Vibration isolation or absorption?

ISOLATION IS THE NUMBER ONE MISCONCEPTION IN AUDIO

Springs, discs, pucks, squish balls, pads, cones, spheres, and all the materials have retailed in audio since the late 1980s.

All these devices are coupling products according to the empirical laws.

Isolation does not exist on Earth in the presence of gravity. Audiophiles are a small group of believers who insist it does.

How many believe a wood shelf isolates resonance? How many believe their equipment should float in space, free from all earthly vibrations? How many believe isolation is the goal leading to the holy grail of sound quality? 

Do you know electricity is the root cause of vibration?

 

DECOUPLING – AUDIO’S SECOND ULTIMATE MISCONCEPTION 

Coupling and decoupling are the most popular marketing strategies used today. Two names have taken the modern-day helm leaving many methods and theorems of vibration management behind. 

The only significant difference between the two is that coupling science is based on the laws of vibration, motion, and gravity and is accepted science.

Anyone can argue that absolute mechanical isolation and decoupling cannot exist in the presence of gravity.

Decoupling is a great advertising tool in the marketing gambit for repackaging and selling old stuff. 

The product designs and the packaging looks fancier today but still use coupling as their function regardless of storyboarding. The products sold long before the term ‘de-coupling’ hit the marketplace. The word decoupling has yet to gain scientific proof other than the Sound Industry’s love for marketing.

 

SOUND IS VIBRATION 

Killing vibration is stupidity. Eliminating it is impossible. Fearing it makes for sales expansion. Using it as a tool to improve sound reproduction makes more sense. 

We should rethink our minimalist understanding of vibration and realize we live in a world where everything vibrates! 

Thank you for your time. 

Robert Maicks

Sound Engineer, Vibration Management Consultant

 

Atmasphere,

You missed my point. 

Killing vibration is stupidity because you cannot destroy it. 

Manage it, yes, but vibration-forming resonance never goes away. Electricity vibrates causing the issues you deal with on a daily basis.

Did you ever try mechanical grounding all the key parts in your electronics design? It beats using damping compounds and provides livelier sound quality, but who am I to state this? 

Try mechanical grounding your amp chassis first and reduce the thermal operational temperature. The audible outcome will surprise you. I am more than happy to assist in any way we can.

You choose to use damping compounds. We use natural damping factors in the materials used to build our products. 

You are a manufacturer of electronics, we understand your reasoning and design philosophy. 

As a sound engineer, I look at vibration as music’s lifeblood. Quite a different point of view.

Resonance formed by vibrations is the issue we should be focused on.

Robert  

 

You are suggesting that springs, used in combination with dampers, are coupling devices?

Would you characterize shock absorbers, used on every car in the world, as coupling devices?

Hello, whipsaw,

Yes, the coupling is when any product comes in contact with the ground plane of the earth. This definition includes shock absorbers. 

I would prefer the conversation to stay within musical boundaries. In audio, outside sciences and principles and analogies are difficult to describe what it means for sound quality.

Here is a link to a patent of a "Vibration decoupling connection device", in which the word "decoupling" is used multiple times: 

Our Company Founding Fathers held multiple Patents. Our material science engineer holds a degree in Patent Law, so I am familiar with US and Global Patents. Patents, their writings, and the logic behind them are topics for a separate thread.

The device involving this Patent changes the frequency or converts energy into another form. Once the part adapts to a vehicle, the new mechanism is mechanically grounded or coupled to the Earth. 

I have the impression that you are playing semantic games, based on the suggestion that even the best designed springs/dampers are unable to completely decouple components from floors/racks, etc.    

I do not play games. Our company has designed equipment racks, studio environments, and other musical instrument parts.

Please NAME ONE PRODUCT that “completely decouples components from floors, racks, etc”. 

But there is no doubt whatsoever that, at least in the case of speakers, they can come far closer to decoupling than coupling devices such as spikes.

It is time we stop comparing everything out there to the expensive one-dollar ($1.00) spike and realize there is much more we can learn from our peers. How does a low-end part command comparison and remain the primary topic driving conversations in High-End Audio?

Are we stuck in the mud?

Robert

 

 

Can you provide examples of which firms do mechanical grounding Products?

Hello, jumia,

Not many of us have the patience and capability to apply the correct geometry and material science formulas for audio products. Unlike a spring, absorption puck, or damping wafer, these designs take a lot more research, development, and testing before becoming recognized by the public as a tell-all product.

Companies using mechanical grounding technologies are the minority compared to the isolation, decoupling, and energy absorption versions in today’s marketplace. 

When AudioGon opened for business, we announced the first equipment rack designed to vibrate. It took five years for people, the naysayers, and the press to use and recognize the technology we innovated. 

