What makes tape sound better than vinyl ?

Inna, I think you are beginning to see the light, and at a good time I might add.

When I bought my reel, they wouldn't even dust the thing off for you, take it as is. Now, since they can get decent money for a reel, they make sure it's running properly, and that's a good thing for someone who can't fix stuff.

I think this is the best time to buy a reel; new ones are too expensive, and any kind of demand is going to deplete the good used one's; life is too short to sit back and desire something that's at hand for you to get.

I have two Sony Cassette decks; Sony TC-KA3ES. The purpose for having two, was to make tapes in the listening room, and listen to them late at night in the bedroom. That worked out just fine, but when metal tape was no longer available, I began to lose interest.

That deck really popped with metal tape, but the music didn't hold my interest with lesser tape. Our oldest automobile had a tape, but after we traded that in, it made the deck totally obsolete. I only use it for the few spoken word tapes that I have.

What does anybody think it's worth?


      http://www.kenrockwell.com/audio/sony/tc-ka3es.htm

As I stated Inna, Technics are easy to work on, and I haven't found a better company to work with. I began rebuilding mine immediately after I bought it: Black Gate Capacitors, transistors, everything that was rubber got replaced, and I also ordered the repair manual, this deck has never left home,  and I get totally immersed in the music every time I play it.

Inna, this is very close to good as it gets for a home enthusiast, Studer is for commercial use and very expensive,but I know you know that. The tape handling of this deck is very close to Studer. If you wait too long, your hearing will have gone and you wont be able to enjoy it.


      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Cp_Zpdxvuc&t=241s

Before I became an audiophile, I was a working electronics technician who worked with many measuring instruments, some that measured sound beyond human audibility. That was when I judged audio gear by it's specifications. I often wondered why those crazy audiophiles paid big money for equipment that was inferior to mine; theirs had more noise and distortion.

I acquired a loaner CJ preamp that clearly had both noise and distortion, but sounded better musically better than my SS rig. I had to call a friend over to see if I wasn't going batty.

After he confirmed that the CJ sounded better, I quit judging by specification, and let my ears tell me what sounded best.

No instrument can measure all the components involved in music, other than your ears; and that's what audiophiles use to judge their gear.

I have no idea why I'm wasting my time trying to help somebody find a cassette deck when it makes absolutely no sense; right now I'm listening to the 2 track, and no cassette deck I've ever heard is even in the same ball park.

I "gave" my ton of cassette tapes away, and never looked back. A good cassette deck is not cheap, and with a few more hundred, you could have a good reel to reel. Plus I've seen reels that cost no more than expensive cassette decks, but audiophiles can rationalize the irrational.

These are the best cassette decks available on ebay.


              http://www.ebay.com/gds/Top-10-Cassette-Decks-/10000000204927180/g.html


              http://www.ebay.com/gds/Revox-Nakamichi-and-Tandberg-the-Pros-and-Cons-/10000000001829134/g.html


Revox B215 was unmatched in smooth frequency response, vanishingly low hiss levels and overall clarity of sound.


There it is, take your choice.

The example I was thinking of is the way I put my reel to use; record vinyl to reel for convenience, this is constant with few variables, no matter how good the vinyl rig is, the reel playback will sound better.

I use 2 track recorded at 7 1/2 ips. The vinyl is recorded tape out on pre, to tape in on reel. As I explained, the reason the vinyl sounds better on playback, is because the sound is bigger because of the larger tape heads of a 2 track, not only does that mean more detail, but it also adds depth to the sound stage.

I know that's not the same situation as you might expect from the original statement, but I record my vinyl to reel for convenience, and that's what I get. When you compare different turntable setups to different reels, that's not valid because no constants have been stated.

Geoffkait, let me be most specific; I was referring to my deck which is a 2 track. One of my posts explains the differences in the size of the heads in 4 track and 2 track. The heads are larger in 2 track than 4 track. The playback of the 4 track will be identical to the record. The play back on the 2 track will be identical to the record, except the sound will be bigger because of the playback heads. That doesn't only go for the records, it also goes for you speakers, they will sound bigger because the source is bigger.

A small screen TV may not be better than a big screen TV, but you can see and enjoy more detail.

Think of the fundamental difference between a cassette deck and a reel, assuming high end in both cases, the reel sounds better mostly because of the larger heads. In the past, most decks were 4 track allowing you to record and playback in both directions, thereby saving money on the cost of tape. 2 Track records in one direction and that's it.

Since what has been recorded on 2 track is the same identical information that's on the record, you may not consider it better, but bigger sounds better to everyone listening.

