better pre amp or speaker, or power conditioner, or room treatment/placement, yada, yada.

"Music with the AV7005 required a bit of reading. Being a musician, I am picky when it comes to music. I know what instruments sound like live and the nuances in sound from within a live ensemble. With the Audyssey EQ engaged, I didn't get that full, wide, engaging sound stage like you do with a live performance. While the music was detailed, the sound was a bit cold and thin. I changed every parameter that I could find and finally, turned the EQ off. After a few manual EQ tweaks, I heard a renewed sound quality and presentation that totally blew away any AV receiver that I have ever owned." Home Theater Review.com  Apparently, the key is not letting Audyssey take the controls.  I'm so looking forward to this.

Hey aux, what can I say.  The Halo is sounding awesome.  The soundstage has improved in height and depth, and the bass is well controled and tight. Mids are as you would expect and the highs are good as well.  I'm probably not going to use any Audessey settings, in fact, I've been listening in 'Pure Direct' for the most accurate sound. The sub has almost become redundant as well and I also set the sub level at -9db in the speaker level settings on the pre/pro.  It's amazing how deep those 5.5's can go on the Motion 20's.  Very happy with it all.

Thanks aux. I am sorry I’ve been away, I’ve been enjoying the tunes, surprise, surprise. What are your thought in using the Optical for the sources like Pandora? I have both a TosLink and Digital Coax interconnects in a box I could pull out. I am certainly going to try your setup. I’m breaking in the new Motion 35xt’s as the mains with biwiring at the moment, but look forward to the comparison. And may I add, I would also HIGHLY recommend the Motion 35’s, even as the mains for smaller rooms. They are borderline for replacing the Motion 20’s in large room, wow! Imaging is already impressive with only a few hours out of the box but I will most likely relegate them to the surrounds, since that is why I bought them. I am firmly in the voice matching camp at this point.