What can you tell me about First Sound pre-amps?

I had the First Sound Presence Deluxe MkII at the same time I had the Joule LA100 MkIII. They are polar opposites, but both are excellent pres.

The Joule was a lovely preamp - quiet, easy to use, great soundstage, good bass, rich 'n creamy midrange and smooth highs. It probably made a lot of music sound more beautiful than it is in real life, but that's not always a bad thing. The Joule does need an aftermarket PC to sound its best. I used a TG Audio SLVR which greatly improved punch and dynamics. I also plugged it straight into the wall. While it can initially sound a bit dark in some systems, Jud Barber can help fine tune this pre to one's specific needs and components. It would be just the ticket in some systems.

The FS Presence, OTOH, has terrific PRAT - some of the best dynamics I've ever heard on a tubed pre - coupled with high resolution and powerful bass. For me however, the ergonomics were awkward (the dual attenuators weren't a problem but permanent umbilical to the outboard power supply was and the unit was HEAVY as hell). It could also sound...I dunno...a bit lean or lacking in tonal color/texture, and not as nearly as dimensional as I would like with a tubed preamp. Mr. Go has since provided an upgrade which I believe addresses these issues.

I kept neither of the Joule nor the FS, settling instead on the tubed Herron VTSP-1. I LOVE this preamp. It possesses every bit as much dynamics as the FS Presence with much greater tonal color, plus it has the delicacy of the Joule. The 3D imaging is a kick. The Herron is more realistic than "lush "(although it's not in the least lean or etched.) It's "sound" is hard to describe...it just sounds like music to me, very "alive", drawing me into the performacne every time. Natural, neutral but not bland. I'm done shopping for preamps, unless I get Keith's new version with the remote and phase switch.

First Sound makes outstanding preamps, but I'd also highly recommend the Herrons to anyone auditioning in this price range. (The VTSP-1 fetches around $2100 here used.)

Artg, of course tube sets make a difference, and that's part of the fun of having tubed preamps. I originally heard a FS PD MkII with Siemens, and that's why I decided to try it.

As I said, the FS is an excellent preamp. I didn't like the stock tubes at all, and I know what my ears heard. However, the ergonomics were what really killed the deal for me, it was just too damned heavy and awkward, and I hated the permanent umbilical. I could live with the dual attenuators. But if I hated the ergonomics, why would I roll the tubes?

I sold the FS to a guy who upgraded it, rolled the tubes, has a tubed amp, and is thrilled to death with it. I've since heard the FS with the Siemens again, and I'm still not sorry I sold mine. I can see where it would be a killer preamp in someone ele's system. But not mine. Different strokes for different folks.

The Herron is kind of a special piece, "lush" it ain't, and lush isn't necessarily what I'm going for. As I said, it's hard to decribe its "sound" - it's neutral but not bland. It just makes good recordings sound "alive" in a way live music does. It's a coinnoisseur, music purist's kind a preamp. It will never have the groupies on audio forums that the Supratek and others have. But it is very well respected amongst reviewers and those who have heard it.

If you read CES reports, writers and showgoers always comment on how musical Keith Herron's room sounds, but the fact of its excellence has gotten rather taken for granted - another year, another great sounding room. Keith doesn't bring out a lot of different models, just does what he does very well. I actually see a lot of similarities between Keith's and Emmanual Go's design philosophies, and the two preamps are different flavors in the same "sound family". The biggest difference is I wouldn't roll tubes in the Herron for nuttin' - Keith does some kind of voodoo with those stock tubes, and I ain't messin' with success.

System synergy plays a big role in these things, and we all tend to be partial to our own gear (we bought it and live with it after all, we must like what it does for in our systems). In my system, Herron preamp and mono amps, Alon Vs, the synergy is great.

Happy listening.

YMMV. Ain't no right or wrong.

Yes, I know, however, I acquired the FS over two years ago. But it was so heavy and awkward for me to handle, especially with the umbilical to the power supply. (I am an audiogal, BTW), I just didn't like using it. The Herrons were so synergistic with each other and with my speakers, plus so much easier for me to deal with, I didn't pursue other options with FS once I'd settled on the Herron. The dual attenuators didn't really have anything to do with my decision. Plus, I kept the FS for quite awhile - I didn't just keep it in the system for a week or two and then sell it.

I wouldn't let the lack of a remote prevent purchase of anything I liked the sound of. Sound quality comes first, then reliability, then ease of use, then looks, then remote is somewhere near the bottom. I can get up outa my chair. The dual attenuators weren't really a big deal, you get used to them - they're detented. The Herron VTSP-1 I have now doesn't have remote either, although Keith's new model does.

If you ask him, I'm sure Emmanuel Go will tell you that a remote compromises the sound quality in his designs...and Mr. Go is a stickler for sound quality. That's pretty much what Keith Herron used to say til he figured his way around it with the new VTSP-2, which now has remote, and sounds just as good as my VTSP-1 (166)...it may even be a hair warmer than my preamp.

My system, when I auditioned the FS, was a Cary 303, Alon V Mk IIs, and different amps: Edge, Herron M150s, and Meitner MTR 101 MkIIs, Nordost Quattro Fil interconnects, Coincident speaker cables and TG Audio power cords.

I never considered the Lamm or the lovely Calisto (which I have heard BTW) because both were way out of my price range.

Good point Artg, as indeed we should be polite - aren't we the lucky ones to be able to choose amongst the excellent preamps discussed in this thread?

Any of them can be fabulous, just depends on your system and your personal preference.

Mphnkns...maybe the Valhalla & FS together are too much of a muchness.

I tried several ICs besides my Nordost while I had my FS, including Cardas Golden Reference, FMS Gran Finale and a couple others.

Artg, interesting to note you have the Berning amp, I think Berning amps and the FS are an especially good match, at least from anecdotal evidence.

Artg & other FS fans - just curious, what kind of music do you mainly listen to? I listen to all kinds but about 70% classical, especially large scale orchestral & choral. I do listen to rock, but the majority of what I play through my system is acoustic music of some type.

I'm also aware of the limitations of my front end (Cary303/200) which is very good but not SOTA, especially in the upper frequencies - that's not however, the area where I found the FS lacking for me. If anything, the Cary is fuller in the mid-bass to midrange than is strictly neutral.

BTW, the only common denominators I see with my system and Mphnkns' system are Neuance Platforms and Lak! Never tried Billy Bags and don't want to.

It's been a couple years since I heard a Callista but it was an amazing preamp. Better than the Calypso.

I have no idea what "granularity" in the volume control means - finer increments maybe???? Wanna 'splain that Drubin? I'm fuzzled.

I do love my Herron. I forgot to add that it has the 166 upgrade. I would love to hear the VTSP-2. It adds remote and polarity switch to the VTSP-1a/166 I have, which may be my dream preamp. BTW, all Herron preamps have mono switches.