What is the best way to clean Vinyl?


TIA

128x128jjbeason14

Showing 8 responses by antinn

@jjbeason14

With a $500 budget you have three options: The best one is the one that is best for you. How much convenience do you want, how quiet do you want the process, how long do you want it last, what are you cleaning - only new records, or are you going to be buying used flea-market. But let me emphasis one item, any of these can achieve a clean record BUT, BUT, BUT the devil is in the details.

1. For about $250 with all materials and cleaning agents, manual clean using a record label protector such as the process specified in Chapter 5 of Precision Aqueous Cleaning of Vinyl Records-3rd Edition - The Vinyl Press. This process can clean any record of any condition. But it is fully manual, and the success is based on your technique but it's a short learning curve and there is very little to wear out.

2. For $500 you can purchase a vacuum-RCM. There are a number of variations available, you want one with the suction tube/wand on top of the record - they are the easiest to use. Vacuum-RCM at this price point will be very noisy and they are still manual clean - the chemistry you use and brush you use and how you use the brush will determine how well the record will be cleaned. The benefit of the vacuum-RCM is speed - faster to dry. However, if you dry too-much you will develop static - it’s that devil is in the details (but short learning curve). The durability at this price point can be 3-5 years but choosing one with good OEM support will allow long term use. The suction wands and the Velcro heads need to be periodically replaced. Vacuum-RCM can be used to clean used records with the right chemistry; pre-clean, rinse, final clean, rinse such as specified Chapter XIII - Precision Aqueous Cleaning of Vinyl Records-3rd Edition - The Vinyl Press.

3. For $500 you can purchase the HumminGuru all-in-one ultrasonic vinyl record cleaner. This is not a bad unit when used correctly (remember, the devil is in the details) with this being the best procedure to date: HumminGuru - an inexpensive desktop RCM | What’s Best Audio and Video Forum. The Best High End Audio Forum on the planet! (whatsbestforum.com) - see post #62.

The durability of the HG is unknown, it’s still relatively new but with light use, 2-3 years should be appropriate. The OEM is in China, but support appears so far to be decent. There is an active thread over at Interesting All-in-One Ultrasonic Cleaner - HumminGuru | Steve Hoffman Music Forums. The HG is not great for used records. You will need some form of pre-clean step and people often use a Spin-Clean. However, the HG is very convenient, and is relatively quiet and very compact.

4. For $500 you can put together a DIY ultrasonic tank cleaning system starting with the cheap 40kHz UT now available - Amazon.com: VEVOR Ultrasonic Vinyl Record Cleaner 6L 40kHz Vinyl Ultrasonic Cleaning Machine Knob Control Record Ultrasonic Cleaner 4 Records Vinyl Sonic Cleaner Stainless Steel Tank w/Mechanical Heater & Timer : Industrial & Scientific. To make these work, there is a lot of details, and they will not work very well unless you nail the details. The PACVR Book Chapter XIV has some 40 pages discussing all the details.

Beyond what is addressed above, and what is written in the PACVR Book, there is no lack of information on the web with some 50 different cleaning products all saying theirs cleans the best. There are those that swear-by PVA-wood glue method, and some even use steam cleaners.

It’s a carnival of options, but I will end this as I started it, the one that is best is the one that is best for you, but most any of them can be made to work effectively but make no mistake, the devil is in details.

Good Luck!

FWIW, the record is a blend of polyvinyl chloride (PVC) and polyvinyl acetate (PVA), and together under heat they form a copolymer (once formed does not separate) and is sometimes called polyvinyl chloride-acetate (PVCa); and there are various types of PVCa depending on the quantity of PVA.  PVA is what mostly provides the flexibility but should not be confused with flexible PVC that has plasticizer added which is actually a solvent and the plasticizers used can be extracted and over time can migrate from the PVC.  If the record actually used any amount of plasticizer, it would never last as long as it can (>100 yrs).

So, while its common to call the record PVC or vinyl, it's not, but these are easy and accepted terms.  

@jjbeason14,

First, air drying does not cause static.

However, if you are using the Spin Clean cleaning agent and not drying with their cloths, you may allow cleaner residue to dry on the surface.  

Simple things to try:

1.  Whatever concentration you are using for the cleaning agent, reduce by 50% and make sure to mix only with distilled or demineralized water (DIW).

2.  After cleaning have a clean spray bottle with DIW and lightly spray the record to rinse aways most of the cleaning agent that is only the record.  

3.  Dry the record - use their cotton cloths to remove most moisture until the record is mostly dry, then allow to air dry - it should only take 5-10 minutes at most.

4.  The common carbon fiber brush is mostly useless to remove static - they are not properly grounded - this brush which is cheaper than most - should work much better - -Grounded- Improved for 2022 Carbon Fiber Record Brush (turntableneedles.com).  When using the brush attach the ground cable to any ground post - people often use phono-preamp ground post.  When using the brush only lightly touch the record - no need to dig it in.

Many reasons, just a few:

IV.10 Records that have been fully cleaned can still sound – for want of a better term – bad; clicks, pops, hiss, and distortion. There are any number of reasons such as following, but no amount of cleaning is going to fix these physical defects.

IV.10.1 For new records: Poor recording.

IV.10.2 For new records: Problems with the stamper. The stamper prepared during the plating process may have defects. It may have been prepared dirty so that the surface has the impressions of very fine/microscopic particulate. The stamper may have been overused and is now deteriorated and/or shedding metal particles that are embedded in the record.

