Hi Lewm /all
yes, still listening to the Exclusive P3, as is T-Bone and Jaspert.
Specs wise, they are faultless and a lot better than the tt-101. The SP10 mk3 has better start up torque to the P3, yet the both the L-O7D and P3 have better s/n ratio.
sound wise, fast and smooth.
Over the weekend I played some Grant Green on the P3, then over to the TW Acustik AC-3. the vistor thought the TW was playing slow. It wasn't, it was just the P3 starts and stops like a F1 car. the Lyra cart on the p3 obviously helped v the dyna which is a little slower.
The Exclusive was the best selling high end table in Japan. No doubt that was a combination of performance and something that looks awesome without any drawbacks.
cheers |
My intermittent speed problems on my Pioneer Exclusive P10 - racing up and down and failing finally became permanent.
Took the table into the tech and he said most probably changing all the caps would fix the issue. yesterday I got a call that the table was ready.
When picking up he said that replacing all the caps did not fix the problem. he searched the entire web and no schematics on the table. He eventually found it was a faulty IC from the 45rpm control that did not switch off and would distribute noise/interference to the 33 IC control.
these specific IC's had been long discontinued. So he studied a bit more and made his own! problem fixed.
the interesting this was that the tech had previously worked on Denon and Halcro's JVC DD's. Even thou they look similar from the outside, the internals and design's of all 3 were very different as was the number of parts, complexity etc etc.
I played it at home all last night and the speed sync's straight away and is playing beautiful music - fingers crossed it stays that was, but with the caps all changed on my 35 year old DD I have a fighting chance :-)
cheers |
Hi Albert
I have no technical ability, however I assume a really competent/talented technician would have the necessary skills to copy an entire IC, which is what he did.
Thanks to Halcro for recommending Chris Kimil, even thou he had replaced my Wilson tweeters. I did not realise that he fixed turntables.
I am even thinking now of having the tech replace all the 35 year old capacitors on my Exclusive P3?
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Hi Lewm
Yes, I believe you are correct. Chris said he replicated the IC with 7 components? That is about how technical I got or understood.
He did mention the Pioneer circuit board was the simplier of the three dd tables he has worked on.. The JVC and Demon were crowded and complex relatively speaking.
Yes Henry, excellent work from Chris indeed and thoroughly recommend him to anybody. Thanks.😇
And yes gents, I will have Chris take a look and replace all the caps for safety. 35 years service is pretty good and they may last another 35, but as you said if they fail due to age it will be good to safeguard it not have it happen.
I have asked my mate from Japan first to see if he has a Exclusive P3 Japanese service manual, but I doubt he has one, especially since Pioneer still service all Exclusive products in Japan.
Cheers and happy listening to all with their timeless Japanese DD tables 😁 |
Lewm/Pryso
thanks for your concern. but the tech has no concerns about exploding caps or his ability to fix if any fail, even thou there are NO technical manuals available so he will be going somewhat blind again.
This is the same tech that fixed my P10 and Halcro's DD's, making his on IC on the P10 so he is more competent than most - There was nothing wrong with the caps in the P10 either.
The P3 was serviced by Pioneer Japan before I bought it a few years back.
I actually slipped a disc in my back trying to move the P3 into the car, so off the radar for some time now. Does not mean I won't do it in the future, but anything this old can fail at any time.
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I was going to take my Pioneer Exclusive P3 into my tech to have caps etc replaced. He asked me what was wrong with the table. I said, nothing but a few audiophiles said to take it in for preventative maintenance to replace the caps.
He said, changing caps will do nothing for the sound as they are part of the control the turntable speed in the dd table. With the dd tables, it either works perfectly, or it doesn't- simple.
He said tonearm and cartridge will have more impact on the sound than any changes you do to the table, as long as it is working to spec.
If it stops working like my P10 did, he will fix it.
Good enough for me. FYI - Lyra Delos for its comparatively cheaper price is world class. Syntax is correct, it is more resolving than the more expensive Kleos.
Cheers |
Halcro
Hi Henry. Thanks for that. I have ordered the Jico mat. The MS copper mat these days is just too expensive
Its a good idea to have 2 thicknesses of the mat. I can try one on each table 😀
It will be interesting to hear how they sound.
Cheers |
I have now compared the Jico leather mat with the custom rubber mat that comes with the Exclusive P3.
