Tube amp recommendation

Hi Jax2, my point has to do with equipment matching. An SET driving a 92 db speaker is going to get clipped a lot if you listen to demanding musical passages. On a speaker like that, you would need a lot more power- 60 to 100 watts, in order to get to appropriate levels. There are not a lot of SETs that can do that, and IMO those that do don't sound very good. Lower power SETs really require a speaker 10 db more efficient than the ones you have/had; then you can play hip hop on them all day, but don't expect a lot of bass with a speaker that is that efficient! That's why those speakers we had at T.H.E. Show are such a nice deal, though they are anything but cheap :)

IOW if an amplifier is good, its good for any kind of music, perhaps a qualifier is needed- as long as it is being used with a speaker that matches that amplifier (whatever it is) properly. So I am saying that such an amp will play classical as well as any rock. The amp does not care what someone's taste is- its all electronic signals to an amp :)

To Raquel's comment about output transformers- I agree that better, more expensive transformers will do a better job with the bass on 4 ohms, but such an amplifier will still sound better on a speaker that is 8 ohms or more all other thing being equal. That comment I made about impedance relates to all amplifiers, even transistors, so long as sound quality is the goal. IMO, as soon as 4 ohms comes up, sound quality is no longer the goal. At that point its all about the amp being somehow more brutal or something. My experience with high end audio is that it is all about sound quality and to get that you need higher impedance speakers, regardless of the amplifier technology.

I want to second Ralph's comments about higher impedence speakers lending themselves to better sound quality, if only because they can be driven by low or no feedback amplifiers. Absolutes are a dangerous thing in audio, but my experience is that negative feedback, which is present in virtually all high-powered solid-state amps (and too many tube amps - hello Audio Research), is the single most deleterious design feature in high-end amplification. So why do amp designers use it? Because most speaker designers emphasize linear frequency response, which means they have to dampen down the efficiency of driver cones so that a given cone puts out even volume throughout the driver's bandwidth. This means a lot of 86 db. efficient speakers (and a "laid-back", as opposed to "live-band" sound), which require an amp that can put out some serious watts. As soon as you start to get north of 125-150 watts/channel, you need negative feedback in order to have a stable amplification circuit. The result is the lifeless, uninvolving sound that you get with big solid-state amps and 86 db. efficient speakers. Compared to that, Ralph's OTL zero-feedback triode amps paired with good horns or with a very high-end, easy-to-drive speaker like the Escalante Fremont provides extremely dynamic, open and vibrant sound that is much closer to live.

Hi and thanks for all of the responses. I haven't been able to reply until now since I had a few meetings to attend and a snow storm to deal with. I will look at the various recommendations (particularly the car, sonic frontiers and the jolida)

As for the various questions...

Speakers... I have an old set of 8 ohm speakers that claim to have 90 db sensitivity. However, I have been looking at various things lately.

My Goal... quality watts not a quantity of watts

Budget... 1000-1400 or so (spending less is ok as well). I like my music, but want to keep a limit because of the current economic climate.

Style... I should have said integrated in my first post

I have been looking at various jolida products and then I saw this
posting (particularly the third photo) and started to wonder if I had to calibrate the bias each time I wanted to do some 'chillaxin'.

Thanks again.

In your price range, for a tube integrated you're probably going to do best with something used from China (Jolida, Prima Luna. Sophia, Cayin, Mysterie, among others). The Jolida 102B you are interested in requires manual biasing (a simple monthly task with a digital volt meter). Most af the Jolidas require a manual bias while other options, like Prima Luna, may have an auto-bias circuit. The 102b only puts out about 20 watts which may be a bit low for 90db at 8ohms depending on the size of room, type of music and typical level you listen at. Generally I'd be looking for 40-60 tube watts if I were you (Jolida 302B or 502B would do). If you'll be looking for new speakers too then you can better tailor the selection of both.

Hi Jax2, my point has to do with equipment matching. An SET driving a 92 db speaker is going to get clipped a lot if you listen to demanding musical passages. On a speaker like that, you would need a lot more power- 60 to 100 watts, in order to get to appropriate levels. There are not a lot of SETs that can do that, and IMO those that do don't sound very good. Lower power SETs really require a speaker 10 db more efficient than the ones you have/had; then you can play hip hop on them all day, but don't expect a lot of bass with a speaker that is that efficient! That's why those speakers we had at T.H.E. Show are such a nice deal, though they are anything but cheap :)

I would love to have a pair of John's speakers, but alas, not only is it not in the card$ at the moment, but I'm also dealing with a smallish listening space in my home. The WAF would negate anything the size of a dishwasher or larger. My wife used to call my LaScalas, "The Dishwashers". I used those at work and they were highly modified, and yes, they certainly could do more with demanding music...but I still prefer my current nearfield setup. It is pretty rare that I can hear it strain. There are only two tracks I can think of, and I know exactly where they will tax the system, and just in the bass. Otherwise I do not hear it clipping at all (unless I'm missing something - I don't think so because Peter's observed the same thing, as has my other Nervosa inflicted friend). That said, I'm sitting 8 feet from my speakers which are only 2.5 feet from the back wall.

IOW if an amplifier is good, its good for any kind of music, perhaps a qualifier is needed- as long as it is being used with a speaker that matches that amplifier (whatever it is) properly. So I am saying that such an amp will play classical as well as any rock. The amp does not care what someone's taste is- its all electronic signals to an amp :)

I think I get what you're saying here. I completely agree about speaker matching with amps. I don't know that what I think you are getting at overall is how I experience two contrasting amps though. Maybe I'm just delusional. As I said, my SET amps (still have'em) can play rock just fine...enjoyable even...I just think it's more enjoyable on some SS amps I've tried, for instance. Whereas something more stark and simple sounds much better on my SET amps (to me). The illusion of space, presence and realism is far more effective to me with the SET option. That illusion is there to a great degree when playing more challenging, more dense music, rock say, but it occurs to me as more congested than when that same dense is played on a good SS amp in the same system and space. By your definition of a 'good amp' both the SET and SS amps I've used in this space need not apply. It may be all electronic signals to an amp, but it's not that at all to any of us who are listening to the music. We put all kinds of meaning into just how those electronic signals are translated into music. I digress........