AudioGon had no moderators during those times. I was ridiculed, called stupid names, and took everything the members dished out. In my opinion, the High-End Audio Industry is hesitant to accept change or new advancements in technical achievements until there is advertising money involved.

We knew it was only time until the products would speak for themselves and lead the Company. Now, we are the oldest surviving vibration management company involved in audio.

Our Cello and Acoustic Bass End Pins took twenty years to develop and market. The first racks,  known as Sistrum Platforms, took ten years, and the Rhythm Platforms required fourteen years to advance performance. The Energy Room took twenty-five years to manufacture, and Live-Vibe’s first offering, the Audio Points™, took six years of testing, shaping, and beta listening. 

Goldmund is a European counterpart that uses mechanical grounding in all their electronics and speaker designs. They spent the time required to develop a highly respected line of products and show how mechanical grounding provides a higher sonic outcome.

Shun Mook was another of the earliest companies in this country to understand and adapt mechanical grounding techniques to their equipment offerings.

These are a few of the companies that adopt and expand mechanical grounding technologies. We are outnumbered in the isolation-decoupling department as there are hundreds of these to choose from.    

The term mechanical grounding, associated with parts and equipment chassis’ is another word for direct coupling.

Robert

 

You are indeed playing semantic games, and are clearly biased given that you have related products for sale. Also, please stop with the straw men.

That difference that can be very important, and your attempts to conflate them, presumably for marketing purposes, are obvious. 

Whipsaw,

All I did was answer your questions. Sorry if I offended you. 

I am here to show there is a superior methodology that exists in this industry and has for a very long time. We are capable of explaining more, having more experience, and seeing through the newfound world of decoupling products and their hundreds of manufacturers with their own stories. 

Add to that, we are willing to put our products to any test in your own home with your own system. There are no straw men in that offer.

We also have a right to use AudioGon for advertising or promotional purposes as we pay a monthly fee to their advertising programs. There are a host of dealers, manufacturers, and reviewers doing this on all forum-based businesses. Some of them hide behind the smoke and others come forth and admit it. Either way, marketing is like vibration, it is everywhere.

Send me pics of your room and system. I will tell you what I think and recommend items, not necessarily ours, that will improve your system. 

Robert

 

 

Robert, I find your continued dishonesty, coupled with arrogance, to be deeply off-putting.  

OK Whipsaw, 

If you have nothing for me on a technical or musical level, please write me off. 

You have attacked my honesty. That aggravates me to no end, so before I return the favor, this is for you. 

Permit me to defend myself. 

Do not reply using the shill response tactic because that will not affect me in any way whatsoever. 

I toured live sound as a FOH and Monitor engineer from 1973 through 1984 and worked with a lengthy list of the finest musicians and recording stars. Some have passed, and a few to date remain touring stadium venues. During that time, I also worked as a stage manager at the Roxy Theater and mixed music in a few of the finest recording studios in the USA.

Due to a back injury, my professional sound career was cut short, so I spent the next thirty-nine years in the High-End Audio business studying and working with vibration and resonance.

The first product, Audio Points was released for public consumption in 1988 and sold more than one million units two years ago. They are still selling, setting new sales records year in and year out. One would think hundreds of them would be for sale in the used market, so where are they?

Audio Points led us to manufacture variable-height wood shelving using threaded rods on equipment racking through the 90s. The next step was the Sistrum Platforms that sold from 2000 through 2014. As our technology advanced, the Sistrums were discontinued for the Rhythm Platforms that remain our current offerings.

We innovated the Brass End Pins for cello, bass clarinet, and acoustic bass are selling throughout the world.

The Energy Room. A first-of-its-kind product in the Audio Industry is posted on our website.

Now we are advancing the technology to new levels showing heat reduction and energy conservation. A single technology with many arms and all of them are proving positive.  

You are listed as a member since 2004. My guess is you did not take part in any of the earlier threads on AudioGon where I was one of the first to note ownership in a vibration management business.

There are many threads in the past where I provided listeners with differences in how things work. Max jumped up and down on the floor displaying his top-of-the-line product and comparing it to a few dollars worth of cheap spikes. Then there was the acoustic engineer with the aluminum cone and a tiny handheld music box stating our technology cannot work. How about the other company you believe to be a leader again comparing their top-end products with the one-dollar nail head spike? 

How far do you want me to go? There is more marketing versus science going on in the decoupling world. But you believe in their processes so continue with that knowledge, and I hope you reach your goals. 

My offer of placing our products in your system still stands. Why not let your ears decide?

Robert

 

You seem to be taking a negative view on isolation and absorption merchandise sold by audio enthusiasts. And then in your final section you say that vibration management tools makes sense as part of the sound reproduction process.

Hello, emergingsoul,

Sorry for taking so long to respond to your post. 