Overall the leather mat has good transparency let down by a softening of the leading edge of instruments and a slight fattening of the sound in the upper bass. would probably be good with neutral/lean SS gear.
The P3 rubber mat is more coherent top to bottom and the music is more involving.
A bit of a PITA is the thicker mat is not flat - it bows where the Jico cattle mark is. Makes every lp look like it is bowed. Sort of defeats the purpose of a mat when it cannot effectively coiuple the lp to the platter.
YMMV
Still have to compare on my P10 and TW Acustik.
cheers |
Hi Lewm
Great to hear your LO7D is up, running and sounding so good. That you prefer it slightly to the technics Mk3 is also interresting.
Me, still using the Pioneer Exclusive P3 most of the time and its sounding absolutely superb.
cheers |
The Pioneer Exclusive P3 does not have a straight arm wand. The straight arm wand does sound a lot better than the S. Something you can find in Japan for time to time.
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Halcro and Lewm
Bad news re the Victor 101.
Halcro and I have the same tech. He did mention when I had a problem with my P10 last year that the Victor 101 was incredibility complex. The Pioneer otoh was straight forward and quite simple it is circuit. Fingers crossed my P3 continues to give me great service. |
Henry
Good to see you coming over to the Pioneer way of thinking. DD with integrated plinth and more sophisticated suspension as you go up the food chain.
There is also a QL-A75 with 980LZS cart for sale in Sydney - you might want to pick that up
http://www.stereo.net.au/forums/index.php?/topic/88966-fssyd-victor-ql-a75-direct-drive-turntable-with-stanton-980lzs-cartridge-and-100v-stepdown-transformer/
Enjoy |
Great new Halcro!!
But seems like those JVC techs might have been cutting corners back in the day :-)
touch wood, but the Pioneer Exclusive turntable did not have any corners cut.
I guess that is why they offered lifetime servicing for all Exclusive hifi gear.
Unfortunately the hifi gear might outlive Pioneer corporation. |
All VPI DD's are now factory direct and will be personally made by me.
HW
If its now factory direct, it should be AT LEAST 1/3rd cheaper at 20K since VPI are no longer selling to retailers.
Is it now 20K? |
Hi Henry aka Halcro
I now see you put the leather mat directly to the platter, not on top of the rubber mat like the Jico play pictures😀
I am a little worried as I dont use a record weight with my P3 or P10 as it sounds better without. The same platter or is sunken a bit with the lip around it. The thin Millennium mat did not get over the height of the platter lip so the lp was sort if touching it.
I have tested the P3 rubber mat ( it is very thick) and it has sounded better than the thinner Technics mat, Boston 1, Millennium, SAEC steel mat and Living Voice mat.
So the leather will be interesting |
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Hi lewm
How is your technics SP10 mk3 configured?
that is plinth, tonearm and cartridge.
cheers |
Very nice Lewm. Good to see you using it with a modern tonearm
Its your best sounding turntable now? What does it bring sonically that the others don't? |
Cool Lew perhaps lanquid is not what you implying as the Lo7D sound :-) Definition of languid 1 : drooping or flagging from or as if from exhaustion : weak arms too languid with happiness to embrace him — John Galsworthy 2 : sluggish in character or disposition : listless proceeded at a languid pace 3 : lacking force or quickness of movement : here is a reasonably priced Mk3 with plinth - at lease compared to Artisan Fidelity OTT pricing. https://www.audionirvana.org/forum/title-to-be-added/buy-and-sell-equipment-and-music/49679-technics... |
I have a TECHNICS SL-1000MK3D coming in next week, which I am looking forward to. Finger crossed the freight company look after it.
First up will be to use it with the EPC-P100C-MK4 Cartridge.
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Hi Henry.
No. That is a lot more expensive, has been modified and is in the US, so freight would be a killer. That was mpre a post for any potential US buyers.
I am getting one locally, well from Perth. The guy had 3, and wanted to go down to 2. An opportunity I could not pass.
Yea, I think I am going to have to sell the Exclusive P10 soon as I don't have anymore space left on the cabinet.
