Vintage Japanese DD Consult and Suggestions Please

The Pioneer Exclusive P3 is a TT, I have looked at over the years, and see it when discovered for sale in Japan, priced as a model to share a similar asking price as the Yamaha GT 2000X.

The P3 has not crept up to the Value of the asking price for the DP 100 or SP 10 Mk 3, even though the R&D behind it, as a result of the Exclusive Department in Pioneer was really cutting edge for the advanced thought used.

The P3 and GT 2000 Models share a similarity in their design where the Motor / Stator / Bearing Housing are embedded into a Chassis / Plinth.

The P3 Isolates the electric circuits from mechanical influences by having them mounted on their own Sub Plinth that is separated by Spring Couplings from the Chassis / Plinth.

The GT 2000 design has the electric circuits off board, which does seem to be the most cost effective method to Isolate Electrics from mechanical influences.

The P3 and GT 2000 will benefit substantially from adopting materials becoming more common in their use and having the Mechanical Assembly embedded into a Resin Impregnated Densified Wood Board Material.

I am now in possession of a Kaneta Design SP 10 Mk II, which is mounted into a Phenolic Resin Impregnated Densified Wood Board known as Panzerholz. The Electrics are off board and there is something more attractive in the end sound, but difficult to nail down.

Does the electric circuits being isolated from mechanical influences really bring something to the forefront that is perceived as an improvement to the sonic, or is the perceived improvement in sound, solely due to creating a new environment for the mechanical assembly to function within?

Time constraints have not allowed for an evaluation to be extensively undertaken using the same TA>Cart' > Audio System with a Typical Design SP 10 Mk II incorporating Speed Control Upgrades and an improved Bearing design, mounted on a Panzerholz Plinth.

It would make sense to have the improved bearing design used on the owned Typical Design SP10 Mk II added to the Kaneta Design MkII, but the Kaneta Design allows for a whole new rethink on how a Bearing Design can look and be produced.

My own observations remain, there are similarities, the statement that was made remains unchanged.

 "The P3 and GT 2000 Models share a similarity in their design where the Motor / Stator / Bearing Housing are embedded into a Chassis / Plinth."

I'm sure a list that is produced, that points out where there are differences between the Two Models will be quite long.

The Newest Design used for a TT, that I  have adopted also mimics the methodology for the mounting of the Mechanical Parts, which is also seen either on the P3 or the  GT 2000.

The earlier design and the methodology for the Mounting of the Mechanical Parts is quite changed. There is no longer in use, a Purpose Produced Chassis that has the mechanical parts attached, which is then seated upon a Purpose Produced Plinth, which over time become available in a variety of designs .

There is a merged Chassis / Plinth  design that has the Mechanical Parts embedded into the material used. 

In relation to Suspension Support, I use a Panzerholz Sub Plinth, which is separated from the Chassis / Plinth using Solid Tech 'Feet of Silence' which Superseded the usage of AT 616 Footers for TT Duties.   

As stated, there are assessments to be undertaken, but not to be rushed into, where the intention is to get an improved understanding of where the merits of the design are showing their strengths. 

When expressing an Interest in Vintage Japanese DD TT's, there are two ways to observe them, which are loosely described below:     

1, Is the observation through 'Rose Tinted Glasses' where the assembled product with a unknown hours of usage life of close on 50 Years is not considered.

An individual is somehow missing / avoiding what a 50ish Years in the real world can mean for a TT's Electronics and Mechanical Parts.

2, The Link will show an individual a good insight into what is being bought into, the Link is representative of most Vintage DD TT's to be seen on a Shortlist.

Mechanical Parts are limited and the Electronic Parts are quite substantial and quite complex. 

Mechanical Parts can have had way too many rotations where critical parts are functioning in a non ideal environment, where a minimum negative effect developed is that the axis of the Spindle may not run true, creating a eccentric rotation and speed fluctuation.

Furthering regular usage of a TT with an eccentric rotation in a non ideal environment can lead to excessive wear on a sacrificial part such as a Bush. The excessive wear of a Bush/Bushes can result with a scribing showing on other Sacrificial Parts or even worse, scribing can show on parts that should be a Polished Finish, where scribing that has developed is most likely caused by metal particulate from worn Bushes being encountered in a very dry shaft with all signs of Factory applied lubricant long long dried up or leached from the Bearing Housing the Bearing Housing many many years passed.