I have witnessed many parts and products that change the sound of a system. Anyone working in this Industry since the 80s has gone through the get-rich-quick schemes using everything imaginable. I can change the sound of your system with a box of chicken bones. I can kill the live dynamics using too much material. It is easy to change the sound of any system.

The 90s exposed vibration control to a state of this product is better than that mentality. Snake oil was the most descriptive term in our sector of the marketplace. 

Nowadays, everyone is a vibration expert. Even wire companies have so-called experts in the field. A few short years ago, there was only a handful of us, so I have a few personal issues with our industry. Marketing and storytelling are the primary ones.

We use vibration as a tool to increase dynamics and harmonic structures. The downside to vibration is many of them combine to form resonance. Resonance is like glue clogging, sticking to, and blocking signal strength. The reduction and evacuation of resonance as it develops, in real-time, allows for more signal increase and sound quality to emerge throughout the system.

Can you please clarify what you’re saying and provide examples of how someone would improvement to eliminate vibrations that are detrimental too good sound reproduction, which I’m sure exist somewhere. 

Vibration is sound. The initial pulses contain all the harmonic structures and live dynamics we seek as listeners to obtain and maintain in our systems. 

Vibrations that lack efficient mechanical grounding systems develop various amplitudes of resonance. Resonance builds layers and propagates on all smooth surfaces. It clogs all signal pathways from mechanical, electro-mechanical, and acoustic.

The focus is to transfer these resonance amplitudes at high speed to Earth’s grounding plane hence direct coupling. All energy seeks ground - physics class 101.

Resonance is the culprit in our understanding. 

Vibration is the musical lifeblood.

Components, speakers, and listening environments vibrate and always will. 

Electricity provides the energy that establishes vibration. There are vibrational properties in all power sources, electricity being the most used by audiophiles.

The room structure will continuously vibrate. Everything vibrates, so it does not matter where the vibrations come from. Every type of energy is in a constant state of vibration and motion.

Jumping up and down in a listening environment is physically induced, creating additional problems. These are not good for sound or audio analogies. If an audible deterrent does not exist, do not make one!

my subwoofer cabinet directly vibrates my floor which causes vibration noise from things on my shelf, an aluminum window frame, loose knickknacks, but if I put a squishy isolator disc thing between the feet of the subwoofer and the wooden floor it tends to absorb the sub cabinet vibrations and improve dispersion of pressure amplitudes more evenly throughout the room which is ideal for a sub.

Good Point:

I used foams, rubber, Sorbathanes, sands, and other primary absorbent materials when working in recording studios in the 70s. These materials will eat all energy and provide a deader lifeless sound quality. Establishing geometry and producing a formula for adaptations on musical instruments and other hi-fi products using these materials is impossible to implement. They eat harmonics, dynamics, and vibrations but end up sounding dead.

We can improve your listening situation. I financially guarantee our work and products. 

I will work with you to teach, recommend products, and improve your system via personal contact.

We have worked with thousands of listeners and audiophiles studying vibration management, researching principles, and advancing product innovation. Before I become labeled a shill, call me and allow me the time to advance your knowledge and understanding of sound and musical quality.

Resonance Energy Transfer is a highly reliable technology. 

Robert

 

Hello jumia, 

The system we use as a testing facility and musical reference system are located in Wisconsin. The Energy Room is open to anyone for an audition by appointment only.

https://www.audiogon.com/systems/8168

https://livevibeaudio.com/energy-rooms/

Our second system is located in Delaware. We are setting it up in an average environment for referencing a new product called Mechanical Panels™. These environmental sound devices were reverse-engineered from the Energy Room design to fit into any environment. They are much smaller in size versus acoustic panels and diffraction devices and command a larger surface area. Very wife friendly.

The electronics will be a modified Ayon Pre-Dac, Metronome Technologie, Star Sound amplification, various Sonoran and High Fidelity cables, Accentus Grand MK II speakers, and Rhythm Platforms.

We will also use a Bose Wave CD player atop a Rhythm Platform as an accompaniment for cost analysis and a secondary vintage system using an Onkyo Integra integrated amplifier and a Yamaha CD player with an Onkyo FM copper chassis tuner.

Robert

 

@ emergingsoul

Thanks for the advice. We will make an effort to do so. The equipment changes often. People who work here spend more time listening versus equipment setup, imaging, and marketing.

The Energy Room is open for auditions. Hearing the sound generated by the room is a rush. Since Covid, the traveling reviewer is not readily available. Reviewers want to take on new audio innovations, but a cloned acoustic environment has nothing to compare within the Industry. 

 

Anyone interested in reviewing their experience in an Energy Room, regardless of Industry affiliations, publications, or amateur-professional status, please telephone me. We will work on arranging your visit. 

 

@ mitch2

Ha-ha. One listening session and all your quotes, jokes, and puns would cease. Believe it or not!