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Hey Lew. sorry - P3 is staying :-)
Hi Raul - Both P3 and 1000mk3 are stock. The technics is of interest as you can put a different tonearm onto it. I am planning to try my Thales Simplicity II to try and get a best of old world / new world.
cheers Shane |
Hi Lew
The P3 plinth is isolated from the chassis. The motor and tonearm are on a separate spring/oil suspension. If you do a search you will see a naked picture of the P3 sans plinth.
Cheers |
Hey Lew
My audio buddy who was living in Japan who got me my P3 had looked at removing the wood plinth, bit it was more difficult than thought. The on/off, speed and power buttons are part of the wood plinth build.
Personally, I would love to do it as it looks just as cool naked.
My P3 was fully service by Pioneer Japan before I got it in 2009. Its nothing like the LP12 suspension, its very stiff and does not go off. |
Hi Henry
very nice DP100M. Buy it off him :-)
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Hey Henry
it should be here on Wednesday, so should be able to play over Easter.
Its the full
SL-1000MK3D. This is the model with the P mount tonearm. I will first use it with the
EPC-P100C-MK4 Cartridge.
Later I am going to use my Thales tonearm with it. I have a NOS Technics arm board, however I have a another arm board coming in from the USA so I practice on that one first setting up the Thales.
so direct stk technics vs P3 will be difficult.
cheers
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Hi Guys. thanks.
The tonearm was a freebie after I asked for it to be part of the deal. Only really to be able to use the
EPC-P100C-MK4 cartridge as originally designed. Glad I did get it now, but not being able to change any parameter of a cartridge is a strange feeling.
I am even thinking of getting a Ortofon 320 or OMP 30/40 but not sure why as it would not sound as good as the EPC but may be a bit of fun thou.
Any idea which one would sound better?
Anyway in a month or so I will look at setting up my Thales tonearm on the table.
The Exclusive P10 will now have to be sold as I have no shelf space for it.
cheers |
@best-groove
I bought the SL1000Mk3 so I could put a Thales Simplicity II and Lyra Atlas on it from my TW table and this should raise the playback level a few notches. This will come in time.
the tonearm was a freebie that I am enjoying, as previously my EPC-P100C-MK4 was residing in an adaptor. The EPC-P100C-MK4 is as good as my Dynavector XV-1s so it is a great cartridge.
There is very little lacking with the sound I am getting so far.
There is one thing that sucks about this table - the turntable dust cover does not open high enough and acoustic transparent it is not, unlike the Exclusive P3 glass dust cover. The cover will stay off most of the time now.
regards
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@lewm LOL. Dust cover bad karma. I need to burn it at the stake😊
Yea, pretty sure it will be in storage very soon. |
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Hi Misha
Come to Sydney for a holiday and bring your turntable.
Yes, Chris is in Sydney.
Cheers |
@lewm
I have also seen your blanket statement that all vintage DD’s need to have all electrolytic capacitors replaced.
I have asked my tech (same as Halcro’s) a couple of times and he has stated - NO. If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it unless its a known problem.
Replacing caps for no reason on 30+ year old boards/wiring can cause other issues as well as cost the customer $$ for no sound quality benefit. If a cap leaks, its easy to replace/fix is his advise.
My Exclusive P10 had speed issues and my tech replaced most of the caps, however it ended if a IC circuit was the issue - nothing to do with caps.
My Exclusive P3 stopped - it ended up just being fuse - he did not want to replace any caps as the table works perfectly.
My Technics SP10 mk3 famous speed chip failed - my tech fixed it per JP’s advise to bypass the IC circuit till he makes his new IC chips. I did not even ask him to replace the caps this time.
I agree with Raul on this one - no need for replace all electrolytic capacitors imo :-)
cheers |
Hi Raul
You have heard the new Technics SL1000R? |
Does it really matter. All our tables in 20 years will be worthless as nobody will be buying any physical media or players.
Streaming will rule world.
Lets enjoy our tables while we are still alive and kicking |
Not likely. Television didn't render radio obsolete. The automobile didn't
eliminate the horse industry. The ballpoint pen hasn't stopped production of fountain pens. LOL. what has television got to do with music? last I looked, not many horses and carriages carting people to work and back. Fountain pens are some stupid expensive luxury item these days. Not many 8 tracks, 78's, minidisc's, DAT or cassettes sold these days. CD is obsolete as well as vinyl - at least vinyl sounds great. Who is going to buy vinyl and turntables after you and the rest of us are 6 feet under? 99.99% of the population will be Streaming. |
