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Vacuum Tubes - Chinese knock offs being sold as NOS?

Hello Audiogon,

So I was searching the ePay website for vacuum tube.  I came across 7 ... YES 7  adds for Mullard 12AT7 NOS CV4024 ECC81 M8162 - UK Military NEW UNOPENED GUARANTEED.

Evidence of foul play:

-  There are vendors all over the world (USA, Taiwan, Great Britain)

- The pictures listed in the all of the adds looks to be from the same source and are all white boxes (military style).

- The date codes on many of the tubes in the picture are the same 83-14.

- The picture of the big box the individual tube boxes come in looks to be the same picture in all of the adds, not to mention the cardboard of the outer box looks brand new.

- For the tubes shown removed from the box most are shown wrapped in thin packaging paper.  Strange that this paper is not yellowed at all as it would for 40+ year old tubes

- These tubes are RARE and expensive when for sale.  Funny to see no less than 7 adds for full boxes of "military tubes" at the same time.  To find a box full of 100s of these tubes would be the find of the century, and I am supposed to believe that 7 such boxes where found at places all over the world?

- I think the military style boxes were selected for the counterfeit as they are easier to fake than original factory boxes.

I have contacted a few sellers (not to buy but to ask why they are lying in their adds), I do not expect to hear back.

I initially was duped (did not purchase, but saved the initial add to my watch list until I saw the other adds pop up so frequently).  Hoping this helps spread awareness of this scam.

Thanks,

Dave

 

drawding

Showing 4 responses by dekay

dekay's avatar
dekay
5,365 posts
 

EBM:

Do you have a preference - Jeff or Akbar?

 

DeKay

dekay's avatar
dekay
5,365 posts
 

I understand your take/position, but if you only need a single you can purchase a properly tested Amperex/Holland one from Brent Jesse for $60, or so.

Purchased gobs of good tubes on Ebay 20 years ago (as well as loaded tube caddies locally) for close to ZIPPO, but those days are gone and past.

 

DeKay

dekay's avatar
dekay
5,365 posts
 

Petgo is most likely spot on.

The market was flooded with these starting around 2002/2003 with pics of huge master cases (both in individual white boxes and boxless).

I purchased 2 pairs from the UK (white boxes -w- black print/tubes wrapped in thin paper/black plastic wafer shaped pin protectors on the bottom).

Sound was awfully thin/bright driving 2A3's in my Bottlehead amps, but some liked them in different applications.

I gave them to others to try, but think that one pair was returned.

Mine were dated 1983 or 1984 (forget which) and the etched code was for the Mitchum (sp?) plant.

 

DeKay

dekay's avatar
dekay
5,365 posts
 

Dave:

What amp/preamp will you be using them in and what type of sound are you looking for?

If you are using the amp now - what tubes are in it?

I've mainly only used them to drive power tubes if HiFi amps and also to drive Fender reverb units, so won't have rec's for other spplications.

In my older Bottlehead power amps I swap the 12at7 (driver) depending upon what 2A3 power tubes I'm running (have 2 types of RCA, Visseaux and Ken- dual flat plates which all sound different from one another).

Spent an afternoon (long time ago) rolling power/driver/input tubes (EL84/EL34/12ax7/12at7) in a couple of Jolida amps and the same was true.

I also use 6201 variants of the 12at7, but don't know what the difference is - if any.

My go to for the extremely fat sounding Ken-Rad 2A3's are RFT's (a tube most people don't care for in;-).

For the much/much lighter sounding Visseaux I use RCA black plates with an odd wiggly shape @ the top of the plates.

For the gray and black plate RCA 2A3's I usually use RCA black or gray plates, but some have a squared off shape @ the top of the plates (think all are from the late 50's/early 60's as I as I started using them around 1963 in Fender amps).

I've also used Amperex/Holland 60's production in place of the RCA's, but my tube storage cabinet is currently blocked by stuff I'm not up to moving - so can't check the details on them.

Have various Telefunken/Mullard/Siemens/GE/Sylvania et cetera on hand, but they were not my favorites and ended up being stored away.

 

DeKay

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