What is more accurate: magnetic anti-skating, or barrel weight attached a fishline?


I have seen turntables from Project, Music Hall, and a few other brands that still incorporate a small barrel weight attached to short fishline string which is stretched across a hooking loop to set ANTI-SKATING. It seems to be an artifact from the 1960's and 1970's tonearm design. It is also easy to lose or break 

My question is how accurate is that "device" compared to magnetic anti-skating employed by many turntable manufacturers   Thank you

sunnyjim

Showing 4 responses by sunnyjim

Thanks to all the members who responded. I never expected such an impassioned discussion over the anti-skating used on many turntables. I believe one of  the responders ask me what tables have I seen using the wire suspended anti-skating device. On most Project tables, and also on the Music Hall 5.3  and the new MH  Ikura table.

To John-Tracy. Never watched Kung-Fu.  However, I could retitle the thread title to: "HOOK. LINE, AND SINKER"  ANTI-SKATING".....etc. 

I  once forget to apply anti-skating, and the stylus while in play just skated right across the record. I might try it on the Thorens I currently own to see as some have suggested if it improves the sound quality.   

To Almarg, The 4th  paragraph of your response is what I have generally read in various audio magazine including the out of print Stereo Review  The  order of my turntables has been Garrand SL95B,  Thorens 160( actually borrowed from a friend while my Benjamin-Miracord TT sat in a service shop for three months)  Sonograph turntable,  VPI Junior,  Rega 3-24,  Project DC Carbon, and currently a refurbished Thorens TD-145  

To my best recollection, only the Garrand SL95B and possibly the B. Miracord  employed "hook, line and sinker" anti-skating device  For the record,  both  Thorens indicated above did not use this type of anti-skating. The Thorens anti-skating  is simple, but also seems like a toy. You crank a dial on the tonearm to match the tracking force. In addition, it has a scale of  elliptical and conical  stylus , and a scale should you play your LP after using a liquid cleaner. According to a Thorens tech  was the method used in Europe, (possibly only Thorens)

The Rega P3-24 despite its excellent tonearm also employed an anti -skating device that was set by moving to the prescribed setting represented by a series of notches which their inadequate manual illustrated There was a small dial to move to the prescribed notch. I hope Rega has no plans of getting into the drone missile business. It appeared to me a primitive and imprecise device, regardless of  what side of the anti-skating argument you are on.  I don't recall if it was called "magnetic" in the ads or manual

In the August 2016 issue of  Stereophile, there is a full sheet ad on page-46  for  Project's  "upgraded" RPM3  in "fire engine red"  The ad lists in bullet points its improved featrues including  "magnetic anti-skating mechanism"   which is carried forth on the RPM 5  and the RPM-9  tables; The (discontinued) Project 1bXpression clearly shows the fishline and sinker anti-skating, but not the new Project 2BXperience SE. The (discontinued) Music Hall 5.1 table has the device, and also the Music Hall "Ikura" table. 

It appears  that some TT manufacture employ a magnetic anti-skating mechanism to its higher end tables, but this is not necessarily  consistent as can be seen on the MH 5.1, and possibly their new MH 5.3 table.

 Marantz 15 S1  table, and Clearaudio Concept TT do not use the fishline etc etc.    Quite an audio conundrum!!!    Thanks , Jim    

To rauliruegas,  Without a doubt, understanding anti-skating is much more complex that I  had imagine.  Almarg mentioned  some of the points you make in his last response.  I often wonder with all these mechanical and geometrical parameters if analog is really worth it.  As you said it is an imperfect medium. 

 I recently had some bad experiences with both used and new LP's. It seems  even  new  LP's come with their share of pop clicks and surface. noise  About a month ago I purchased a brand new, sealed LP from Music Direct of Vivaldi 's "Four Season" featuring Isak Perlman as lead violin.. His performance is robust and simply spectacular  However, sound quality  was  often marred by pops (some almost explosive) clicks, and  consistent surface noise. The vinyl must have been sourced from  Goodwill stores recycling bin.  And this is supposed to be a new LP!!!

.I have read for years above the declining quality of vinyl used for LP pressings.  I have a 35 year old copy of CCR's LP "Pendulum"  which is virtually silent during play despite less plays than some other older LP's I still have in my modest collection.    

 I just purchased from the Discogs internet used record  Mozart's "Six Quartets Dedicated to Haydn" played by Quartetto Italiano on a Philips label ( issue date unknown, possibly early 1960's)  The performance is sublime, a testament to the dedication and brilliance of  the four musicians.  The sound quality is also extraordinary with a "your are there presence "  However, the vinyl has its share of flaws despite the seller's description of being "almost mint"  The  booklets that accompanies the 3 LP set are beginning to yellow which may be a clue to its age.  So far, I have only played the first LP.  Early out on side two, there is a distinctive hollow echo distorted sound which I know from experience indicates badly worn grooves from either a cheap cartridge or two many plays.  Nevertheless, it is fine recording and a keeper.   Thanks for the comment.

To Stringreen.   Thank you for heads up about the recording of Kuijken's  performance of Vivaldi's "Four Seasons"  I will have to check around possibly on Amazon and Discogs for the recording. I will assume if was an LP recording, not a CD.