Good Luck with the Electronics being Top Drawer, I only know Specialists who can comment on this when they have the TT on their Workbench.

The reality for quite few TT owners of all types from this period is commonly as follows:

I bought a Vintage TT, I Powered on and it rotated, Eureka, I have a perfect TT.

I'm looking for the Perfect Tonearm for my TT, after a Hum and Ha, I've just bought a TA at £2K - £3K - 4K for my Perfectly Working Vintage TT.

I'm now looking for a Cartridge to mount on my TA to get the best out of my Perfect Vintage TT. I am now the proud owner of a £2K - £3K - £4K Cartridge.

My take is use others known for their knowledge on a particular TT, to inform if the Vintage TT is a Perfect TT. Once this is a done deal, spend however one wants on how the other ancillaries are chosen to be used with the TT.    

http://amp8.com/amp-etc/record/denon/dp-80-3.htm

For the record, all owned TT's are from a Vintage Period and ones Vintage DD ones used daily are brought to a fine fettle, by an individual who knows the Brands very very well and are reputed for their work undertaken. Both Bearing Condition and Overhaul and Electronics Function are addressed when on the Workbench.

The extra outlay for the TT's is a monies very very well spent.

@pryso  Thank You for your contact, unfortunately I can't reply through the private mail as I can't access mails on this forum. 
Your mail sent was seen in my personal email account.

Making a contact through a private mail is fine, I assisted a selection of Gon Members over my period of membership through their contacting me privately.

A Plinth Design for a TT and a Structure Material used for a  TT Plinth are two different entities. 

A Plinth Design can incorporate a selection of materials, which might have different Intrinsic Properties that impact on a attractive coefficient of expansion (CTE) in heat or humidity being maintained.
Rate at which Shrinkage occurs to a material is also a consideration when moisture is absorbed.
A design can also be one where there is not too much thought in place, to show there is a discipline used to optimise the Critical Geometry.  
When the above design is encountered as an incorporation into the Structure for a TT. It is inevitable that optimised set up will be quite difficult to maintain and a sonic will become compromised as the interfaces become lesser in their optimisation.

Choosing a Material as a Structure to support a TT can speedily remove some of the above concerns, if the correct materials are selected and used that are with intrinsic properties that make them noticeably stable in a cross a selection of environmental conditions, the need to be overly concerned about optimised set up conditions being maintained is much lesser of a consideration over time.

The next to consider is what is the want from the individual for the selected Plinth Material:
1, Is it selected to function as a Massey Material ?
2, Is it selected to be a Light Weight ?
3, Is it selected using the Materials Intrinsic Properties, supported through data, that shows the materials has a very desirable Damping / Dissipation for managing Mechanical Energies being transferred or alternatively managing local environmental kinetic energies being transferred ?

Each material type that can be adopted from the sections above will have their own unique sonic, as a result of how energies transferred though the material are managed and how the material itself is isolated from the local ambient environment energies being transferred.

How does a individual discover which id their most attractive material to have maintained as a Structure to support a TT?
In my case trial through experiencing many different materials as a Plinth,  where a small selection of trials were carried out experiencing the same TT > Tonearm > Cart' in the same system on the same supporting structure for the system.

My selection for a Plinth Material and ongoing investigations into how to best attach a TT mechanical system to the Plinth, does not indicate I have discovered something that is ubiquitous to all tastes. I am very confident I have discovered a methodology that is the most transparent in use that I have been familiarised with, and that this is most favourable to my tastes for a sonic.

I can't inform an individual where their journey stops when it comes to getting on Bus and venturing into selecting a Colouration is most attractive to them, in this subject, most are very unique in what their preference is. 
Each individual has their own stop where they get of the Bus.

Linn as an example has produced the Bedroc using a material type that is becoming more and more popular in use from a Commercial Entity or a enthusiast DIY Builder.
This material used in a Linn TT Design be a step further in managing ambient energy transferal, Linn have remained on the Bus and are inquisitive, in my opinion, they found a material that has attractive qualities, even though they overlooked some of the most attractive properties in what a structure should be when selecting the material.  

My own experiences to date has lead me to using Resin Impregnated Densified Wood Board Material as the Plinth to support a TT, this material has excelled used with DD TT's, especially those from a Vintage Japanese era..