IV.10.3 For new records: deficiencies with the record formulation. As previously stated, repressed material may not have the same qualities as virgin material. The material blend can be out of tolerance leaving the record with an inconsistent surface. This may be the source of the common incorrect theory that new records need to have the ‘mold release’ removed. Evidence of oil-splotches is the result of poor record formulation.

IV.10.4 For new records: deficiencies with the pressing. Incorrect pressing heat, pressure and time can leave un-filled areas. Incorrect pressing cooling and time can result in material pulled during separation leaving microscopic defects. Note: It is not uncommon for a clean new record to sound noisy for the first few plays. This is not uncommon. There are often microscopic burrs left from the pressing process, and the first few plays essentially ‘burnish’ the surface, removing the burrs.

IV.10.5 For new and used records: Obvious deep scratches. Very light surface scratches are often of no consequence. For used records, many light surface scratches may indicate use of once popular automatic changers that could play a stack of many records.

IV.10.6 For used records: Groove damage such as trenching from many plays with conical and elliptical stylus. Groove damage can also be from an over-worn stylus.  In this case the stylus carves/chisels away the side-wall ridges. However, Shibata and other advanced profile stylus can sometimes bridge the trench made by conical and elliptical stylus. However, damage caused by Shibata (or equivalent) is likely “terminal”.

@jjbeason14

Vacuum RCMs are mostly about convenience - they suck the fluid from the surface.  The chemistry used, the brush used, and your technique determine how clean the record will be.  There are very high $$$$ vacuum-RCM that have automated cleaning, but nothing near your budget.  

Ultrasonic offers a cleaning method that mostly eliminates your technique as a variable.  But they have limits, and used records generally need a pre-clean and many people use a Spin-Clean or vacuum-RCM for that purpose.  At your budget, the HG is not a bad ultrasonic unit - it's mostly automated and many people like it. 

Will any cleaning method produce miracles - no.  As I wrote above, there are many reasons why 'new' records can be noisy.  Can 'some' records pressed by the better plants on good vinyl near CD background noise quality - yes.  

However, how you handle the record, your environment and turntable mat, can all compromise the best cleaning process.  Everyone has their own rituals on how they handle and play records and the various opinions are at best wide-ranging.  

After all is said and done, my recommendation is always the best process is/are the ones best for you, and only you really know that. Some people are perfectly happy with a full manual process, others want the convenience of vacuum RCM, and others want the ultimate convenience of a fully automated machine.  But just about any cleaning process can be yield exceptional results with the appropriate attention to detail which is why the book Precision Aqueous Cleaning of Vinyl Records-3rd Edition - The Vinyl Press  is 190 pages.  

Good Luck

@odysseas_gr

Yes, you can first rinse the Tergikleen with tap water and then immediately follow with DIW rinse and vacuum, but here is an alternative.  When using tap water, the key is not to allow it to dry.

First, make sure you are using the Tergikleen at the manufacturer's recommended concentration which is 12-20 drops to a gallon (3.8 litres) of distilled water or 3-5 drops to a quart (.95 litre) of distilled water.

After cleaning, perform two rinse/vacuum cycles.  For the 1st rinse cycle, do not fully dry the record.  For each rinse, apply about 10-ml of distilled water to the record.  When applying the DIW, you only need to brush lightly.  Note:  I am not saying to measure out the rinse DIW each time.  But you should measure it out once to eyeball what 10-ml of distilled water looks like on the record.  Many people do not use enough rinse water with vacuum-RCMs.

FYI - the above was developed recently with someone in the UK, and we spiked a cleaning solution of known ingredients and concentration with a high-performance UV fluorescent dye.  What the dye showed is that when using blower-style vacuum-RCMs (like the Project), not all fluid is sucked off the surface. Some fluid is evaporated in-place (20-30%), leaving behind cleaner residue.  Two rinse cycles (with 10-ml DIW) were needed fully remove the cleaner (and whatever it removed from the record).  Also, for the cleaning step, 6-ml was used; any more and rapid agitation with the brush (necessary for best results) would fling cleaner from the surface.  Many people do not use enough cleaner on the record to get good cleaning with vacuum-RCM.

If you are using the same brush throughout, after cleaning with Tergikleen and the first rinse, rinse the brush with DIW spray into a sink or bucket.  

Note that as an alternative to Tergitol 15-S-9 you can substitute Polysorbate-20 which is a concentrated water-soluble nonionic surfactant that is similar and is common in cosmetics and generally readily available worldwide.  It's not as good as Tergitol 15-S-9, but it is good enough.    Details on use of Polysorbate 20 are addressed in the free book - Precision Aqueous Cleaning of Vinyl Records-3rd Edition - The Vinyl Press

Take care,

@odysseas_gr

The difference between Tergitol 15-S-9 and Polysorbate 20 is mostly surface tension.  It's up to you if you want to want to play around with IPA.  If you do decide to mix in IPA, fix mix in the Polysorbate 20 then add the IPA or the Polysorbate 20 will not dissolve very quickly.  Because of liability (flammability & toxicity), I never recommend more than 2.5% IPA.  But note that at 10% IPA, the fluid is classified in the US as flammable - see the book Chapter VIII for details.  Also, be careful of what IPA you use.  Use 91% pharmaceutical or better - the book Chapter VIII has the details.