This has all the information on vinyl and reel to reel comparisons;


    https://www.theverge.com/2015/10/5/9409563/reel-to-reel-tape-retro-audio-trend

Atmasphere, here are the specification on my tape deck;



Reel to Reel Tape Recorder (1977-87
Technics RS-1500US
Specifications
Track system: 2-track, 2-channel, stereo/monaural system

Motor: 2 x reel, 1 x capstan

Reel size: 5 to 10.5 inch reel

Equalization: NAB

Tape speeds: 3 3⁄4 7 1⁄2 15 ips

Wow and flutter: 0.018% (15 ips)

Frequency response: 30Hz to 30kHz (15 ips)

Signal to Noise Ratio: 60dB

Total harmonic distortion: 0.8%

Input: 60mV (line), 0.25mV (mic)

Output: 0.775V (line)

Dimensions: 446 x 456 x 258mm

Weight: 25kg


How do you compare these specs to whatever it is you are referring to?

Inna, when I bought my Technics, they were almost giving reels away, and since you have been inquiring they've gone way up. I recommend that you get as current a model as possible; for example if Technics, get a RS 1700, 2 track of course.

They are made to be repaired, mine has never left home, I have the repair manuel.

The Otari I have is 2 piece 4 track; that's for professional work and very complex, not easy to repair.

If you buy one that's not up to spec, there are places that can do that for you quite reasonable.


                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YFC-60HvOJM




Here is a fantastic 2 track Otari;



        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Cp_Zpdxvuc



                     

There was a long intelligent discussion by people who actually owned reel to reel decks and were still using them. The OP was handyman 05-26-2010 9:02pm. You can find facts about the reels those people owned.

Tostadosunidos, to begin to answer your question, I had to turn on the reel and relax in the 'sweet spot' with music emanating from that source.

First question, "Is it vinyl, or CD"? I can only tell by remembering when I recorded it. If I don't have the record, it must be CD.

CD's are generated from the computer to line in on the reel. Records are recorded the old fashioned way. Years ago when audiophile PC was a hot topic, I replaced cards in my computer with audiophile cards per the PC forum here and Stereophile.

Right now I'm listening to Jimmy Smith "Angel Eyes", the CD from the reel.



1 Stolen Moments 7:00
2 You Better Go Now 5:15
3 Angel Eyes 8:00
4 Bess, Oh Where's My Bess 4:10
5 Slow Freight 5:47
6 Tenderly 6:25
7 Days Of Wine And Roses 7:00
8 L'il Darlin' 6:57
9 What A Wonderful World 4:25



Bass – Christian McBride
Drums – Gregory Hutchinson
Executive-Producer – Lola Smith
Guitar – Mark Whitfield
Organ – Jimmy Smith
Producer – Don Sickler, Richard Seidel
Trumpet – Nicholas Payton
Trumpet, Flugelhorn – Roy Hargrove


When I focus on the center channel, Jimmy Smith is in the house with that loud and very wide dynamic frequency range like no other organ. (When you record from CD to two track, you have actually expanded what was on the CD without distorting it; same music, just bigger with a wider dynamic range, plus you have also lost any "digitalis".)   Jet black background as well, no tape noise on a good deck.

What I'm hearing  can not be measured, it is the emotional aspect of the music; I've gone beyond what reviewers talk about when describing components, frequency response etc. but into the story line of the song.

Now that I'm into "Angel Eyes", no longer am I in this listening room, but in one of the bistros in a time long past, sitting on the same bar stool, where I sat contemplating one of the "Angel Eyes" I've known.

      
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihZHR63UmNI


When you got the right rig, music can take you wherever you want to go.

As to your original question, it's impossible to get better than live, you have gone past the limits of logic.

I just cranked my reel up (a Technics RS-1500), and right off the bat Lee Morgan's trumpet was in the listening room; I didn't have to make any effort to know that the reel was better than anything else I have, it just is.

If I didn't own a reel, I wouldn't buy one; there are a lot of things you have to know when you own a reel. Although I have learned those things, I still have to go over the check list in my mind when I get involved with the R to R. Magnetism is so taboo, and you have to demagnetize the heads. When you do this, you have to remember to move all your recorded tapes a good distance away, or you will mess them up; over the years I've accumulated quite a few, so that's a headache.


Bigger is better. When you compare the size of a cassette tape head, to the size of a R to R tape head. Stereo half track sounds better than stereo quarter track, assuming that both tape decks are of the same quality.


    https://www.google.com/search?biw=1024&bih=662&tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=caUcWrqIBKrVjwSFgIiw...:


When you compare the convenience of all the digital methods of record and playback, one has to be an extreme audiophile to opt for reel, but for those who must have the very best, there it is.

Inna, this Bud's for you;


          https://www.google.com/search?q=Studer+A+80&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&fir=k_1u13n4VS...:

When you transfer vinyl to reel to reel, it sounds better on playback. The same goes for CD. Many professional audiophiles have concluded there is nothing better than reel to reel.

Since I just enjoy the results, and breaking down each element of why it sounds better takes the pleasure out of basking in the sound of a good reel, I can't help you on specifics.