Vinyl sounds better (shots fired)

@mambacfa 

I agree with you in as far as that vinyl usually sounds better than digital formats or at least I prefer it.

However, it’s not true that digital is an approximation. It can exactly reproduce the original waveform of the music on reconstruction. In any case, having digital in the chain doesn’t appear to adversely affect the sound of vinyl.

The reason for our vinyl preference must lie elsewhere.

@russbutton

That’s a bizarre comparison you’re suggesting there. Surely a more meaningful comparison would involve turntables and streamers of equal cost, whether at budget or high end.

You’re conflating the comparison of vinyl versus streaming with the entirely different argument of whether it’s worth spending more on hifi in general. That issue is worthy of a thread of its own.

@russbutton

I don’t doubt your PC/DAC combo is quite good, but so would be a turntable of similar cost.

Although the loudspeakers make a big difference to the character of the sound, it is the source that makes the most difference to the sound quality.

@russbutton 

The problem with your argument here is that value is whatever you deem it to be.

You’re quite entitled to your opiniin on this, but unfortunately it tells us nothing about the subject of this thread.

In response to @russbutton’s somewhat crotchety negative points about vinyl records, here are a few positives that come to mind:

• I can listen to vinyl records all night without fatigue
• There’s a vinyl club at my local pub
• We have great independent record shops in my region
• It’s one activity I share with my kids
• We always know what buy each other for Christmas and birthdays
• I enjoy the physicality and paraphernalia of records
• Vinyl records more often than not sound better than the equivalent digital formats

The truth is I need both vinyl and streaming. There’s a lot of good stuff in my local digital library. Also, streaming is excellent for exploring new music or checking out albums I don’t necessarily want to buy. But ultimately when comes to serious critical listening, vinyl wins hands down.

@stealthdeburgo

I find it interesting that you mention both processing and compression. These were two big factors in me getting back into vinyl after a hiatus of four years. I regard that time as a failed experiment and a big misstep. My original decision was a matter of head over heart. It turned out that the heart had been right.

After a couple of years, I experienced remorse over selling my turntable despite upgrading the streaming capabilities of my system. Having seen the enthusiasm of friends and my sons for vinyl, I asked my dealer to lend me a Klimax LP12 that he had taken from a customer in part exchange. Its only difference to my old turntable was that it had the Urika II phono stage. This carries out the RIAA conversion in the digital domain. In tandem with the improved clock of my Klimax DSM /3 Hub, it made a huge difference to the sound quality of vinyl on an LP12. Despite the upgrades that I’d made to the streaming side, I found that generally vinyl trounced streaming on my system.

Now, there are some remastered records that don’t cut it in comparison to the original pressings. This appears to be down to poor mastering. It’s not just pop music that suffers from over compression - rock music and other genres are also affected. The crystal clarity that comes with the digital formats is not enough for me. I also need the excitement that vinyl can bring. Perhaps, classical music enthusiasts value different things in music reproduction. Certainly they were among the early adapters to CD due to the absence of surface noise. My reaction then was that the early CD experience also took away the (expletive deleted) music.

I can’t claim to understand what it is that gives vinyl its special quality, but to me it’s just more enjoyable particularly for prolonged listening sessions. It gets more thrilling as time passes, whereas streaming becomes slightly tiresome in comparison.

@rauliruegas

Yes, it’s possible that some systems may be optimal for either vinyl or digital formats. However, it can’t be the whole story. I find my preference for vinyl is not system dependent. It’s there with both budget and high end set ups and all points in between.

I prefer vinyl on a Linn Exakt system that many all analogue audiophiles would turn their noses up at because it is digital throughout much of the chain with DSP. You can’t get much more optimised for digital than that, yet vinyl still sounds great.

I suspect that it is the differences in mastering that are the most significant factor.

Of course, it’s only a preference, albeit it quite a big one. If others favour streaming or CDs, that’s fine by me. As always, it’s a matter of balancing the pros and cons - there are no absolutes here.

@atmasphere 

Thank you. It’s good to hear that confirmed by someone with personal experience. Your contributions here are highly valued. 

@mambacfa

Brilliant satire. I especially liked “the intelligentsia of the audiophile community” - a contradiction in terms if ever I heard one.

If the geniuses in the music industry could master CDs and digital files properly, Luddites like us wouldn’t need to take refuge in vinyl.

Incidentally, I just realised another major benefit of the sound of vinyl replay.

There are many artists and albums that I found to be impenetrable on the fully digital formats. Yet on vinyl, they are accessible.

For example, I attempted to get to grips with the discography of Yes beyond the handful of popular classic albums from the seventies on streaming. It wasn’t until I heard the unfashionable ends of their catalogue on vinyl without the harshness previously experienced, that I realised most of their albums are enjoyable listens. On vinyl their music just flows effortlessly.

It’s no coincidence that the few Yes albums I liked, were the ones I’d heard on vinyl long before CDs ever existed.

Of course streaming is the technically superior format. Unfortunately, we are not hearing its full potential because of the mastering of the albums that are available to us.

@gbmcleod

When I was learning to play guitar, I listened to a lot of pre war country blues all the way back to Charlie Patton on tape and later CD copied from old 78s. It’s amazing how the performances can sometimes transcend the limitations of those old analogue recordings.

@billpete 

I kept my LP records all the way through the barren CD era, then added to them and upgraded my turntable during the vinyl revival. Yet I made the silly mistake of selling my turntable to improve the digital side about six years ago. I said before this was a head over heart decision. My former dealer and friend advised against it because he'd done the same thing himself only to return later.

Of course, it wasn't irreversible because I still had my precious and mainly pristine LPs stored lovingly in flight boxes. Then I did a really stupid thing and sold my collection for a tenth of what it would cost to buy again. I didn't really think it through properly. We were moving house to downsize at the time and I had a major operation just a couple weeks before. I was desperate to cast off possessions before the move.

It turned out that I couldn't live without vinyl despite having a top notch streaming setup. Now I've got another turntable, I regret so much the decision to ditch my records. Nevertheless, I am really enjoying accumulating more.

Trolling posts like this personalising the issue by provocatively pitting one format against another are the epitome of insecurity. The mention of cost is telling.

The truth of it is that mastering is key and we need both formats to cover all the bases. Nevertheless, it’s perfectly ok to prefer the sound of one over the other.

@gbmcleod 

Much popular music on streaming services and CD, etc. is marred by the choices made during mastering. This does not necessarily apply so much to vinyl releases, which often sound better as a consequence.

This is sometimes given as the driving force for the vinyl revival. If you look on places such as the Steve Hoffman Forums, you’ll see a lot of attention given to finding the best versions of albums on each format.

Some people go as far as to say that mastering trumps format. I am not totally convinced that this is the whole story, as I suspect there’s something about vinyl per se that we like.

At the end of the day, if it sounds better, it is better.

The other day, I heard some Michael Jackson tracks on the original vinyl for the first time. I was stunned to hear them as they are meant to sound. People were moved to get up and dance. In all these years, I never realised how good he was and how amazing the musicianship is on his records. I’d thought it was just pop music for kids. How wrong I was.