2. amps-preamps
  3. 142953-91258

What preamp creates the largest soundstage?

I have always loved a large soundstage.  I have a small listening room (10x10) and have mini-monitors, driven by a tube amp.  I have played a lot with speaker placement, room acoustics, listening position to create a large soundstage.  I have rolled tubes on the amp and made dramatic improvements. (I have purposely left details on the brands of tubes, amp and speakers out, because I don’t want side comments to distract from my question)

i have a digital source into a solid state naim preamp.  I home demo’ed a well reviewed preamp, and was surprised at how much the soundstage shrunk, both side to side and top downward.  It was deeper, and did have much of the tube magic, but I could not live without the big soundstage.  

so my question is, does anyone have experience with a preamp that produces a big soundstage?  I am looking for recommendations on what to demo next. While I lean toward tubes, I am open to solid state.  I am okay either new or used, and could spend in the 5k range, but would be happy to spend less.  Also comments on specific brands (i.e. xyz is known to have great soundstage in all their preamps) as opposed to models, are welcome.

and I will be the first to admit that perhaps the very large soundstage is not “accurate”to real music, but boy is it seductive and I love it and can’t live without it.

meiatflask

Showing 3 responses by sebs

sebs
4 posts
 
Guys are you saying best preamp is no preamp?
In my experience preamp make huge difference in how soundstage is build and if that is because as per mijostyn: "The job for electronics is to replicate whatever the source is and then perhaps modify it in a very specific way. Some tube electronics give you a sense of more depth which I think is why a lot of us like them but it is a distortion of the truth.". Bottom line is preamps are manipulating this holographic effect in one way on another. In regards to tube preamps I have not heard (DTM) mention by jtgofish but IMHO solid state preamps gave me more of that 3d effect then tube. Question is what preamp will produce vastest, deepest stage stage and 3d effect without over exaggeration. Obviously huge part in all our digressions is the room acoustics which nobody is talking about. Same system will sound completely different in every room. Not sure why many of us chasing for perfect sound swapping gear but not adapting rooms acoustically...   
sebs
4 posts
 
Heaudio123, I do measure but found that friends in same hobby do not understand graphs, waterfalls in eg REW. Furthermore, once all setup is done mic etc would not be used untill any change to the setup. So firstly lack of knowledge and secondly waste of money for them.
I found aswell that propaly integrated sub add another layer to the sound stage, you are able to sense/know in what kind of space recording took place. Since I move to new home few years ago I start having huge issue in 30hz range and no reasonable bass trap or listening position move could solve it, I start using peq upto 100hz range and difference is staggering, tight, quick, controlled lowest octaves. But as will everything some people would argue that manipulation in signal degrades it, I would say that even if it does, the positive change in overall system sound by eq bass overwhelm potential losses. 
sebs
4 posts
 
I will agree but only partialy, yes recording plays huge part in creating soundstage but preamp is egually important. Even best recording from eg chesky records will sound flat, 2d if preamp is not capable of creating holographic, 3d soundstage. I have own preamp from Rotel, Rogue Audio, PrimaLuna, Hegel and currently testing Cyrus. Rotal and Rogue could not create 3d image at all. Primaluna is one of this that acctualy can create soundstage extending beyond and allow speakers to disappear but not at the same level with Hegel or Cyrus. Hegel projects huge, deep, 3d image in all directions, can easily hear sounds to sides of listening position as there were surrounds speakers present, floorstanders complitly disappears leaving only surrounding sound. Cyrus is eqally good but image is moved forward, soundstage is more in front towards the listener and depth shrinks. All this preamp where inserted to exactly same system, cables etc only preamp was changed. Still in quest for preamp, to see what can best hegel p20 and cyrus dac xp with psx-r, both brilliant in this respect. 
More to discover